sangitha kalanidhi 2024

[arasi]

Thanks Mohan for chiming in
Yes, the speech by the veteran was interesting, no surprise there. A tad long, but should we say welcoming? A positive atmosphere prevailed, with TMK zeroing in on giving a solid concert.

Wonder if Nick was there...

[sam]

@arasi
Thank you.
The first kruthi in salaga bairavj, the saint composer censures people who prefer pomp and status, worldly pleasures etc . Why was it chosen by TMK?
Surprisingly, on looking up the meaning for both the bilahary ' dorakuna' and the varaaLi ' kanakana' kruthis of Thyagaraja, they are about the decoration of the idol, as I understand. Short shrift to Dikshitar 's subramanyaaya'.
The choice of the first two mentioned could not have been but pre'planned.
Any clues? What is the iconoclast trying to demonsfrate?

[arasi]

Pop psychology, that too coming from ancients like me, will only make the learned ones here a bit agitated!

Still, my response to your impressions: male or female, our childhood memories about the gods are mostly visual: the decorated gods in processions, the rich stimuli of color and the fragrance of flowers too. The sound of chants stay with us as well. Also perhaps of our mothers or grandparents doing puja at home--singing too at times. The aesthetics of it all make their impressions on us.
We see TMK in many differently printed shirts and woven shawls on stage, displaying his aesthetics. In this concert, he wore a white dhoti and shirt, the traditional form of attire of a CM vidwAn!

Enough of my impressions!

[Nick H]

Wonder if Nick was there...

Missed it. We had booked a trip before knowing the February RS-Hall program.

[sam]

It is very difficult to find CM kruthis unrelated to hindu gods and the pooja pattern. The theme of the bilahary and varàLi kruthis, would make very little connect for the kuppam people whom he wants to win over to CM,. ..Not only that..not even to the younger generation of the 'hindu' youth, obc, sc and st youth...Even to youth of brahm Households..
Much less to Christians and very much less to youth of islam.
.
Please note...the Reference is to lyrics of the kduthis chosen. NOT THE TUNES. and singing..
This may be true even for most who attend his concerts. So, they attend for his music. Some even among cm fans may not like his style of singing.
.
If atall, he wanted to sing , he could have chosen javalis, thillanas, padams
And romantic songs..extolling the charms of women..but all the javalis, it might be noted are by women on a male and not viceversa,
So by TMK standard, all CM is misogynist.
.
Only HM has a mix of males pining for their sweethearts.

So CM is strictly not for males singing about women. as swwthearts.

Best left to HM and film songs.
.
But the same kruthis of the trinity and padams even, when played by instrumentalists, either solo or orchestra, will surely take the essence of CM to all irrespective of caste,, subsects, religion , language and even nationality .
Some of the pure CM compositions of Ilayaraja achieve that purpose.

While akkarai subbulakshmi sisters and ranjani gaayarhri sisters, are eminently suitable for such propogation of CM, as
they are violinits ,TMK being a vocalist alone, cannot do that.
.
Akkarai sisters have very good exposure to the best of CM, HM and even classical WM.

So does Ravikiran.

.A naagaswaram player can take CM if the highest qualty to even the socially and eConomically deprived sections of people.

akkaeai sisfers and ragaa sjsters are trained violisits and vocalists.

Akkarai vijayalakshmi, the usual violinist for TMK does not share the views if TMK.
...
Raara veNu gopabala

Is the delightful bilahari swarajathi, less of CM , when rendered by Corporation band?
.

.

[MaamiAtHeart]

I listed to the full concert, twice. I absolutely loved it. TMK was the full package - perfect Shruthi alignment, powerful voice, Bhava soaked renditions, very clear enunciation of lyrics. My favorite part of the concert was when he lingered on the Kaminchi prema charanam in kanakanaruchira and sang with deep feeling, drawing the audience into his anubhavam.

Mods - if possible, could you please take the messages related to this concert and create a new post in the concert review section? This concert is freely available on YouTube and the detailed reviews and comments by other learned forum members are very useful to help beginners like me appreciate the art better.

[arasi]

Sam says:
So, CM is strictly not for males singing about women as sweethearts.

I would say that on this very forum, it was brought up years ago by Arun and he threw a challenge as it were, asking me if a (so-called) composer like me could take it up and write songs for men to sing of their love for women. I arrived at a number of songs and within months, Suryaprakash sang them on a CD. It is called engirundO vandAi. I was inspired to think then that since there are a number of male bharathanatyam dancers these days, they might perhaps pick them up. I haven't heard of any performing them so far. The songs are not limited to young love alone but that of men of all ages who uphold women who walk life's path with them.

[sam]

It is universally accepted that CM is devotion oriented. And all the kruthis are about the gods and goddesses of Hindu pantheon. Even kshetragya padams.

It will be a sacrilege to write a kruthi, of Siva longing for Parvathi, vishnu for Laksmi , subramanya for vaLLi, or krishna for rukmani, ,Raama fir Sita..
.
Thank God, no traditional composer took that dubious direction, in the name of creativity.
.
The tradition is that Siva burnt manmatha for for disturbing his concentration.
.
Healthy tradition. Let us preserve the sanctity of carnatic music.
Even TMK may not sing such songs.
.
Dharmapuri Subbarayar, who taught jaavaLis to veeNa Dhanam is said to have indirectly composed songs praising a lady.
Have to checkup the translations. May not be about any deity.

Royal Carpet Carnatic Composers: Dharmapuri Subbaraaya Aiyyar

https://www.karnatik.com/co1044.shtml


.


.

[arasi]

I see. Well, I am glad then that no one took up the songs to sing or dance to, then!
By the way, they are not about the love of the gods, but about humans!

Ideas and tastes differ, I do concede. Even the great Subrahmanya Bharathi erred, then!
No, I do not want to continue on this subject--that too here. This thread after all is about the Sangeetha Kalanidhi award. I do request the mods to delete the posts on this unnecessary departure from the topic and stop the deviation right now
Since we do not seem to have a lounge now, that's the best way to go about it, I suppose.

[sam]

Watch "Parulanamata (Javali) - Carnatic Classical Vocal - T.M.Krishna" on YouTube
https://youtu.be/IvMM0s6FJG8?si=NFpXsJqbizJRn4FA
..
Lyrics & meaning-of Parulanna mata - rasikas.org
https://www.rasikas.org/forums/viewtopic.php?t=1461
..
https://viddev.wordpress.com/2017/04/05 ... ubbarayar/
(Ramnad Krishnan rendition given here)
.
It appears that doyens like Semmankudi,, Ramnad krushnan sang this .
.
I searched for Dharmapuri Subbarayar in composers section. Could not find.
.
Though no specific god name is mentioned, many of these javalis seem to have been kearnt and renderred by leading vocalists.
.
Kaatru veLiyidai by Bharathi is there kfxourse and also a few more. But he was a poet. Not a composer. He just hinted the the raag for some of the poe s and even sang them but it was not notated by him.
It belongs more to film music genre.

..
The points being stressed are very much germane to the topic of the thread. TMK wants to take CM to people of all religions, castes and occupation. But he is constrained by the standard and accepted theme of devotion to godhead.
He can sing vaLLalar poems set to suitable tunes.
But do we really need music composers ( music directors) any more, when cenema and Tv and youtube have spread so much?....

[SabashBale]

What TMK may take years or decades to 'equalize' by all his and many other people's non-musical efforts, has taken only seconds here:

https://www.youtube.com/shorts/sLkr0Whf0cA

[dhanurasi]

What TMK may take years or decades to 'equalize' by all his and many other people's non-musical efforts, has taken only seconds here:

https://www.youtube.com/shorts/sLkr0Whf0cA

This clip of Ranjani Gayathri's concert in a Keral temple has gained a huge Social Media visibility after the SK news. Kerala has a more diverse audience for classical music than Chennai or any part of Tamilnadu.

Disgusting to see attacking posts saying that the lady was made to sit on the floor due to casteist or a class discrimnation. That's what activism creates: opinions without knowledge of even basic facts.

[sam]

In the article cited below, TMK mentions a few points , which veteran experts in the forum can endorse or refute..
.

https://m.thewire.in/article/the-arts/c ... -tradition

By
TMKRISHNA
Quote
..
. is also essential for readers to understand that Carnatic music has a concepItt called varnamettu.

This refers to a standardised compositional tune for a raga. This tune covers the entire composition from start to finish with minor embellishments or accommodations made in view of changed lyrics.

This is considered an accepted melody that encapsulates the identity of the raga in compositional form

. Hence, one tune in a given raga is used repeatedly by numerous composers and tunesmiths.

‘Nannu brovamani cheppave’ by Bhadrachala Ramadasa,

‘Kathaya Kathaya Madhavam’ by Narayana Tirtha,

‘Nambikettavarillavo rangayya ninna’ by Purandaradasa

are all rendered identically in raga Kalyani.
.
The svarajati ‘Emandayanara’ in huseni raga has multiple siblings!

‘Upacharamulanu’,
‘Janani mamava’,
‘Yarukku ponnambalam’
open similarly.

Tyagaraja’s ‘Manasu svadhina’ and Dikshitar’s ‘Akshaya linga vibho’, both in Shankarabharanam, have identical varnamettu openings.

‘Bhakta parayana’ of Svati Tirunal also follows the same Shankarabharanam varnamettu.

There are many more examples that substantiate my point and I have merely touched the surface, but I will stop here.

Quote ends.

[girish_a]

When Carnatic composers applied Varnamettu, their intentions were benign.

There are no such benign intentions in a predatory desert cult with a long history of appropriating and extinguishing cultures and civilizations.

Their experiments in Carnatic music and Bharatanatyam are inculturation attempts.

So TMK's justifications in Wire article should be thrown into the trash can.

[sam]

PaapaNaasam sivan is known to have used many Thyagaraja kruthis retaining the kruthi structure but changing the lyrics. He is hence known as tamil thyagayya. Are we to throw all PS kruthis into the gutter?

[girish_a]

PaapaNaasam sivan is known to have used many Thyagaraja kruthis retaining the kruthi strzcture but changing the lyrjcs. He is hence known as tamil thyafayya. Are we to throw all PS kruthis into the gutter?

PS belonged to the Hindu tradition. There's no cross cultural appropriation involved here. That said, I don't think changing lyrics is a good practice even within a tradition.

[sam]

I am no admirer of TMK.
However, are not CM And HM using the same melody system.?
Was not venkatamahin himself, a student of HM.?
Did not Gopalakrusha Barathy learn and use Hm ragas?

I am told that Purandaradasa has given us some keertans on religious harmony?

There is another para.
Quote
.let me remind you that Muttusvami Dikshitar transformed ‘God save the gracious king/queen’ to ‘santatam pahimam Sangita shyamale’,where God is most definitely Christian and Dikshitar’s Sangita shyamale, the Hindu goddess of the arts. Dikshitar allowed the ‘other’ to find home within his own being, something we should rejoice and learn from.

Quote ends
.
Leaving alone the political aspect, is TMK right in his examples?

[shankarank]

We should not focus much on who is taking any musical idea. It is more about what values , view points those people espouse viz-a-viz ourselves. Our response should be "if you have something to say about me, I have the same privilege to respond back and say something about you!".

As regards santatam pAhimAm etc., those guys landed in "my land" and were about to loot all with lock stock and barrel (pun intended again), and I cannot take a musical idea that is public domain once it is in the air?

Our tradition and languages do not have "quotation Marks"! So that is the rule in this land! And any scholarly work or other that is based on Indian traditional knowledge , or a music performed in this land of ours also need not be glorified with "Quotation Marks" - meaning dutifully acknowledge the source.

I already gave the example of a remote village community if they adopt a tune from a raga like Arabhi already adopted in a movie song.

Also as regards "tradition" and "traditional music", ours is not religious music in that , it doesn't have any "fixed dogmas". It has a Siksha method and some traditional continuity, We need to twist their language give it back to them you see. It is Europe during "dark" period that destroyed all their classical culture. So "classical" now means dead.

Don't let them to get into sahitya and meaning in a public debate! That belongs to a separate Guru-Sishya Parampara on how that should be explained. Even Grammar is sacred in this tradition. It is for the traditional paramparas to interpret sAhitya in the right sense.

Whoever wants to make some other "lyric" as they call it, let them do so, but don't talk about us or why we have not sung this and that or not admitting this and that.

[sam]

It is about taking an entire kruthi and substituting different words either in the same language or in a different language.
An example may be the film song , 'kaathal kani rasame'. Music by G.Ramanathan based on Naadha thanumanisam by Thyagaraja.
If the words had been of the theme of the original, what is there to complain?

Nagumomu song in naagaswaram took the tune to every hamlet .
No lyrics.
So many of KBS and MMD took classical ragas to the common people through films and they had very good lyrics also.
Mokshamu galata has been sung in telugu as is.
I think Banumathi has sung nagumomu in a film.
Why should we object?

..

[shankarank]

SrI Papanasam Sivan's descendants may sue for royalty or plagiarization in this case, as he himself did with Ariyakudi once . Well I am kidding, as I don't know how copy right laws work or expire in film world!

In your case in general read carefully when I said "don't talk about us", you think that is even a possibility? So there is no way they can take the tune.

[sam]

Recently, I happened to see a talk by TMK, about raaga music in CM, to students in some university in USA.
He spoke about sruthis, swara sthaanams, gamakam, Venkatamahin,
Sampoorna and asampoorna meLa systems, Govindacharya, etc.


"Raga Music & Its Essence by TM Krishna with Akkarai Subhalakshmi & Praveen Sparsh"
Georgea Tech University.

https://youtu.be/p-FHlzMZez8?si=Wh66BSCqgGzmjHZn
..

.
He was saying that each natural raaga has a spirit and soul of its own and not just a question of meLa number and ascending and descending notes.

He was tilting at windmill

He was needlessly berating the sampoorna meLa system, though, I believe that it is the defacto system today.

I think, it was meant for foreign students and second generation diaspora. in USA.

In Chennai, or Bangalore or Hyderaad,
in any sabha, it would sound trite..

Nowadays, neither good voice, nor good style of singing, good stage presence free from over-gesticulations,, nor sensible ideology, nor sense of proportion .
.
Finally, not even the humility and grace to decline the award .
More deserving candidates can be found.
Not too late.
.

[shankarank]

I did see that in entirety! And that will be an interesting discussion if it were to be carried into the sadas. Not sure how many experts in the committee are prepared to have this debate, mindset wise.

If it were to be carried to logical conclusion, then it should result in a decision that Karaharapriya, harikAmbOdhi and most of all naTabhairavi are not ragas. They are all sitting there masquerading using the laya built around them!

And the last one naTabhairavi, if needs Dr MLV to be the pioneer in its exposition, ipso facto it is not a rAgA. Pure virtuosity and skill.

In the set of 6 - san-kara-todi-kal-hari-naTa , we have 3 remaining as rAGAs. Rest of them barring a few like KiravAni, are simply concert toolkit - kutcheri craft.

Something like gamanASramam had to give way to something like pURvikalyANi - imagine that!

And you still want to call Indian music simply rAgA music? Not the southern music.

SrI T.M Krishna has sung sUma SAyaka many times and Dr. Nina Prasad had an elaborate presentation on it in nATya kala conference. In terms of Indian culture and its representation, this RAga and the piece would be enough. Highest form of rasa! It is a naya rAga full of sensuality representing the "jiva" or subject. The vaRNam gait itself is majestic and will represent the Lord PadmanAbha himself. A vibrant Mridangam accompaniment amplifies the majesty inherent in the setting of the composition. The slow winding gait, embodies his Ananta Sayanam. The music itself speaks the bhava of the vARNam.

This is carnaticized Hindustan kApi as noted by expert musicians. So what? Philosophically it is a rAgA in the true essence of what is meant by a "rAgA" since ancient times.

Beyond sahAna and bEgaDa , this rAgA even if it is indirect achievement, nevertheless is a big accomplishment of Carnatic music. Four hours of karaharapriya from (tEr) muTTI to (tEr) muTTI ( muTTikU muTTI) will not equal this 10 minute presentation.

[sam]

As we know, then existing ragas were grouped into the 72 MK meLas...depending on the notes in ascending and descending modes.
Strict Sanchaaram and gamakam rules also have been laid down. And attempts have been made to provide
Western style staff notations.
Later, other composers came up with new combinations.
When does a scale become a raaga?

Thyaagaraja is credited with creating Harikambodhi raaga from the MK notes., through his kruthis..

TMK lecture did not shed any light on that.

It is a topic for experts in musicology. Let us leave it at that.
Let the Sadas decide,

[ram1999]

Looks like the issue has lost its steam. A very few musicians openly expressed their reservations - RG / SR / Ravikiran / DS / VH / Palghat Ramprasad / MSS Grandson. It was just 5-6 artists who were vocal about it and withdrew from performing at the MA and a couple returned the award.

The whole thing has now lost steam completely. Perhaps due to the might of the Academy and its affiliation with the left / DMK party. Quite sad that there were only a handful to protest. That shows how gullible and fearful are the bhramin folks and the lack of unity to support the few that expressed resevations / concerns !!!

[sam]

Ram 1999
You are right Sir.
The community is vulnerable in chennai and generally in the state. This is not so in the other southern states. As shankarank rightly observed, it is not theism vs atheism but targets the community. The poor among the community will be affected. That is why , the muted voice.

[ram1999]

It is quite a sad state.

Even a few members in this group express a neutral view or support the happenings in the name of good music being delivered. What is good music is yet to be desired !!
It is also a fad to be left centric voice for everything in the name of being broad minded.
Total hogwash !!!

[sankark]

"Raga Music & Its Essence by TM Krishna with Akkarai Subhalakshmi & Praveen Sparsh"
Georgea Tech University.

https://youtu.be/p-FHlzMZez8?si=Wh66BSCqgGzmjHZn
..

I think I posted this link a while ago - specifically to call out the s'bharaNam being sa pa ri sa segment/phrase.

On mELa, I think he hits the point home beautifully; theory constructed and then trying to shoehorn the ragams that existed before a codification came into picture and then theory tries to rule the roost is, in fact silly.

https://youtu.be/p-FHlzMZez8?t=6310 and here a bit of arrogance comes through despite his calling out "humility" to music but not 200 years (or X years) of tradition. and a bit of unresolvable tensions he broaches at this point of the lecdem me thinks: what does he mean when he says "raga moves"? does taking a reethigowlai phrase into anandabhairavi means raga moves or is it a phrase within a certain raga has so much "give" and different glides within that overarching phrase/moorchana? what does then grammar mean? these are certain undefinable phrases/words that complicates more than clarifies. ofcourse one can always handwave that it is all "evolving" and the old is cast away and the new emerges.

[sam]

As TMK talked about Raaga system and its evolution, the following material from srinivasaraos blog series on music of India may be useful.


..Karnataka samgita

1.1. The Music of South India was referred to as Karnataka Sangita, perhaps, even slightly prior to 12th century. King Nanyadeva, a prince of a later branch of the Rastrakuta (Karnataka) dynasty who reigned in Mithtili (Nepal) between 1097 and 1133 A.D. in his Sarasvathi-hrdaya-alamkara-hara mentions Karnata-pata tanas.

Further, the Kalyana Chalukya King Someshwara III (1127-1139 AD) in his Manasollasa (also called Abhjilashitarta Chintamani) calls the Music of his times as Karnata Sangita . This, perhaps, is the earliest work where the name Karnataka Sangita is specifically mentioned .

Later, Thulaja the Nayak ruler of Tanjavuru in his ‘Sangita saramruta’ (1729 – 1735) calls the Music that was in vogue at his time as Karnataka Samgita. That was, perhaps, because the authorities and the Lakshana-granthas he quoted in his work were authored by Kannada-speaking scholars.

Later, Sri Subbarama Dikshitar in his ‘Sangita-sampradaya-pradarshini’ (1904) refers to Sri Purandaradasa as ‘Karnataka Sangita Pitamaha’ (father of Karnataka Music).

The contributions of the Kannada scholars in terms of – the Lakshna-grathas that articulated the theoretical aspects of the Music; defining the concept of classifying the Ragas under various Mela-s; refining the elements of Music such as Taala; coining fresh Music terms; and, systematizing the teaching methods , particularly in the early stages of learning – had been truly enormous.

Texts

1.2. One of the reasons for naming the Dakshinadi as Karnataka Samgita could be that in the initial stages of its development and even in later times up to the 18th century the texts delineating the Grammar (Lakshana –grantha) of Music were authored mostly by Kannada speaking Music-scholars (Lakshanika). The texts were, however, written in Sanskrit and not in Kannada.

The notable among such texts (Lakshana–grantha) in question, mention could be made of

: – Manasollasa (also called Abhjilashitarta Chintamani ) ascribed to Kalyana Chalukya King Someshwara III (12th century) ;

: – Sangita-Cudamani of Jagadekamalla (1138 to 1150 AD) – son of king Someshwara , author of Manasollasa;

:- Sangita-sara of Sage Sri Vidyaranya (1320 – 1380) which perhaps was the first text to group (Mela ) Ragas according to their parent scale;

: – Sad-raga-chandrodaya of Pundarika Vittala (1583 approx);

:- Kalanidhi of Catura Kallinatha (Ca,1430), a reputed commentary on on Sarangadeva’s Sangita-ratnakara ; he was in the court of Immadi Devaraya ( aka Mallikarjuna) the King of Vijayanagar (1446-65);

: – Swaramela-Kalanidhi by Ramamatya (Ca.1550) a poet-scholar in the court of Vijayanagar ;

: – Sangita Sudha, attributed to Govindacharya (aka. Govinda Dikshita, Ca 1630);

: – Chaturdandi-Prakasika (a landmark text in Karnataka Sangita) by Venkatamakhin, son of Govinda Dikshita (ca. 1635);

: – Sangraha Chudamani
by Govindacharya (late 17th – early 18th century), which expanded on Venkatamakhi’s work;

:- and,

the Ragalakshanam ( early 18th century) of Muddu Venkatamakhin (maternal grandson of Venkatamakhin) which makes a drastic shift in the concept of Mela, identifies the Raga by the position of its notes (Svara-sthana) and characterizes a Raga by its Aroha and Avaroha ( ascending and descending notes).

Mela

1.3. The practice of grouping (Mela) the Ragas according to their parent scale, it said, was initiated by Sage Vidyaranya in his Sangita-sara (14th century).
Govinda Dikshita (who reverently addresses Sri Vidyarana as: Sri Charana) confirms this in his Sangita-sudha (1614). Sri Vidyaranya classified about 50 Ragas into 15 groups (Mela).

Mela is a Kannada term meaning collection or group; and it is still in use (eg. sammelana – is meeting or conference). Sri Vidyaranya ‘s work on Melakarta system was followed up and improved upon in later times by other Kannada–speaking scholars.

For instance; Ramamatya, following Sri Vidyaranya, in his Svara-mela-kalanidhi classified the then known Ragas into 20 Melas. His classification of Melas was based on five criteria (Lakshana): Amsa (predominant note); Graha (initial note); Nyasa (final note); Shadava (sixth note); and, Audava (pentatonic structure).

Ramamatya was thereafter followed by: Pundarika Vittala (16th century); Venkatamakhin (17th century); and his grandson Muddu Venkatamakhin (18th century).

[sam]

Excerpts from EPW article
....
In September 2017, I heard the Carnatic vocalist TM Krishna sing to a packed auditorium in Mumbai’s cosmopolitan locality of Bandra. The 800-odd-seat St Andrews auditorium usually features English plays, rarely Indian classical music. The music that day was pure Carnatic, the majority of the listeners not South Indian.
Given Carnatic music’s traditional appeal to a narrow band, it was a stunning moment for this esoteric genre.
."TM Krishna:
Chaturdasa Ragamalika.
Violin by akkarai subbulakshmi

https://youtu.be/gPLyGjXcSkU?si=j2VboTzbkHtLSx0e

..

[thanjavooran]

Shri sam,
Excellent. Many thanks for the share.
With wishes,
Thanjavooran
20 04 2024

[ramamatya]

It is quite a sad state.

Even a few members in this group express a neutral view or support the happenings in the name of good music being delivered. What is good music is yet to be desired !!
It is also a fad to be left centric voice for everything in the name of being broad minded.
Total hogwash !!!

True. I've noticed that one user in particular continues to promote tmk in some way, keeping the issue alive while appearing as if he speaks against him. You can readily guess who. That's annoying. I'm not sure what the game is. I'm repulsed when folks act smart.

Btw, Rasikas forum is also fizzling out. Rasikas are tired, I guess.

[ram1999]

Well articulated - as usual...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8d92zVc ... dWdsYWs%3D

[sam]

Well done Sir. True rasikas and devotees of spiritualism, firmly support you.
...
Times of India..6.10.2024

In his petition, V Shrinivasan has alleged that conferring the honour on Krishna would amount to awarding a ‘Bhakti’ prize to an atheist, considering the 'vile, vituperative, and scandalous' attacks made by him against the late Subbulakshmi.
( emphasis mine..sam).

According to Shrinivasan, after the demise of his grandmother in 2004, the academy, along with an English daily, instituted an annual award -- Sangita Kalanidhi M S Subbulakshmi Award – in 2005 to perpetuate her memory. The award, which also carries prize money of Rs 1 lakh, is awarded every year during the Music Academy’s annual concert season in Dec.
On Mar 17, 2024, the academy issued a press release announcing this year’s award to T M Krishna, at the academy’s 98th annual concert season in Dec, the petitioner said.

“The announcement has come as a surprise to the family of Subbulakshmi and has drawn criticism from several respected artists in the field of Carnatic music,” he said. Over the last decade or so, Krishna has unjustifiably resorted to vile, vituperative, and scandalous attacks against Subbulakshmi in the press and on social media, he said.
.
The statements of Krishna are downright disgraceful, unjustifiably questioning the credibility of the renowned singer at the altar of cheap politics. He would not have dared to throw such calumny on the late singer during her lifetime,” he added
. It is obvious that Krishna is floating these canards to score brownie points through cheap publicity. The petitioner and his family, who are legal heirs of Subbulakshmi, have had a tough time grappling with such comments and innuendos. In this backdrop, the choice of the academy to confer the award on Krishna is paradoxical, he said.

"

We are unable to fathom how the academy, which was dear to their matriarch and for whose cause she had actively worked all her life, is now honouring a person who had questioned her credibility in the world of Carnatic music by shaming her name," he said

He added that as per the will executed by Subbulakshmi, there should be no memorial of any kind and that there should be no fund to perpetuate her name and memory. Therefore, the award itself is against the mandate of the late singer.
Therefore, he wanted the court to pass a permanent injunction against the academy or any other person from conferring the award on Krishna at its 98th annual conference in Dec.

[Nick H]

With all due respect for my friend and fellow member cienu, MA is a private organisation, I doubt that the courts will be interested.

[shankarank]

As I have said earlier, Smt. MSS is a public person also! Her work is for the public. The intent of the will is to ensure, somebody does not collect money in her name! If that spirit is not violated, an institution whose building she sang to raise funds for, can remember her in it's own way!

[ram1999]

The commercialism, sabha politics, music artists playing their bit for name & fame have all in total making a great art form stink to no end !!

[sam]

The commercialism, sabha politics, music artists playing their bit for name & fame have all in total making a great art form stink to no end !!

Smt.MS is very special. She had a god-given gift in music and if I am not mistaken, she earned in crores through concerts and royalties but gave them all to public causes,not only for religious purpose but for general purposes like health care as well.
Thiruppathy devasthanam has honoured her memory but not her home state. A disgrace.

[ram1999]

The commercialism, sabha politics, music artists playing their bit for name & fame have all in total making a great art form stink to no end !!

Smt.MS is very special. She had a god-given gift in music and if I am not mistaken, she earned in crores through concerts and royalties but gave them all to public causes,not only for religious purpose but for general purposes like health care as well.
Thiruppathy devasthanam has honoured her memory but not her home state. A disgrace.

My post was not against any invidual but on how the divine music / art form has evolved losing its sanctity totally. MSS was a Great Soul whose music was divine / bhakthi laden and a person who sung for charitable cause !! There of course are quite a few but MSS stands TALL in all respects !

[girish_a]

With all due respect for my friend and fellow member cienu, MA is a private organisation, I doubt that the courts will be interested.

It's not about that. I'm sure even he understands that he won't win the case but I think it is about making a point. The fact that Smt. MS's family objected to the award and went to court ensures that the this Urban Naxal commie will not entirely be seen in benign light in the future.

Look at this video. TMK is listening sympathetically to the nonsense being spewed by a protégé of Cornel West, the infamous Harvard professor who pushes divisive identity theories:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wxf39NVOv6g

Tells you what sort of a character TMK is.

TMK doesn't deserve this award. But he is going to get it anyway, but we need to ensure that the world knows that the award was dumbed down and was controversial. TMK should not be allowed to become a martyr (a badge of honour among commies). The world should know what a despicable man he is and must not see him in a benign light, and this case is a way to register the disgust people feel about him.

[kvchellappa]

Here is a piece that demolishes any argument in favour of TMK's credentials for the award or any justification for the sabha that has chosen the awardee purely for political reasons: https://www.newindianexpress.com/amp/st ... cyvYTjhvBg

[sam]

The major cause of cultural degradation of USA is the Academic community there , which once a preserve of real researchers, now has
Degenerated and the decay has percolated to even the public school system and its teachers.
The interview cited by Chellappa sir, shows how repulsive and venomous is this crirical race theory peddled by urban gang, which misleads the under privileged into ravanchist mindset with dangerous implications for the deprived sections themselves.

This a longtime program of the neo colonial west to undermine Indian social system with its caste system based on occupation.
There is absolutely no place for untouchability in Hindu religion.
The Purusha suktham places the leading ethical intelligensia as the head, appropriately, then the warriors in second place , and the vis, the working and backbone of economic life in the third place. All the others are the common people.
There is no such thing as the fifth group. This is from a speech by lokamaanya Thilak at Lucknow quoted approvingly by Subramanya Bharathy
.Naaraayana Guru showed the correct way to social reform.
Let us be very careful about the reverse nazism of american academics.
TMK is not a leftist. He is just an uncultured and ugly specimen of the hippie crowd. He has always been a pawn of the american deep state to foment trouble in India by encouraging secessionists , tribals and dalits.
Ambedkar was a strong unionist and chose Buddhism and not either the church or mosque or even the Gurudwara, though tbe Grantha Saahib has a lot of poems of our countries Bhakthi saints.
..
I was amused no end by the rejoinder to sri. Srinivasan by the MA who said no family member has objectèd!
..
Everybody in the CM circle knows that
Smt. Radha viswanathan and her yunger sister Vijaya Rajendran (saddasivam's second daughter and kalki's daughter-in-law ) were brought up from very early childhood by Smt. MS. She was more than a mother to them. She was their teacher informally and in Radha's words, a Goddess.
.
The case is not lost yet.

The MA can still pass a resolution, dissociating sangita kalaanidhi award and MSSubbulakshmi award.
They should. ..if atall they have any decency and gratitude
The MSS award can then be given to some other budding artiste of real culture.

[girish_a]

He is Dr. TMK now.

https://x.com/tmkrishna/status/1848299679148044295

https://www.thehindu.com/news/cities/Ti ... 773140.ece

[girish_a]

Something positive in response to TMK's shenanigans:

https://thecommunemag.com/rr-sabha-rena ... s-efforts/

Chennai’s Rasika Ranjani Sabha (RR Sabha), a prominent cultural institution since its founding in 1929, has announced a significant change to its annual Lifetime Achievement Award. This year, in acknowledgment of the contributions made by “Sangeetha Gnanamu”—a rasika-driven initiative aimed at revitalizing the dharmic foundations of Carnatic music—the prestigious award has been renamed the “Sanatana Ratna Award.”

The renaming reflects the sabha’s commitment to honoring the spiritual and devotional essence of Carnatic music, an art form deeply rooted in the region’s cultural and religious traditions. The first recipient of the newly named Sanatana Ratna Award will be the distinguished artist Sri Kaathaadi Ramamurthy, in recognition of his lifelong contributions to the performing arts. The award ceremony is scheduled for 23 October 2024, at 5:30 PM at the RR Sabha premises in Mylapore.

In conjunction with the renaming, the RR Sabha is also introducing a “Carnatic Music Pledge” as part of its programs. The pledge emphasizes a commitment to respecting the devotional and dharmic origins of the music and discourages actions that may undermine these values. This pledge will appear on banners at the sabha and may be administered to performing artists during events.

The move has garnered support from various prominent figures in the Carnatic music community. Vocalist Palghat Ramprasad, alongside several rasikas, has been leading the initiative, with backing from Gurumurthy, Dr. Vaidhyasubramanian of SASTRA University, and advocate J Sai Deepak. Together, they aim to reinforce the cultural and spiritual significance of Carnatic music through these efforts.

The RR Sabha’s decision to embrace the ideals promoted by Sangeetha Gnanamu reflects a broader movement within the Carnatic music community to reconnect with the art form’s sacred heritage, especially amidst the controversy surrounding TM Krishna’s Sangita Kalanidhi award. As the sabha continues to support the preservation of this legacy, the renaming of the award serves as a meaningful step towards fostering a deeper appreciation for the traditional values that have shaped Carnatic music.

[ram1999]

An excellent speech (as always) by Sri Gurumurthy

https://youtu.be/jH1Gd2WuDEc?si=4nuUn388ugHpNAlM

[ram1999]

Few artists have revolted. However, more artists / rasikas should come forward, boycott the concert series at Music Academy including those who go on canteen hunt and not for music..... These guys should be stripped and exposed !!

[girish_a]

The man has sent a hollow, crass and vulgar response in the case. Be warned: sensitive minds will find this painful.

https://swarajyamag.com/culture/t-m-kri ... ngs-hollow

[shankarank]

This was the original article, that is the subject matter of controversy: https://caravanmagazine.in/reportage/ms ... bbulakshmi.

There were many reactions to that, and everybody thought that he was talking about MS. Of course, if the title was a good click bait, using an icon's name in one of the sites of the then mushrooming boutique left media, funded by familiar corporates, it had to have few things about her, won't it?

But the intention was to rail against patriarchy etc., as well as the insular world of Carnatic music, which had its view of what and who is "classical"!

And then his own equation of manodharma with the fads of "art" and "creativity" in the new era of the educated. The violence of English language!

Reflecting on that article, from the current times, if the classical world, then was truly insular and cherished some specific values so much that, they would reject or think low of one of their own icons that they themselves helped create, that should be a reason to rejoice! Isn't that how a traditional system is supposed to work?

There will be Vidushi's like Smt. MSS who will carry the music to the wider world with whatever it takes. But the core system should value its own specific preferences, shouldn't it?

But the question is, did they do it adequately?? Why did I not hear chatter about S. Kalayanaraman or Ramnad Krishnan sitting in Madurai? Did they value the followers of SSI school who preserved his pAThAntarams meticulously enough? These vidvans, didn't need popularity, but a healthy base of appreciation! Did that happen enough? For the all the views of classicism held by the cognoscenti.

We have heard many musicians even recently in the last 10 years, how they were never called to perform in the 80s, 90s.

Sri SV Krishnan of naada inbam, spoke after Smt. Kalpagam Swaminathan's performance and mentioned, she was wary of venturing into a performance thinking, will adequate people turn up, in the new internet era then the year 2001 or so. She was later apparently astonished that not only there were good audience in the morning , but a review of yours truly, a naive rasika writing , appeared in Sangeetham.com , within 24 hours!. Sri TT Narendran made some ammending remarks to mellow my adhiga prasangitanam.

Shashank's father told me personally ( it is OK to name names in this instance , what damage is going to occur after all this?!), how the entire eco system saw to it that Ramnad Krishnan did not receive his due! A man who not only sang with the "feminine grace" of the adopted Bani, but with the verve and Laya of the masculine variety.

The comparison between Smt. MSS and her well known contemporaries like MLV and DKP is down right silly! All three of them received adequate recognition. The international stuff is all something beyond core music appreciation and is a specific vehicle chosen by one artist.

And coming to MLV and her legacy specifically, recently I heard an interesting take by an insider of Smt. MSS circle. In Smt. MSS school ( I guess there was not much of it beyond the family, but this person claims to have had a presence), there won't be this strident (aditthu pAdutal) approach to renditions. Then I recalled, what I noticed in Smt MLV's older recordings. A Cine sweet voice beating it all down in classical concerts! I felt a bit of pity for her. And this person continued, "you will see how MLV's proteges like Sudha simply moved off that strident approach! - they all understood"

If at all the criticism of the classical eco system needs to be made, it is that, they did not adequately back up their own insularity and classicial preferences.

We rasikas at large will receive the music of MSS, BMK, and more like Jesudas, Kunnakudi etc. We will take care of them, you don't need to worry. They don't need your critical acclaim. What the hell you were doing?

[sam]

It so happened that veterans like ARI, MVI, Musiri, Chembai, GNB, MMI and even SSI, reached a wider audience through 78 rpm records.
Ramnad Krishnan, Kalyanaraman and a few such, failed to make best use of modern media . Ofcourse, it could not be records but casettes. And merit needs advertisement and promotion. In any field. One needs a USP.

The challenge was to give a fine portrayal of raagam with lyrics, even with aalaap, and swarams within a maximum of 2 x 3.5 minutes per side of the plate
. Even great vocalists cannot escape voice limitations due to age.

Not every one had a grundig.
..
Nor can everyone attend concerts.

1936 to 1950, happened to be the best period for Carnatic summer and radio was the only medium.
Besides gramaphone records.
.
VaNDaadum solai thanile in harikambodhi lyrics by kalki as 78 rpm record is one such gem. It was a solo.
TMK has referred to that 78 rpm record.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1dokUTs ... p=drivesdk
பாதத் தாமரைகள் நொந்திட,

பார்தனில் எனைத் தேடிவந்தவன்.
பாதத் தாமரைகள் நொந்திட
பாதத் தாமரைகள் நொந்திட
பார்தனில் எனைத் தேடிவந்தவன்.
பாதத் தாமரை
பாதத் தாமரைகள் நொந்திட
பார்தனில் எனைத் தேடிவந்தவன்.

மாயவன் மதுரை மைந்தன் ,
மாயவன் மதுரை மைந்தன்

,மறைகள் பறையும் மாயன் அவனோ
வண்டாடும் சோலைதனிலே
,கண்டெனதுள்ளம் கொண்டான், சகியே

வண்டாடும் சோலைதனிலே
சகியே
சகியே

For Smt.MS, her best voice was between 1940 to 1950.
A sample here.
Meera (1947):
Baso morey nainan mein nandalala"
.kalyaaNi
https://youtu.be/nZdCCqpyZ3w?si=Aztnx7DSYPCJqVnE

'Mora mukuta makarakruthi kundala
'मोर मुकुट,
मकराकृति कुण्डल,
....
अरुण तिलक
दिये भाल ।।

Nearly 80 years have gone.

Ŵe of much later generation, have no idea, of the MS miracle in concert platform between 1936 ( age 20) and 1955 ( age 39) , because not a single concert of that period is available.
We can only surmise, how blissful it would have been, by listening to her 78 rpm records.
Surely, a generation of great and discerning listeners, who were raving about her, could not have been all that wrong.
(It was also the great decade of Smt.NCV.
How many of the y2k have even heard of that name?.)
Only very recently, Naadhabrungha team has uploaded so many of her concerts in music adademy from 1955 to 1968.
Others like VaaK also have uploaded many more concerts in other venues like Bombay .
.
Why ,very learned music critics, shy away from reviewing all those full concerts of those decades, not only of Smt MSS but of all the greats of that period, is puzzling.

A review is not a song list . It is sharing the listener's appreciation of specific moments and where needed , a critical renark if atall, about the slips if any.

A conceited narcissist is no better judge of Smt.MSS, than the greats like Chembai, Chowdiah, Sambasiva Iyer,
Musiri, Aalathoor and north indian HN greats.
.
And literally millions all over the world.
.
If anybody thinks that MS is all time great because of her bajans and recitations, he/she is grossly ignorant.
.
The plain fact is that we have not heard her concerts, even radio concerrs of the period 1940 -1955.
She was a continuous learner.
I have not come across any critical comment about her rendition from any erudite person, except that she often sang the same set of songs in concerts.

So did another genius MMI.

As Sanjay has remarked somewhere, it is not a big defect. Very often, genius like MMI, educated the listeners, incrementally. A mix of popular kruthis and new items.
Almost all the concert artistes follow that pattern.
Manodharmam can be found in fleeting flashes of niravals, by sensitive ears...
If we seriously hunt in the web, Smt,MS has sung atleat 150 kruthis of Thyagaraja, (out of about 600)!35 of Shyama sastry ( incidentally..the three swara jathis rendering are beyond camparison) . out of about 70,
Atleast 50 of Dikshitar krutis,(out of 500], another 50 of Swathi thirunaaL kruthis.
Hundreds of so many tamil, kannada and sanskrit krutis of many more composers).
Sufficiently large repertoire.
.
I have not come across any instance when she spoke critically of anybody.
Thus, she was wonderful personality.
besides being a great artiste.
.
Seers like Kaanchi Aacharya, in the lineage of Govinda Diksitar, and who could correct the legends, have blessed her.
That is what matters ln life.
Only the slum jeers at her.

[shankarank]

Commercial Cassette boom was later in mid 80(s) or so. For Ramnad earlier and Kalyanaraman, spool tapes were used to record their concerts, so we get to hear them. Coming to think of that, my late mentor in listening, the Tanjore Marathi Grundig tape collector, was witness to SrI Kalayaraman recording many cassette lessons for I think, Sri Lankan students and shipping them - they were both staying in the same adjacent rooms in Chennai in the former's student days I believe.

However, we are hearing about how one artist was marketed and packaged worldwide by one person. While a whole community of what? 10 streets in the few enclaves of Carnatic music (within the few metros of Southern India), could not sustain in a minimal way other exemplary artistes, just one or two generations afterwards.

While big Sabha organizers did their part, rasikas did not do enough to carry it further is my peeve. They did not treat it is as a true sacred knowledge system.

By the time of YACM , early 90s, artistes had to organize their own concerts!

Are we to find reasons for this in the general direction of the country at that time? If we do so, why are we consuming the same failed methods that failed the nation at large being applied to music.

The one artiste quoted in that article as critical of Smt. MSS, was mostly expressing his/her frustration of lack of support for music in general at that time, in this form.

The term "insular" attributed to the Carnatic music world is eerily a kind of term, a colonial system would apply to a cherished culture, held sacred by a community.

This was what the education system and it's critical theories have taught the people!

There is/was a French organizer , I heard from reliable sources ( [:cough:] , I am using familiar media lines) , who visits/visited Chennai , purveys the Carnatic scene, doesn't talk to any one or consult any one, selects artistes to invite by himself/herself. We would have also heard of two artistes honoured by the coveted French award.

We won't learn those things from the French , only the failed leftist theories!

[sam]

A rare real video. 1997.
MS award and concert.
She was 81 then.
Sri.Sadasivam 95, gives a brief speech.
Semmangudi Srinivasa Iyer too.
NRam is seen. Also TTK People.
The occasion was in connection with a mandapam for the sage of Kanchi.
.
Watch "M S Subbulakshmi Award and Concert 1997" on YouTube
.
https://youtu.be/MEKTUByvpjw?si=KfpureqkBJbhERdl