Dr. Shrikaanth K Murthy

kiransurya · Post by **kiransurya** » 26 Mar 2006, 00:28

If Iam not too curious, is a match under making here?

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 26 Mar 2006, 01:22

Oh kiran!
If you have not been following too closely, the matches have been well made and brightly lit!

hari sharaNa shrIkAnta kavi bhAratI
vasatu h^Ridi yuvatiriva saha naH |
(just a (mis)quote from Jayadeva

)
(Do you really need a translation

)

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 26 Mar 2006, 02:17

Just noticed that the 'lecdem' has been d/led 25 times in comparison with the song itself (17 times)! It shows how much our Rasikas are after 'information'. DRS is doing a great service on both counts. I only hope that more of 'you' pitch-in at the discussions. Also on technical issues we need not overload DRS but those who have information can share them without hesitations. If htere are errors it will be corrected so that our understanding of CM gets enhanced. Most of these subtle points are not available in books nor are they known to the average 'teachers' of CM! Feel free to raise knotty (or even contentious) issues preferrably at the technical section! Let us make this Forum a 'college for CM' with your global inputs! Thanks

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 26 Mar 2006, 03:31

sthaLapurANa of SrI kShEtra subrahmaNya

The demon tArakAsura was conferred a boon by Gods that he would not die in the hands of anyone except a 7 day old infant. Following this he became intoxicated with his power and began disturbing all penances and good deeds.

Now the dEvas thought of approaching Siva who was deep in penance.
Then they decided that only manmatha could effectively wake ISvara. Although manmatha died in the process, he successfully woke ISvara from his penance. ISvara married pArvati. kumAra was born and slayed tAraka on the 7th day after his brith.

The war is reported to have taken place near kukke subrahmaNya. After
slaying tAraka, kumAra washed his weapons in the kumAradhAre river and had a bath to get over his fatigue. Upon the request of all, he agreed and stayed in the sthaLa itself to grace his devotees. brahma is said to have installed and consecrated the deity of the temple.

In the sanctum sanctorum, He is enshrined seated on a peacock. The sanctum is full of anthills, the mud(mRttike) from which is offered as prasAda as it is known to have medicinal properties that cure various diseases and ailments including vitiligo and leprosy.

Legend has it that once garuDa was chasing vAsuki and trying to devour him. Sage kaSyapa intervened and told vAsuki to go and take up residence in kukke and pray to Lord Siva. He was also told that
kArtikEya wold later slay tARaka and be worshipped here. As prophesied, kArtikEya slayed tAraka, married dEvasEne, the daughter of indra and took residence here. Thus vAsuki is worshipped alongside subrahmaNya and the latter accepts all worship through the former.

In the trEtAyuga, paraSurAma cama and took a holy dip in the kumAradhAre to absolve himself of the sin of decimating kShatriyas. And in the dvAparayuga, sAmba(Son of kRShNa) bathed in the river and
smeared his body with the mud from the river bank to be cured of leprosy that was ailing him as a result of a curse.

kukke is so called as it is the place of the revered kukke linga. It is believed that a basketful of lingas was found here and worshipped in the basket itself before the shrine to kukke linga was built. kukke in kannaDa means basket.

Sri Subrahmanya kshetra has been brilliantly described in the Sahyadrikhanda of Skanda Purana. In the "Sankara Vijaya", Anandagiri records that SankarAcArya camped here for a few days during his religious expedition(Digvijaya). SankarAchArya referred to this place as 'bhajEe Kukke lingam' in his 'Subrahmanya Bhujangaprayata Stotram'.

Several holy days and festivals are celebrated with great devotion and gaiety here. Among these, the lakSha dIpOtsava ( festival of 1 lakh lights) is celebrated on the day of kArtika bahuLa amAvAsya.

kiransurya · Post by **kiransurya** » 26 Mar 2006, 06:33

DRS, CML
I have got a doubt here. Its a bit unsituational and going to cause a sideline, Iam going to shoot it anyway.

CML was asking about M1, M2 and their chances of causing Vivadithva of raagas. You gave a very clear explanation. Now the question is, How diff is a chyutha madhyama and panchama concept on the sruthi scale from normal M1/M2 and Pa respectively? How siginificant is their presence in the raagas like Kalyani and Varaali that employ them?

I hope I am not gibbering in here

and I hope not to disturb the flow.

CML!!!
I got the message clearly. My age doesnt permit me to bless the couple. My best wishes for them though...

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 26 Mar 2006, 20:42

Word to word meaning for rakkaNe gaida kumArage
rAGa- saurasEna; rUpaka tALa

rakkaNe- protection; gaida-done; kumArage- to kumAra;
lakSha- 1lakh(100,000); dIpagaLa OLi- row of lights

tekke- winding/coiled; sarpa- snake; rUpadindu- in the form of;
divya- divine; saurasEne- divine army/army of suras; tandu- brought;
kukkeyalli- in the kukke kShEtra; nitya- dadily/always; nindu- residing;
kumAradhAreyali- in kumAradhAre; mindu- taking a bath.

uttama gangeyali- in the excellent gangA; janisi- taking birth;
kRttikeyaru beLasidavage- To Him brought up by the kRttikA maidens;
mRttike- holy mud;ittu- giving; kuShTAdi- leprosy, vitiligo etc;
kuttagaLanu kaLedavage- To Him Who removed all ailments/sins/flaws;
jattaka- vile/deceitful; tArakana konda- Who killed tAraka;
Sakti vEla taLedavage- Him Who bore the Sakti and the vElAyudha(or the powerful vElAyudha);
gattina- proud/showy; navilEri- mounting the peacock;
SrIkAntana mana seLedavage- Him Who drew/attracted the mind of SrIkAnta.

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 27 Mar 2006, 01:06

Thanks for that elaborate sthalapurana. Is this place close to the 'SubrahmaNya' forest region that is riddled with deadly snakes? The reference to AcArya's subramaNya bhujangam is enlightening.

Sahana has done a great job with a magnificent tristhaayi aalaapana and the song is very sprightly which comes to vivid life with your 'word for word' explanations. I still do not know to distinguish saurasena from sarasangi though I am not to familiar with sarasangi too! I do get the strong feel for cArukEsi due to the proximity but the overall feeling is distinctly different. I look forward to your scholarly expositions.

Please post the notes since this song/notes appear straight forward to be played on the instruments and even easy to perform vocally for one who has voice skills (but not too greedy to catch up with Sahana

)

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 27 Mar 2006, 01:10

Running meaning to rakkaNe gaida

Row of a hundred thousand lamps to the kumAra Who protected us all!

Him in the form of a coiled snake, Who brought with Him the divine army, took up residence in kukke and took a dip in the kumAradhAre!

Him born in the holy ganga and brought up by the kRttikA maidens!
Him Who gives the holy mRttike and removes all ailments and blemishes such as leprosy, vitiligo!
That slayer of the deceitful and wicked tAraka, Who bears the Sakti and vElAyudha!
Him Who mounted the proud and showy peacock and drew the mind of SrIkAnta.

A lakh lamps to Him!

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 27 Mar 2006, 01:17

CML
It looks like everyone leaves it to you to post thoughts, observations and comments about what I post. If you are busy, then I am left hight and dry.

As for subrahmaNya bhujangam, the version I have does not have "bhajE kukke lingam". Jut in case, I also tried the Siva bhujangam. Can someone else please post the relevant part with thee "bhajE kukke lingam".

subrahmaNYa is about a 100KMs from Mangalore. You are right about the thick forests.Did you say this is your family deity(are you talking of muruga or specifically of kukke subrahmaNya)?

Before I forget, I posted this kRti to coincide with the sarasAngi kRti in the oDeyar thread.

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 27 Mar 2006, 01:45

DRS

It is inevitable that our traffic will now decrease. Only truly interested will be visiting and participating in discussions. Gold-diggers are out! We have the liberty to discuss without distractions

We need your demonstration skills now all the more to fully understand your compositions. Also we can focus more on specifics (sahitya and charateristics) than on extraneous factors. I do hope some 'vocalist' joins us here and starts rendering your compositions for a change without fear or favour for us to get a different perspective

Our family deity is SubrahmaNya and this is the first time I hear about kukke but I have heard of some kShEtra from where the pit mud is used to ward off Leprosy (and other skin diseases ( I have to alert my other son who is a dermatologist about the potential

).

What is the significance of the LakSha deepam in this context?

vasanthakokilam · Post by **vasanthakokilam** » 27 Mar 2006, 01:57

DRS, I do not have much intelligent observations to add though I do intently read what you write, the meanings of your compositions and the sthalapurAnA and the purAnA associated with the sAhitya. And I do enjoy the 'conversation' on these matters between CML and you as well!!

As a coincidence, I just happened to read last night the meaning of the MD krithi Subramanyaya Namaste ( kambhoji ) as given by Shri Shankarachariyar ( periaval ) to ARI in another thread here. He mentioned subrahmaNYa as a place and also the mythological relationship of subrahmaNYa to snakes.

kiransurya · Post by **kiransurya** » 27 Mar 2006, 02:03

DRS/CML

I have Subramanya Bhujangam with me( a hard copy) It doesnt say anything called Bhaje Kukke Lingam anywhere in the sthothram(at least the one I have) I guess that u are referring to the stotram written by Sri Adi Sankaracharya...
If thats the one, I thought It was written in reference to Subramanya at Tiruchendur(tiruchendanur-I dont know how pronounce/spell it)

I dont want to fill the forum with unnecessary quotes. Wonder if this stotra on Sri Subramanya is of any use in this context.. DRS BTW, things that you and CML discuss here are more informative and enriching. They are far too complex to discuss for someone(me) with a background like mine(If you see what I mean ), I better learn them off you.....

sadA bAlaroopApi vighnAdhi hanthri, mahAdanthi vaktrApi panchAsyamAnyA
vidheendhrAdhi mrigyA gaNeshAbhidhAme, vidhatthAm shriyam kApi kalyANamurthi

na jAnAmi padhyam, na jAnAmi gadhyam, na jAnAmi shabdam, na jAnAmi chArttham
chidekA shadAsyA hridhi dhyothathe me, mukhAnis saranthe giraschApi chitram

mayUrAdhiroodam mahAvAkyagUdam manohArideham mahachittageham
mahIdevadevam mahavedabhAvam mahadevabAlam bhaje lokapAlam

yadhA sannidhAnam gathA mAnavA me, bhavAm bodhipAram gathAsthe thadhaiva
ithi vyanjayan sindhutheere ya aaste, thameede pavitram parAshaktiputram

yathAbdhes tharangA layam yAnthi thungA, thatthaivA padha sannidhou sevyamAne
itheevormi panktheer nrinAm darshayantham, sadA bhAvaye hrithsaroje guham tham

girou mannivAse narA yedhi rUdA, thadhA parvathe rAjathe thedhirUdA
itheeva bruvan gandha shailAdhirUdah, sadevo mudhe me sadA shanmukhostu

mahAmbodhitheere mahApApachore, muneendrAnukoole sugandhAkhya shaile
guhAyAm vasantham svabhAsA lasantham, janArthim harantham shrayAmo guham tham

lasat swarna gehai nrinAm kAmadohe, sumasthoma sanchanna mANikya manche
samudyath sahasrArka thulyaprakAsham, sadA bhAvaye kArtikeyam suresham

raNat hamsake manjuleth yanthashoNe, manohAri lAvaNya peeyusha poorNe
manash-shatpadho me bhava klesha taptha, sadA modathAm skanda te pAda padme

suvarnAbha divyAm barodh bhAsa mAnam, kvaNath kinkiNi mekhalA shobha mAnam lasad dhemapattena vidhyotha mAnam, katim bhAvaye Skanda te deepya mAnam

pulindesha kanyA ghanA bhoga thunga, sthanA linganA saktha kAshmeera rAgam
namasyAmyaham tArakAre tavorah, svabhaktA vane sarvadA sAnurAgam

vidhou kluptha dhandAn svaleelA dhri thAndAn, nirasthebha shundAn dvishath kAladhandAn
hathendhrAri shandAn jagatrAna shoundAn, sadA te prachandAn shraye bAhu dhandAn

sadA shAradA shan mrugAngkA yadhisyu, samudyantha eva stthithAsh cheth samanthAth
sadApoorna bimbA kalankaishcha heenA, tadA tvan mukhAnAm bruve Skanda sAmyam

sphuran mandahAsai sahamsAni chanchath, katAkshA valeebhringa sanghojvalAni
sudhAsyandhi bimbA dharANi shasoono, tavA lokaye shanmukhAm bhoruhANi

vishAleshu karNAntha dheergesh vajasram, dayAs yandhishu dvAdha shas veekshaNeshu
mayeeshath katAkshas sakruth pAthi tashcheth, bhavethe dayAsheela kA nAma hAni

suthAngodhbhavo mesi jeevethi shad dhA, japanmantra meesho mudhA jigrathe yAn
jagad bhAra bhridbhyo jagannAtha thebhya, kireeto jvalebhyo namo mastakebhya

sphuradh ratna keyoora hArAbhi rAma, chalath kuNdala shri-lasadh kandabhAga
katou peethavAsA kare chArushakti, purasthAn ma mAsthAm purAres thanooja

ihAyAhi vatsethi hasthAn prasArya, aah-vayath-yAdha-rAch-shankare mAthu rankAth
samuthpathya thAtham shrayantham kumAram, harAshlishta gAthram bhaje bAlamoorthim

kumAresha soono Guhaskanda senA, pathe shaktipAne mayUrAdhirUda
pulindhAthmajA kAntha bhakthArthi hArin, prabho tArakAre sadA raksha mAm tvam

prashAn thendriye nashta samngnye vicheshte, kaphod kArivaktre bhayoth kampi gAthre
prayANon mukhe mayyanAthe thadhAneem, drutham me dhayALo bhavAgre guham tham

krithAn thasya dhooteshu chandeshu kopAth, daha chindhi bhindheethi mAm tharja yatsu
mayUram samAruhya mAbhairi thitvam, purash shakti pAnir mamAyAhi sheegram

praNam yAsa kruth pAda yosthe pathitvA, prasAdya prabho prArthaye (a)nekavAram
na vaktum kshamoham thadhAneem krupApdhe, na kAryAnthakAle manA gapyu pekshA

sahasrAnda bhokthA tvayA ShooranAmA, hathas tArakas simhavaktrascha dhaitya
mamAnthar hridhistham manaklesha mekam, na hamsi prabho kim karomi kva yAmi

aham sarvadA dukkha bhArA vasanno, bhavAn deenabandhus tva dhanyam na yAche
bhavadh bhaktirodham sadA kluptha bAdham, mamAdhim drutham nAsha yo mAsuta tvam

apasmAra kushta kshayArsha prameha, jvaronmAdha gulmAdhi rogA mahAntha
pishAchAshcha sarve bhavatpatra bhoothim, vilokya kshanAth tArakAre dravanthe

drishi skandamoorthih shrutou skandakeerthih, mukhe me pavitram sadA tach- charitram
kare tasya krityam vapus tasya bhrutyam, guhe santu leenA mamA shesha bhAvA

muneenA muthAho nriNAm bhakti bhAjAm, abheeshta pradhA santhi sarvatra devA
nriNA manthya jAnAm api svArtha dhAne, guhA devam anyam najAne najAne

kaLathram suthA bandhuvarga pashurvA, naro vAtha nAree gruhe ye madheeyA
yajantho namanthah stuvantho bhavantham, smaran thascha te santu sarve kumAra

mrigA pakshiNo dhamshakA ye cha dushtAs, tathA vyAdhayo bhAdha kA ye madhange
bhavacchakti teekshnAgra bhinnAs sudhoore, vinashyantu te choorNitha krouncha shaile

janithri pithA cha svaputrA parAdham, sahethe na kim devasenAdhi nAtha
aham chAthibAlo bhavAn loka thAtha, kshamasvAparAdham samastham Mahesha

namah kekine shaktaye chApi tubhyam, namah chhaga tubhyam namah kukkutAya
namah sindhave sindhu deshAya tubhyam, punah skanda moorthe namaste namostu

jayA nanda bhooman jayA pAra dhAman, jayA mogha keerthe jayA nanthamoorthe
jayA nanda sindho jayA shesha bandho, jaya tvam sadA mukti dhAnesha soono

bhujangAkhya vritthena kluptham sthavam yah, pateth bhakti yuktho guham sam pranamya
suputrAn kaLathram dhanam dheergamAyuh, labheth Skanda sAyujya manthe narrassah

DRS in the 3rd slokam from the last, There is reference to Kukkutaya(is that same as Kukkute) Correct me If Iam wrong

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 27 Mar 2006, 02:21

Thats the one Kiran. AFAIK subrahmaNya bhujangaprayAta stOtra is about the deity in tiruccendUr. At least so the translations say. This seems to be correct for 2 reasons

1- Reference to the seashore
2- Mention of sugandhaSaila.

But loads of websites giving information about kukke sbrahmaNya temple mention the reference to "bhajE kukke lingam". Therefore, although the reference(text) may be erroneous, the fact that SankarAcArya has praised this place iis itslef most probably correct. Since it mentioned kukke lingam, I looked up Sivabhujanga of AcArya but was unable to find this.

One observation that I have made is that the line "bhajE kukke lingam" itself will not fit in into the bhujangaprayAta metre as far as I can see. Perhaps kukke is spelt differently(alternative forms).

There is no doubt about the gretaness of the kShEtra itself which has been praised in so many other texts, but as I saw this bit, I am very keen to know the source. Also AcArya`s camping here is also beyond doubt as it is present in his biography.

The sthaLamahATme available in the temple itself would very likely clear this but I have no way of obtaining or accessing it msyelf. Will ever be grateful to anyone who can throw more light on this.

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 27 Mar 2006, 02:53

DRS

kukke = basket is a kannada word. I am unable to find akin sanskrit word it must have been derived from some colloquial word. It is most unlikely for AcArya to have used a vernacular in his stOtram. he may have used sanskrit paryaaya like pETaka, kara^NDaH etc. Hence a literal search will be futile!

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 27 Mar 2006, 02:59

kiran

the kukkuTa refers to the cock which is his flag (dvaja) and has nothing to refer to the kukke in the sthalapurraaNa.

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 27 Mar 2006, 03:03

VK and Kiran
Your inputs are much appreciated. VK can you post just the link to AcArya`s expanation on the kAMbOdhi kRti(As he mentions subrahmaNya).

CML
I would not be surprised if AcArya actually useda kannaDa word in his stOtra. MD, who is also very orthodox in his approach, has used "tillai", a tamizh word as tillE vanagEham in his kRti. Alternatively kukShi can be associated(by extension of meaning) with the meaning kukke in kannaDa.

vasanthakokilam · Post by **vasanthakokilam** » 27 Mar 2006, 03:26

Here is the link to the thread on AcArya`s expanation on the kAMbOdhi kRti

http://www.rasikas.org/forums/viewtopic.php?t= ... c&start=75

This may not point to the actual posting... the posting is by kaumaaram on 08 Mar 2006 that starts with "I am reproducing an excellent translation done by Mr Anand Natarajan, the new member of our forum of Sri Subrahmanyaya Namasthe - the Kambodhi krithi of MD. The meaning of the song was explained by Kanchi Paramacharya to Ariyakudi Ramanuja Iyengar:"

The specific reference to the subrahmaNya sthalam is in this context: "....In Andhra and Karnataka, they do not have Subrahmanya idols in temples; rather, He is worshipped in snake form. You know a place called Subrahmanya in Karnataka - there also it is this way. Telugus fondly say 'subbarAyudu' meaning Subrahmanya as well as snake.
Let us see if Adisankara has brought out this Subrahmanya - snake connection. (laughs) The title itself is 'Bhujangam'! Snake does not have legs, and uses its whole body as hands - bhujam, and moves about in a wavy rhythm. The 'chandas' similar to a snake's movement is called 'bhujanga prayAdham'. Acharya has sung bhujangams on many Gods, but when we simply think of bhujangam, what comes to our mind immediately is 'Subrahmanya Bhujangam'. On other Gods, He has also composed ashtakam, pancharatnam etc, but on Subrahmanya, only this Subrahmanya Bhujangam - may be to show that Subrahmanya is Himself the bhujangam....."

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 27 Mar 2006, 03:35

Thanks VK
I found the link by googling. Here it is

http://www.carnaticcorner.com/articles/ ... slated.htm

After seeing paramAcArya`s vyAkhyAna and reading the sAhitya agaian, there is sufficient reason to think dIkShitar has sung the kAmbOdhi kRti on kukke subrahmaNya.

sudarshan · Post by **sudarshan** » 27 Mar 2006, 19:27

Foremost, DRS, excellent krithi. Reminds me of the very beautiful mangalaharathi conducted at Kukke. What splendour and what brightness!

Now, my 2c. I remember having bought a book when visiting Kukke that gave out the history of the place. I searched for it over the weekend, but seem to have misplaced it. I remember that book said that this place was known as Kukkepattana in the 19th century, but hence has been reduced to just Kukke. Also, it said, Kukkepattana might be the corrupted form of Kukkutapattana. AFAIK, Kukkutapattana seems to hold some strength since Sri Subrahmanya has the Kukkuta dwaja. I remember to have read about the "Bhaje Kukkelingam" and this verse was attributed to the Shankara Vijayam written by either Anandagiri or Ananthanandagiri. But unfortunately, Ananthanandagiri's biography of the Acharya is not considered reliable. Surely the kshetram is indeed a very ancient one and did exist before the times of Sri Madhvacharya (12th century) since he established a Mutt here, which is the caretaker of the Subramanya temple. So, it is quite possible that Adi Shankaracharya also visited this kshetram. As soon as one enters the temple from the Mahadwaram, there is a small niche in the wall with a lingam called as Kukke Lingam.

Sri Madhvacharya also established the norms for worship to Sri Subrahmanya and hence the puja is performed by priests belonging to the Madhva (dvaita) sect.

To the people of Karnataka, this place holds great importance and is family deity to many. It is also famous for putraprapti and sarpadosha nivarana. Even now there is a great deal of aachara observed here, but many say it has reduced in the modern times. Seems if there was any anaachara committed, a snake would come out of the sanctum and people had to apologise for the mistake committed. This is a fact that has been experienced by one of my relatives. Sorry for the long post.

kiransurya · Post by **kiransurya** » 27 Mar 2006, 22:18

Darshan/ DRS
You explanation sounds logical. "Kukke to kukkutadhwaja" though both terms mean diff things in diff languages.

coolkarni · Post by **coolkarni** » 27 Mar 2006, 22:43

Tbe Family diety from my Mothers side is Kukke Subrahmanya

When i was very young , I remember my maternal Grand Father fixing up the upanayanam of my uncle (mothers younger brother ) at my native place Harihar itself.My Garndmother wanted it at Subrahmanya as per family tradition.But then there was a group upanayanam happening at my native place so they went ahead with the plans.
a week before the scheduled date , serpents started appearing in our home.after they were sighted four times (and whooshed away , not killed) my Garndpa (himself a Bhujanga Rao , gave in and changed plans ) .Boy those 4 days i was scared like hell ! the whole family slept upstairs (obvoiusly we assumed snakes cannot climb stairs )

And the trip we made on a UDAYA motor service Bus we hired from Shimoga for the upanayanam was such a memorable one.I never left the side of the Bus driver - who in my opinion then ranked in heroism ,next only to Edmund Hilary and Neil Armstrong -they way he drove the bus through rain and those Ghats =- He was such a hero to me.
5 days of pure bliss in that wonderful Place .
Even to this day , I feel a great calm descending on me when I visit that place .It is beyond words.
On occasions I have seen the Priest take steps backwards in deep reverence saying that he had seen a Serpent inside the sanctum sanctorum.also on occasions I have seen snakes go past us as we walked from Kumara Dhara to Darpana Theertha and the local citizens never afraid of them.

sudarshan · Post by **sudarshan** » 27 Mar 2006, 23:41

DRS, as I was reading the krithi again, I came across these lines:
"Krittike tareyalli janisi". AFAIK, Sri Subrahmanya was born under the star Vishaka (Vaishaka Vishaka, Vaigasi Vishakam) and not under Krittika. Since he was brought up by the 6 krittika sthree(s), that nakshatra is auspicious to him.

sudarshan · Post by **sudarshan** » 28 Mar 2006, 00:09

I found a website related to the Mutt - www.subrahmanyamatha.org. DRS, the sthalapurana is given in this website.

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 28 Mar 2006, 07:46

Coolkarni
Thanks for the personal touch.

DRS, as I was reading the krithi again, I came across these lines:
"Krittike tareyalli janisi". AFAIK, Sri Subrahmanya was born under the star Vishaka (Vaishaka Vishaka, Vaigasi Vishakam) and not under Krittika. Since he was brought up by the 6 krittika sthree(s), that nakshatra is auspicious to him.

Drashan, I have been trying to confirm one way or the other but am getting conflicting results. While I keep trying, can CML/anyone say what they know?

Change from kukkuTa to kukke as suggested in some web links is far-fetched and has no linguistc basis. The lingas found in a kukke(basket) is what is widely known and accepted. Even purANIkally, vAsuki was there before kArtikEya and he was a Sivabhakta.

The correct website for the matha is here

http://www.subrahmanyamatha.org/

The one you gave lacks a "h" and interestingly leads to some school education link.

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 28 Mar 2006, 08:45

Thanks DRS for the corrected link. I have learnt a lot from it on the connection of snakes with SubramaNya which is popular among Telugus and Kannadigas (but not among Tamils!). I tend to agree that MD may have composed his song based on kukke. Incidentally the link also gives credibility to the connection with kukkuTa in the naming of the town. Also therein the meaning kukke= cave (=guha ) is also found which all makes sense. If there were one lakh houses there in ancient times the reference to LakSha deepa makes sense from ancient times. Also

At the same time, a flutist plays the flute and hence this Puja is known as Kolalu Sahasranamarchana. (This Puja is performed on behalf of the Mysore Maharaja.)

flashes memory back to konanuru venupurishvara.
I will also check the subramanya sahasranama for any references.

Now I am awaiting your explanations on the raga, the connections with sarasangi as also the notations. Though we cannot have the luxury of illustrative u/ls your words are good enough. Let us pursue our musical journey here ignoring the crisis taking place! Actually we can now devote more time to studies without other distractions. (Of course we should encourage more discussions on music elsewhere too!).

kartik · Post by **kartik** » 28 Mar 2006, 15:27

Has anyone performed a graha bedha from sarasangi to dharmavathi/chakravaaham or the combination as such?

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 29 Mar 2006, 00:59

We need to get back on track despite all the ruckus on the forum.(Am I fighting a lone and losing battle here?)

saurasEna is the 27th asampUrNa mELa, its sampUrNa counterpart being sarasAngi. Its scale is

SR2G3M1PD1N3S* | S*NDPMGRGS ||

G, M and D are nyAsas. gAndhAra, dhaivata and niShAda bring out the rAga swarUpa well. "RGS," and "MGRGS," are catch phrases which set the rAga apart from sarasAngi. Note that there is NO jAru gamaka from gAndhAra to ShaDja in the above phrases. Other viSESha prayOgas are "PDS" and "SNPDP". These phrases help to bring out the difference form sarasAngi. The "RGS," has to be featured often and the "SNP" several times.
MD`s "saurasEnESam" is the only other known kRti in the rAga.
Alas for a recording!

rshankar · Post by **rshankar** » 29 Mar 2006, 01:13

We need to get back on track despite all the ruckus on the forum.(Am I fighting a lone and losing battle here?)

DRS,
THANKS for doing this. I hope you are not fighting a loosing battle. Keep it up, and I am sure we will get back to where we were: may take some time, and may even make us better: these trials either break us or make us stronger!
Ravi

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 29 Mar 2006, 01:22

DRS

You have not discussed the relationship to sarasangi which though not a major raga has a nice varnam and some kritis (svati's jaya jaya padmanabha is very popular). Again the pratimadhyama counterpart lathangi is extremely popular. Is saurasena primarily a scalr raga? Do please expand your comments in the absence of any demos!

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 29 Mar 2006, 23:11

Darshan
You were right about the janma nakShatra of kArttikEya being viSAkha. Thanks for pointing out. God bless you.

I have modified the sAhitya for first line of caraNa to
"uttama gangeyali janisi"

I have also edited the relevant posts.
Will post corrected verson shortly

sudarshan · Post by **sudarshan** » 29 Mar 2006, 23:35

DRS, really you are amazing, ably changing lyrics, that too extempore.

Early today morning, I was thinking about this krithi and recollected the namams appearing in Subramanya ashtotram - Krittika Sunave Namaha... Vishakaya Namaha...

I wanted to post about it, but forgot all about it until I saw your message now. The modified sahitya also sounds nice. Unfortunately I'm not able to listen to any of your compositions. Bigtime firewall restrictions here at my office. At home, a snail would beat my connection speed.

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 29 Mar 2006, 23:42

Here is the corrected version of rakkaNe gaida with some AlApane & swaraprastAra as well.

http://rapidshare.de/files/16723903/rak ... y.wma.html

Darshan
Is there another way I can upload(other than apidshare) that will help you download. I will do what I can if you want me to.

sudarshan · Post by **sudarshan** » 30 Mar 2006, 00:31

DRS, that reply was at the speed of light! Thank you. Actually, I was planning to download a lot from here at my friend's house this weekend, but thanks to the controversy raging here, my plans have gone kaput. But I will surely go ahead and download your uploads. If I don't have luck with it, I'll let you know.

By the way, nimage, nimma shrimathi matthu kutumbadavarige, and to everybody that's celebrating Yugadi tomorrow, Coolkarni, Meena, Rajachandra, everybody else, Vyaya Varsha Yugadi Habbada Shubhashayagalu; Yugadi Panduga Shubhakankshalu.

|| Kale Varshatu Parjanyah, Prthivi Sasyashalini
Deshoyam Kshobah Rahito Brahmanah Samthu Nirbhayah ||

|| Aputrah Putrinah Samtu, Putrinah Samtu Poutrinah
Adhanah Sadhanah Samtu, Jivantu Sharadah Shatam ||

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 30 Mar 2006, 01:35

DRS

Thanks for the new version. We are now doubly happy!

Yugadi greetings to one and all!

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 30 Mar 2006, 02:11

Notation for rakkaNe gaida

http://rapidshare.de/files/16726988/rak ... y.pdf.html

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 30 Mar 2006, 03:18

Thanks! I was waiting for it!

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 08 Apr 2006, 02:28

Testing!

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 08 Apr 2006, 03:05

hurrah! What a relief! Lets hope the other server starts functioning soon so that we have all the threads complete

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 08 Apr 2006, 03:13

No worries! I have the backup of this thread right up to april 4th before the crash. Let us hold on any serious discussions for a while since if we get restored we will lose what we discuss here!

kiransurya · Post by **kiransurya** » 08 Apr 2006, 16:52

This back up forum looks and feels very strange. We are all lost in tme..

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 10 Apr 2006, 00:36

drshrikaanth Posted: 30 Mar 2006 12:55 am

I hope my AlApane and swaraprastAra have brought out the differnce between saurasEna and sarasAngi. I have already mentioned some special prayOgas which will not be suggested directly by the scale. "SRM" is yet another phrase. Using "SNPD~" and even more so "PDS,NPD~," will be very reminiscent of sAveri and hence must not be used frequently. "SNPDP" should however be OK. "SRGS" is the catch phrase and must be used often

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 10 Apr 2006, 00:38

cmlover Posted: 30 Mar 2006 02:52 am

No shades of shankarabharaNa or mmg but similarity as well as difference from sarasaangi is evident. The svara sancaaram is very pleasing. My wife who generally is indifferent to anything other than saahitya overheard it and remarked 'this is so beautiful and rhythmic and I don't care what raga it is since I am not getting it

I am still studying your notes!

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 10 Apr 2006, 00:39

padmini Posted: 30 Mar 2006 04:15 pm

what other way to congratulate a son for his achievements from a mother but for singing his own krithi and gift the same to him on new year day.(UGAADI) please listen patiently.

http://rapidshare.de/files/16792468/ven ... y.wav.html

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 10 Apr 2006, 00:40

rshankar Posted: 30 Mar 2006 04:45 pm

Padminiji,
That was EXCELLENT! And a wonderful tribute to boot. Happy Ugadi to you too!
Ravi

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 10 Apr 2006, 00:41

kiransurya Posted: 30 Mar 2006 04:48 pm

Padmini amma
Namasthe!!!
That was a very soulful rendition of Sri Srikanth's Composition. Thank you for the clip and also for giving us all a guru like Sri DRS....
Happy Ugadi to you, your family and everyone else on the forum..

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 10 Apr 2006, 00:43

cmlover Posted: 30 Mar 2006 05:13 pm

susvAgataM atrabhavatI padminikriShnamurti!

We are honoured by your musical message of greetings on this auspicious occasion of the mellifluous rendering of your son's/shiShya's composition. We are grateful to you for gifting the world a son who is a healer of body mind and soul in addition to being a shining path-blazer for our hoary heritage!

This particular song as he has mentioned was written in an inspired moment and it captures the vision of Lord Sri KriShNa in his human compassionate aspect as the guardian deity of his hometown. Your melodious rendering has transported us to those bucolic surroundings and the hamIru in particular engenders an ineffable serenity of the heart.

Thank you so much and we fondly will cherish these melodious moments for a long long time!

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 10 Apr 2006, 00:44

Suji Ram Posted: 30 Mar 2006 06:27 pm

Happy ugAdi to all,
Here's kAntaswara on violin for this occasion
http://rapidshare.de/files/16767461/kAn ... m.mp3.html

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 10 Apr 2006, 00:45

cmlover Posted: 30 Mar 2006 07:07 pm

While DRS should be the ultimate arbiter, I personally enjoyed it! The transitions have to be smoothened (perhaps due to the lack of taaLam support). In my opinion 'KAntAvara' is a valuable addition to the instrumentalist repertoire (as much as the original kathanakuthoohalam itself).

Could you also attempt a raga aalaapana on the violin which will give a further insight into the structure of this raga?

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 10 Apr 2006, 00:47

Suji Ram Posted: 30 Mar 2006 07:20 pm

While DRS should be the ultimate arbiter, I personally enjoyed it! The transitions have to be smoothened (perhaps due to the lack of taaLam support). In my opinion 'KAntAvara' is a valuable addition to the instrumentalist repertoire (as much as the original kathanakuthoohalam itself).

Could you also attempt a raga aalaapana on the violin which will give a further insight into the structure of this raga?

cmloverji,
Hmm...aalaapanaa???

This is my first kriti on violin. I learnt only upto varnams.

Yes, a mridamgam support to this lovely piece (thanks DRS) would be great!
Thanks for listening!

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 10 Apr 2006, 00:49

cmlover Posted: 30 Mar 2006 07:26 pm

Dear Suji Ram

You are underestimaing your potential. Just follow DRS's advice to me (hum the notes!). I am sure you will get it pat if you practice the aro/avaro a few times and try the phrases from the song itself. Your gamaka sanchaarams are just perfect!