increasing shruthi - need help

shishya · Post by **shishya** » 29 Aug 2009, 01:29

Hi everyone,

I have a couple of students who want to try singing in a 1/2 kattai shruthi above what their normal shruthi. They really seem to be straining at the tara-sthayi shadjamam and personally I think they would be doing more damage to their vocal chords than good (in terms of stretching the muscle). I have given about 4-5 months for this "experiment" and their voice has not yet stabilized in the half kattai higher shruthi. I was wondering if the learned company could provide any insights about :

1. What is the reason kids may want to try a higher shruthi (I think it is just glamorous for them- I may be completely wrong)
2. How beneficial/detrimental is it to stretch the voice so that even after 4-5 months of practice, it sounds strained at the tara sthayi shadjamam? By practice, I am guessing they are singing about 2 hours per week in addition to the 1 hr class.
3. What is the best explanation to give to kids to discourage them from doing so and to encourage them to stick to their normal shruthi that their voice sounds best in.
4.Was/is anybody else in this situation? If yes, I would like to know how you handled /are handling this issue
5. My plan is to tell them to keep practicing at the lower shruthi and then inch it by 1/4 kattai after they can hold at tara sthayi gandharam for a sustained amount of time without fatigue. Is there a different /better solution to this issue?

VK RAMAN · Post by **VK RAMAN** » 29 Aug 2009, 02:37

This may be the case of all the singers who start out at a higher sruthi and then settle down to a lower sruthi - let the professional singers give their take

mohan · Post by **mohan** » 29 Aug 2009, 11:42

What sruthi are we talking about? Is it 5.5 or more? I would recommend that if they can they should sing in higher sruthi because as they get older, it will probably drop anyway.

The initial sruthi should be chosen by asking the the student to sing in the range from the lower Pa to the upper Pa. If they can reach the upper Pa easily then you can try and increase it. Let them sing in the sruthi they are comfortable with. Over time and with upper sthayi practice, they might be able to increase the sruthi.

shishya · Post by **shishya** » 29 Aug 2009, 19:33

Mohan,
looks like you and I are talking about the same thing from different angles. One is comfortable at 5 but has tried 5.5 and the other is comfortable at 6 but has tried 6.5 for 4-5 months and both still haven't settled down at the upper S, which is telling me that they need to push their limits gradually. My rule of thumb was - endurance test at taara sthayi gandharam.

What you say about shruthi dropping as they age is true but I think how much it drops depends on the voice Saareeram and how regularly they practice as they age. My concern at this stage is that they may be going against the nature of their voice too fast and then damage their vocal cords.

knandago2001 · Post by **knandago2001** » 29 Aug 2009, 22:03

docspeak on why the voice should not be strained - never
http://www.healthscout.com/ency/68/86/main.html

knandago2001 · Post by **knandago2001** » 29 Aug 2009, 22:09

worth thinking about as an adjunct to
http://www.lessonplanspage.com/MusicInt ... oice39.htm

"naabhi hrut kantha rasana... aaa.. eee.. ooo etc.,"

Ahiri · Post by **Ahiri** » 30 Aug 2009, 19:28

Singing hechchu sthayi varisai and mandra sthayi varisai in slow kaalam helped me a lot.
My Guru also says the more you practise mandrasthayi the higher you can reach.

vasanthakokilam · Post by **vasanthakokilam** » 30 Aug 2009, 22:23

Nandagopal: Those two are excellent links. Good information. Thanks. It looks like even without straining the voice, just any career that requires use the voice a lot can cause those vocal chord problems to develop, not to mention what happens when the vocal chords are strained beyond normal both on the higher or local octaves. Yes, whispering and lower octave singing a lot seem to be bad as well, if done in excess, though it may be counter-intuitive.

ganesh_mourthy · Post by **ganesh_mourthy** » 31 Aug 2009, 21:08

I think the conventional wisdom is, the higher the pitch the more sweet it is . this is greatly influenced by the light music singing. Indeed it is beautiful. But I consider them to be differently beautiful.

but this is not the case with male students as they dont try to increase the shruti like women strain. it is rare.

watch these two following videos and you would understand why high pitched voices easily influence the mass.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l2AEpJvpICE

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TDGOyO9eYCw

listen to this beautiful carnatic piece again a high pitched voice.. My most favourite carnatic female voices.

http://rapidshare.com/files/273358823/h ... a.mp3.html

vasanthakokilam · Post by **vasanthakokilam** » 31 Aug 2009, 22:00

g_m, interesting theory and may be true for a lot of people but I personally find those really high pitched voices in film music quite jarring. The pitch choice is influenced by male-female duet requirements as well.

Nick H · Post by **Nick H** » 31 Aug 2009, 23:45

Me too, VK. When I first heard it I found it sort-of charming; I now find it irritating!

I was going to suggest that, if the students were female, it may be because they are taken with this sugar-sweet North-Indian/film-music little-girl voice.

I don't know what to suggest... tell them that too much sugar rots the teeth?

(and that high-pitch voices are fine for twelve-year-olds, but not for grown ups).

(with respect to those artists who naturally sing at that pitch and always have done. One of my favourite artist sings at 5.5, I think, but she never sounds shrill)

ganesh_mourthy · Post by **ganesh_mourthy** » 01 Sep 2009, 07:45

nick , just listen to that last piece by radha and jayalakshmi. I love their voice for their voice control and clarity. And of course when you go higher the voice gets shrill. Is that not science. Even balamurali shrills.yesudoss shrills.

ganesh_mourthy · Post by **ganesh_mourthy** » 02 Sep 2009, 09:49

http://rapidshare.com/files/274542425/0 ... 9.mp3.html

listen to this and let me know if this jarring too.