Carnatic Music Using KeyBoard

mohan · Post by **mohan** » 22 Aug 2008, 14:06

Portamento is a function on high end synthesizers that create a natural glide between two keys which are pressed. There are usually parameters that enable the setting of the speed of the glide as well.

The pitch bender is a lever on keyboards/synthesizers that control the pitch. When a note is held down and the the pitch bender is moved upwards (or to the right on some keyboards) then pitch of the note is increased according to the the degree of bending the lever. The total range of the pitch bender can be set. So for example if set to 2 and Sa is played and the pitch bender is moved full up then the note will glide up to Ri2. If set to 12, then the note will glide one octave to the upper Sa.

By moving the lever up and down kamphitam gamakas can be created. However, a lot of control is required to make this effective

The use of portamento and pitch bends are the key methods of emulating gamakas on a keyboard. For these effects to use, a suitable sound also has to be chosen as not all types of sounds will be suited to these effects.

ganesh_mourthy · Post by **ganesh_mourthy** » 22 Aug 2008, 16:52

can that be assigned to each and every note or is that adjustment throughout as a default to all notes and only gives a particular gamakam. Say for instance , for a particular note you may want to go one note up like from Ni to Sa and for another note you want to slide up to 3 notes up like the gamaka Sa ma ri ma in HIndola. you have to do the adjustment for all the raagams ????

mohan · Post by **mohan** » 22 Aug 2008, 18:15

Portamento will apply automatically to all notes when one note is held down and another is played.

For the pitch bender you can set the range to say Sa to Pa and then move the lever around half way for Sa to Ga, slightly more for Sa to Ma, etc.

ganesh_mourthy · Post by **ganesh_mourthy** » 22 Aug 2008, 21:57

Ok mohan . so this has to be set according to the raaga the artiste wants to perform and probably need deft hands to handle it ?

vasanthakokilam · Post by **vasanthakokilam** » 22 Aug 2008, 22:54

mohan wrote:I recently have started using a new synthesizer (Roland Fantom G6) and I think the sound it can produce is very suitable for Carnatic music.

I used it in a recently concert to accompany my wife. You can hear a sample here: http://rapidshare.com/files/132826475/0 ... -_kapi.MP3

Good job. I especially liked the real low octave production of kApi.

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 23 Aug 2008, 00:10

I agree the Kapi is quite smooth. The only problem I see is in the sustaining of the glide. Pitchbend cannot stop and sustain at a particular stage. Is there any trick for producing a kampita gamakam ?

mohan · Post by **mohan** » 23 Aug 2008, 12:00

ganesh_mourthy wrote:Ok mohan . so this has to be set according to the raaga the artiste wants to perform and probably need deft hands to handle it ?

Yes - exactly. I guess practice will make perfect.

mohan · Post by **mohan** » 23 Aug 2008, 12:04

cmlover wrote:The only problem I see is in the sustaining of the glide. Pitchbend cannot stop and sustain at a particular stage. ?

It depends on what instrument tone is chosen. Most instruments like veena cannot sustain a single note forever once a string is plucked or pulled .

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 23 Aug 2008, 22:05

Agreed. But the wind instruments like the Flute can. However the simulated Flute in the keyboards is no match for the real ones!
What was your instrument setting for the Kapi?

mohan · Post by **mohan** » 24 Aug 2008, 05:58

The flutes are good but they are usually Western metallic flutes. I am waiting for Roland or Korg to release decent venu tones.

I used a tone called Jazz Guitar which sounds somewhat like an electric mandolin. I have modified it to play two octaves simultaneously.

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 24 Aug 2008, 07:20

Try Ocarina if available. It will sound somewhat closer to a flute (remotely

. The jazz guitar is quite good in spite of its artificiality.
Post some more of your efforts if posiible.
(It is a pleasure to listen to sangita!)

blackadder · Post by **blackadder** » 25 Aug 2008, 09:38

Mohan:

Let me see if I have understood this correctly. If I have set the range from Sa to Pa and I play Sa and push the bender to the limit, I will hear Pa. If I play Sa and push the bender half-way, I will hear Ga2. Is that correct?

There are usually parameters that enable the setting of the speed of the glide as well.

What about the path of the glide? Is there a way to set that too?

Sorry if I sound stupid - that is because I probably am.

mohan · Post by **mohan** » 25 Aug 2008, 11:49

blackadder - in your first example (using the pitch bender), you will hear the tone transitioning from Sa to Pa and eventually you will hear the Pa.

The parameters for setting the speed of the glide are for portamento (not the bender). You can't set the path of the glide. Portamento works like this: press and hold down Sa - then also press Ma before releasing the Sa. The sound will automatically glide from Sa to Ma with the speed determined by the portamento rate parameter. The path is directly from Sa to Ma.

Hope that is clear.

mohan · Post by **mohan** » 26 Aug 2008, 06:24

Mods I think Arun's thread can be moved to the Fusion thread at http://www.rasikas.org/forums/viewtopic.php?id=760

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 26 Aug 2008, 07:39

Done!

blackadder · Post by **blackadder** » 26 Aug 2008, 11:51

Thanks, Mohan. I think I understand now.

I think Sathyanarayanan's father was participating in this thread. Can he throw some light on the pitch bender and its usage?

tkb · Post by **tkb** » 28 Aug 2008, 16:55

blackadder,

Mohan is a seasoned artist on keyboard and i am not sure if Sathya can add more thoughts in this. However i will check with him and post his observation on pitch bender and portamento.

I also would request active participants of this thread to probably take time, if possible, to listen to Sathya's tracks in www.sangeethamshare.org/sathya and may be give opinion for him to try and improve.

Also if any one is based in Chennai please try and make it for the concert today at Sri Rama Samaj, Ayodhya Mandapam, West mambalam today from 7 - 9pm.

blackadder · Post by **blackadder** » 01 Sep 2008, 13:44

tkb, thanks for the message.

I brought up your name (and Sathya's) since Mohan said that he uses portamento whereas Sathya uses the pitch bender.

Whenever all of you can find time, please post.

tkb · Post by **tkb** » 01 Sep 2008, 18:37

Here is the note from Sathya:

He feels Mr Mohan is perfect in all his explanations with regard to the pitchbender and portamento. He also feels that these settings will vary from person to person as per their handling and it is the control over the pitchbender and the range chosen in the portamento which brings out the gamakas at its best. Co-ordination between these two i believe is very important.

tkb · Post by **tkb** » 01 Sep 2008, 20:07

I am pleased to give a link of Sathya's efforts on a ragamalika with Thirupavai he performed on the 19th Aug'08 at Rajapalayam. I thought this will give an idea of how Sathya uses both pitchbender and portemento, which topic is being dealt here. He attempts to play four ragas namely Sankarabaranam, Saveri, Bhairavi and Kalyani followed by 4 Thirupavais.

http://sangeethamshare.org/sathya/018_T ... japalayam/

Looking forward to your valuable opinion.

Sam Swaminathan · Post by **Sam Swaminathan** » 02 Sep 2008, 08:05

I heard Sathya play some 4 years ago in a hall near old safire theater ( i forget the name). There is a HUGE improvement to what I heard then and what I am hearing now. So much maturity and some sure footed playing, indeed. May Shirdi Sai give him more and more of knowledge and success in his future. Blessings.

tkb · Post by **tkb** » 02 Sep 2008, 13:45

Dear Sam Swaminathan

I think you have attended the one held in Rani Seethai Hall under "Kalarasana". Thanks for sparing your valuable time to listen to the link and giving your feedback & valuable blessings to Sathya.

TKB

blackadder · Post by **blackadder** » 05 Sep 2008, 15:03

tkb, thanks for the post and the link. I was away from a computer (thankfully) for a few days and hence the delayed response. I will listen to the link in the next day or two and come back with - you guessed it!!! - more questions.

tkb · Post by **tkb** » 08 Sep 2008, 21:40

blackadder,

Thanks for the reply and looking forward to your questions!

I sincerely would appreciate any one who can spare time to listen to the tracks and forward comments. I am sure for the questions asked in this thread there could be some attempts for an answer on performance by Sathya. If its on the +ve side its good for him and if its -ve it is even more good as he can improve on the areas of concern.

tkb · Post by **tkb** » 23 Sep 2008, 23:22

Dear Sri Haribabu,

Thanks for the wishes and hope your son is also doing good on his violin. My wishes to him and rgds to your family.

tkb · Post by **tkb** » 24 Sep 2008, 22:47

Yes sir. We look forward to your info on the same. Wishing Vinay a very Happy Birthday.

Rgds