Do few Ragas suite some Instruments better than others?

paddu · Post by **paddu** » 07 Mar 2008, 14:54

Hi Everyone,
I don't know if this has already been discussed. If it has been, kindly ignore.
Somehow, I always thought, raga ShankaraaBharaNa can only be appreciated only if you give your full attention (how do I put it,...you know, I could appreciate any other raga while driving, but if I were to listen to ShankaraBharana, then I might have to stop driving and listen.... I think you get what I am trying to say.)..However, I was listening to Raga ShankaraBharana on veena a couple of days ago, it sounded sooo good. Then I started paying attention to the instruments and raga.
I found Hindolam sounded divine on flute and Mohanam sounded its best on violin.

Has anyone experienced something similar? Can there be any scientific reason to this? Or is it just the various moods of the listener?

Thanks
Paddu

vasanthakokilam · Post by **vasanthakokilam** » 07 Mar 2008, 23:32

Interesting line of thinking..

There are a few things that appeal to me based on the 'kattai' at which it is sung. Remember these are marginal differences in level of appeal.

Subhapantuvarali's rasa comes across better to me at a lower kattai than a higher kattai. This sort of implies that a male voice is suited better than a female voice. Mukhari works for me best at higher kattais than lower kattais.

I realize it is not an instrument specific answer that you were looking for but since this is related, I thought I will share.

And I can readily see that it is highly personal and so opinions on such things will vary quite widely.

Suji Ram · Post by **Suji Ram** » 07 Mar 2008, 23:38

Another line of thinking is...
Depends on the gamakas in the raga.
Even certain compositions. I find certainTyagaraja's composition better on violin than MD's which sound better on veena(offcourse MD being a vainika). May be my personal limitations in trying MD's kritis

cienu · Post by **cienu** » 07 Mar 2008, 23:48

Paddu , I had not given much thought on the lines suggested by you.

Nevertheless , if given a choice when listening to instrumental , I must confess that I like Ananda Bhairavi and Todi the best when played on the Veena and yes I have a weakness for Kapi which flows from the flute.

But I agree with what VK says , these are individual tastes

uday_shankar · Post by **uday_shankar** » 08 Mar 2008, 00:29

cienu, speaking of tastes, some have a weakness for the "toddy" which flows from the "paanai" (ghatam)

.

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 08 Mar 2008, 01:00

The instruments distil the essence of the ragas (and may inebriate as Uday suggests

But vocalist is more sahitya oriented and has to be atleast somewhat distinct

Also superfast svaraprastanas are possible only on the instruments. Even GNB invented brigas by patterning after Nadasvaram! Instrumentalists should experiment more boldly than simply playing second fiddle

Of course everyone cannot be a Mali or LGJ

arasi · Post by **arasi** » 08 Mar 2008, 01:31

All these personal pronouncements on music remind me of Kalki's response when he first heard the then HM star Roshanara Begum: she sounded like a mouse caught in a door...eeks!
Not that I don't have highly personal views myself!

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 08 Mar 2008, 03:38

Yes who can forget the 'Mouseque' of Roshanara

Indeed it was killed by geting squeezed between the two countries, India and Pakistan

gobilalitha · Post by **gobilalitha** » 08 Mar 2008, 07:00

TNRajaratnam pillai was very famous for his todi,which,it is stated he used to play for hours together. now adays, peple ask kadiri to play nagumomu at every concert, just like the legend MMI's english note , for injecting some humour in the discussions wshich is my wont,subhapantuvarali, a moving and appealing raaga is played by All India Radio, for 3 days when an ex premierf or President kicks the bucket , may be an exaggeration . but pl bear gobilalitha

vasanthakokilam · Post by **vasanthakokilam** » 08 Mar 2008, 07:45

Right gobilalitha. A lot of people associate SPV with only such sad events because of AIR. Similarly Mukhari has such undeserved reputation among many. It is so bad that in some quarters they would not sing or play that raga during happy ceremonies. What a huge disservice to a great raga which is capable of a wide variety of rasas. If it is a sad raga, would Thyagaraja employ it to convey his sense of "wonder" at the opportunity Sabari got to serve Rama.

Atleast in the case of the AIR death music, most people do not know it is in SPV but somehow Mukhari has that connotation among a huge cross section of society that it is a sad or weeping raga even with those who do not listen to CM much. Actually my contention is it would not be the best raga to choose to portray sad or weeping rasa.

cienu · Post by **cienu** » 08 Mar 2008, 07:57

Uday_Shankar wrote:cienu, speaking of tastes, some have a weakness for the "toddy" which flows from the "paanai" (ghatam) .

Uday,

That was indeed a good one.

paddu · Post by **paddu** » 08 Mar 2008, 07:58

Gobilalitha Sir, I when Smt. Indira Gandhi passed away, I don't remember for how many days DD played the sarangi. As I was very young then and not exposed to Classical Music, I came to an opinion that Sarangi is a very ..... dull (no offence meant here) instrument. It took many years to undo this one. And similarly, any happy occassions always meant Shahanayi or Nadaswaram, Veena .........

coolkarni · Post by **coolkarni** » 08 Mar 2008, 08:58

Sarangi ...
Sorrowful Yes.
Dull, never.

Humor and Music - How badly they need the backdrop of pathos.
And i believe firmly like some great philosophers that Heaven is not an Utopia , for there would be no Music and Humor then.
Let me get back to Amir Khans Marwa. That single LP can unleash so many outpourings in my mind, decade after decade !!

The mistake is with the artists.Why do they go and play that stuff for Doordarshan.
Has anyone watched Kanyakumari play on such occasions.She plays as though the world is coming to an end, soon.

arvindt · Post by **arvindt** » 08 Mar 2008, 09:36

On the topic of this thread, to pitch in my two cents or paisa.

I generally find that I enjoy ragas based on scales (Abhogi, Hamsanadam and so on)
on instruments more than I enjoy elaborate vocal renditions -- somehow in vocal elaborate
renditions quickly seem to exhaust the scope of such ragas (for me at least) whereas that
doesn't seem to happen (or I notice it less) on instruments.

On the other hand, for heavy gamaka laden ragas and "core" Carnatic ragas (Kambhoji,
Sahana, Surati or Ananda Bhairavi), I somehow strongly prefer vocal, with only two
exceptions: Mali and TNR.

Vocalist · Post by **Vocalist** » 08 Mar 2008, 19:11

My personal view is that it is all the artist. Certain ragas, tunes, compositions, languages come better for certain artists than they do for others. It's a part of life, and no matter how much the artist may want to be good at it, they probably won't be (exceptions to this would exist of course). Some may be better at bouncing a ball, while others may be better at throwing it. :/ I don't know if that quite illustrates my point, but I'm sure no one noticed.

coolkarni wrote:She plays as though the world is coming to an end, soon.

A mild way of putting it, eh?

Vocalist · Post by **Vocalist** » 08 Mar 2008, 19:24

arvindt wrote:On the topic of this thread, to pitch in my two cents or paisa.

Pitch (and in a vocalist's case - voice) is often what limits an artist from performing what and how he would have wanted to perform, but once over this hurdle, it can be used in reverse. That is the beauty of this style of music - an artist can always find a strength (somewhere!). Ordinarily, an artist is likely to wish, aspire or even dream to perform in another way (often like their role-model), but instead, have to perform in the way that suits the artist's strengths so that others can collectively enjoy it. While it is at first unfortunate for the artist (as it is different to the way (s)he wanted to perform), after a while, a self-appreciation develops and then you are well on your way to where you want to go

My 2 cents