Meena,
I do remember your request asking me to post anecdotes and I have been jotting down various points that came to my mind in order to honour your request.
Well I begin this chapter with anecdotes relating to Tanjore Sri Upendran.
I hope you enjoy it.
Regards,
Param
Anecdotes
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param
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Anecdote
A few years back Dr. BMK visited Bombay and during the course of his talks which had Sri Upendran sir, my father and a few other musical friends participating, he made a mention of a development of a different definition for the Laghu and the Dritham. He broke down the Laghu into the following two components ? the Sashabdham ? the one with a sound (the tapping) and the Nishabdham ? the one without a sound (the counting of the fingers). Similarly he broke down the Dritham ? the Sashabdham ? the one with a sound (the palm tapping face downwards) and the Nishabdham ? the one without a sound (the palm tapping face upwards).
What Dr. BMK had to say that further possibilities were available if either the Sashabdham or the Nishabdham were customized to a particular gathi.
If one spends some time setting thalams to such a combination (as explained by Dr. BMK) one only finds that there are newer horizons that one needs to venture into and come out with a far greater number of thalams ? much above the 175 thalams as mentioned above.
Any guesses on this figure?
A few years back Dr. BMK visited Bombay and during the course of his talks which had Sri Upendran sir, my father and a few other musical friends participating, he made a mention of a development of a different definition for the Laghu and the Dritham. He broke down the Laghu into the following two components ? the Sashabdham ? the one with a sound (the tapping) and the Nishabdham ? the one without a sound (the counting of the fingers). Similarly he broke down the Dritham ? the Sashabdham ? the one with a sound (the palm tapping face downwards) and the Nishabdham ? the one without a sound (the palm tapping face upwards).
What Dr. BMK had to say that further possibilities were available if either the Sashabdham or the Nishabdham were customized to a particular gathi.
If one spends some time setting thalams to such a combination (as explained by Dr. BMK) one only finds that there are newer horizons that one needs to venture into and come out with a far greater number of thalams ? much above the 175 thalams as mentioned above.
Any guesses on this figure?
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cmlover
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Param
The point is not clear! Was he talking about varying the sashabdam to different levels. How does one tie shabdam to gati. Even in the regular taLa what is the role of the different kriyas and how they are used? You should explain these issues in your lessonsat the vidyalaya thread . Sorry to interrupt! let us continue with anecdotes here!
The point is not clear! Was he talking about varying the sashabdam to different levels. How does one tie shabdam to gati. Even in the regular taLa what is the role of the different kriyas and how they are used? You should explain these issues in your lessonsat the vidyalaya thread . Sorry to interrupt! let us continue with anecdotes here!
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param
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The term talam and its various components will definitely be dealt in details in the Vidyalaya thread. Yet, I will write a little in brief.The point is not clear! Was he talking about varying the sashabdam to different levels. How does one tie shabdam to gati. Even in the regular taLa what is the role of the different kriyas and how they are used?
The Aadi Talam - lets take this for our current examination - since it contains all the main components of a Talam viz., the Laghu and the Dritham. A Laghu is basically a tapping of the palm facing downwards and counting of fingers. The tempo at which the tapping of the palm and the counting of fingers is evenly spread. The gap between a tapping and the counting of the first finger, then the second finger and so on is the same. The Dritham is the tapping of the palm facing downards and the tapping of the palm facing upwards. The Aadi tala has a Laghu and two Drithams.
Sri BMK splits the Laghu and Drithams further - the Tapping becomes the Sashabdam (one with a sound) and the finger counts and the tapping with the face of palm facing upwards become the Nishabdham (one without a sound)
According to Sri BMK the Aadi Talam could be split varying the tempo of the Laghu to suit the Gati adopted followed by normal Drithams.
See the example below:
Normal Aadi Talam
The Laghu
1 _ _ _ 2 _ _ _ 3 _ _ _ 4 _ _ _
Dritham 1 and 2
5 _ _ _ 6 _ _ _ 7 _ _ _ 8 _ _ _
This is now set to Chatusra Gati
If we choose to change the gati to Kanda Gathi for example the same talam would be as below:
The Laghu
1 _ _ _ _ 2 _ _ _ 3 _ _ _ 4 _ _ _
Dritham 1 and 2
5 _ _ _ _ 6 _ _ _ 7 _ _ _ _ 8 _ _ _
If we choose to change the gati to Thisra Gathi for example the same talam would be as below:
The Laghu
1 _ _ 2 _ _ _ 3 _ _ _ 4 _ _ _
Dritham 1 and 2
5 _ _ 6 _ _ _ 7 _ _ 8 _ _ _
The current example has been taken up only with the Aadi Talam - The technically correct name of which is the Chatusra Jaadi Triputa Taalam Chatusra Gathi.
Within the next 3-4 days - you will find a post in the Vidyalaya Thread which deals with the Talams in detail - and I am sure reading this posting with the one on Talams (when it is up) will give you a very clear picture of what was the explanation delivered by Sri BMK.
Do let me know if u have any more queries.
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cmlover
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vasanthakokilam
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Ah.. OK, Now I understand a bit...( CMLs statements on 32 and 35 helped )
In the currently practiced system, where gathi is applied uniformly to all the beats of the thalam, we have the 175 thalas, 35 talas times 5 gathis.
If you independently choose the gathi for Sashabdam and Nishabdam then you get 875 thalas. (35 times 25)
The multiplier 25 ( 5*5 ) is due to the fact the 5 gathi variations of Sashabdam can be combined with the 5 gathi variations of Nishabdam. ( and all the thalas have beats belonging to both of the two categories ). The current 175 are included in these 875 since they are just cases where the sashabdam and nishabdam have the same gathi count.
The above number is based on the assumption that we keep the same gathi within a category.
If you allow different gathis to different beats of Sashabdam ( or Nishabdam ), the number of thalas will explode but I don't think that is what BMK is suggesting.
Let me take a crack at this number... It may be wrong but atleast you will tell me if I approached it rightly or wrongly.If one spends some time setting thalams to such a combination (as explained by Dr. BMK) one only finds that there are newer horizons that one needs to venture into and come out with a far greater number of thalams ? much above the 175 thalams as mentioned above.
Any guesses on this figure?
In the currently practiced system, where gathi is applied uniformly to all the beats of the thalam, we have the 175 thalas, 35 talas times 5 gathis.
If you independently choose the gathi for Sashabdam and Nishabdam then you get 875 thalas. (35 times 25)
The multiplier 25 ( 5*5 ) is due to the fact the 5 gathi variations of Sashabdam can be combined with the 5 gathi variations of Nishabdam. ( and all the thalas have beats belonging to both of the two categories ). The current 175 are included in these 875 since they are just cases where the sashabdam and nishabdam have the same gathi count.
The above number is based on the assumption that we keep the same gathi within a category.
If you allow different gathis to different beats of Sashabdam ( or Nishabdam ), the number of thalas will explode but I don't think that is what BMK is suggesting.
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vasanthakokilam
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VK - wrong you will realize it once I am through with my post on the Talams
I do not know if my mathematical reasoning is wrong or musical understanding is wrong? It is probably both. ( Is the Jumpa thalam with the anudhrutham there throws a monkey wrench in my derivation of the 875 number, I wonder )OK, I will wait for the lesson...
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kiransurya
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drshrikaanth
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Param
Youare doing a neat job. Keep it up.
There is one thing I want to clarify. Pardon me if I have got the discussion here wrong. The division of laghu or druta into saSabda and niSSabda kriyes is neither new nor unique to BMK. That is what we are routinelt taught and that is how the tALas have been conceptualised.
Youare doing a neat job. Keep it up.
There is one thing I want to clarify. Pardon me if I have got the discussion here wrong. The division of laghu or druta into saSabda and niSSabda kriyes is neither new nor unique to BMK. That is what we are routinelt taught and that is how the tALas have been conceptualised.
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param
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drs
I am sorry to inform you that none of the music schools that prevail today teaches this particular aspect of the laghu and drutam - especially highlighting the issue of sashabdam and nishabdam. the uniqueness in Sri BMK's concept is that if the five jaathis are applied only to the Sashabdam or only to the Nishabdam - the talam is totally different - and believe me, very very few mridangists of today will venture playing a tani avartanam if such a talam is displayed in the midst of a concert before the song is sung.
All those veterans will find it too difficult - because, this involves a lot of mathematical calculations for playing the nadai, the periya mohra and the periya korvai in a convincing manner - winning applauds from both the main performer and the audience - both at the same time.
I am sorry to inform you that none of the music schools that prevail today teaches this particular aspect of the laghu and drutam - especially highlighting the issue of sashabdam and nishabdam. the uniqueness in Sri BMK's concept is that if the five jaathis are applied only to the Sashabdam or only to the Nishabdam - the talam is totally different - and believe me, very very few mridangists of today will venture playing a tani avartanam if such a talam is displayed in the midst of a concert before the song is sung.
All those veterans will find it too difficult - because, this involves a lot of mathematical calculations for playing the nadai, the periya mohra and the periya korvai in a convincing manner - winning applauds from both the main performer and the audience - both at the same time.
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drshrikaanth
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param
BMK`s concept of applying dofferent gati/naDe to the kriyes is certainly his own. But the concept of saSabda and niSSabda is certainly not new. Iam surprised that this is not taught routinely(in TN I take it). You could ask any music student from karnATaka and they will mostl likely be aware of this concept. The first beat produces a sound and is hence saSabda. Neither the finger count nor the vIccu/bIsu of the hand produces sound and is hence called niSSabda kriye.
BMK`s concept of applying dofferent gati/naDe to the kriyes is certainly his own. But the concept of saSabda and niSSabda is certainly not new. Iam surprised that this is not taught routinely(in TN I take it). You could ask any music student from karnATaka and they will mostl likely be aware of this concept. The first beat produces a sound and is hence saSabda. Neither the finger count nor the vIccu/bIsu of the hand produces sound and is hence called niSSabda kriye.
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kiransurya
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param
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What do you wish to term the definition for KRIYA.
AVARTANAM - if I guess correctly is something that you play at the end of the song - correct?
Aadi talam in Kanda gathi is eight aksharams multiplied by five i.e. 40 maatras.
Once I have your answers, KS, I will be in a better position to answer your questions.
AVARTANAM - if I guess correctly is something that you play at the end of the song - correct?
Aadi talam in Kanda gathi is eight aksharams multiplied by five i.e. 40 maatras.
Once I have your answers, KS, I will be in a better position to answer your questions.
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kiransurya
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Param !!!
I think I might as well be using wrong terms here. When I said Aavrutham (not avarthanam as in tani avarthanam ) I meant one cycle of Adi taalam (laghu and dhruthams included) My actual question was If I have to physically show a Khandajaathi Aadi taalam then would I have to tapp my palm and fingers as Tha Ka (2) + Tha ki Ta (3) individually? is that the way we customise the kriyas
BTW, One Kriya for me means tapping our finger or palm once.
Hope I am not creating new terminology here and confusing people.
Param
A humble request. Iam not good at all at these terms(as I grew up here, there's fair chance that I might as well be mispronouncing them) So please correct me teacher, if I am wrong
I think I might as well be using wrong terms here. When I said Aavrutham (not avarthanam as in tani avarthanam ) I meant one cycle of Adi taalam (laghu and dhruthams included) My actual question was If I have to physically show a Khandajaathi Aadi taalam then would I have to tapp my palm and fingers as Tha Ka (2) + Tha ki Ta (3) individually? is that the way we customise the kriyas
BTW, One Kriya for me means tapping our finger or palm once.
Hope I am not creating new terminology here and confusing people.
Param
A humble request. Iam not good at all at these terms(as I grew up here, there's fair chance that I might as well be mispronouncing them) So please correct me teacher, if I am wrong
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kaapi
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Param,
Having various nadais within a single Avartanam will make the mathematics complicated. But, I wonder if tAla is just kanakku ?
Possibly things like the balance between the pUrvAnga and the utharAnga, simplicity of overall structure and short avarthanam etc. matter. This is testified by the popularity of Adi tala. The same reasons might have influnced the mutation of chatusra rUpakam from a drutham + Laghu to 2 x (Dhrutham + anudhrutham).
I also feel the soul ( jeeva) of the tala can be felt only when someone dances to its gait. Hence for a deeper meaning of talas we should look to Bharatanatyam.
Having various nadais within a single Avartanam will make the mathematics complicated. But, I wonder if tAla is just kanakku ?
Possibly things like the balance between the pUrvAnga and the utharAnga, simplicity of overall structure and short avarthanam etc. matter. This is testified by the popularity of Adi tala. The same reasons might have influnced the mutation of chatusra rUpakam from a drutham + Laghu to 2 x (Dhrutham + anudhrutham).
I also feel the soul ( jeeva) of the tala can be felt only when someone dances to its gait. Hence for a deeper meaning of talas we should look to Bharatanatyam.
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sriucl
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