Suggestions for quiz

vasya10 · Post by **vasya10** » 21 Jan 2007, 20:48

i think the tamil song is "kannukkul nooru nilava" from vedam pudidu.

Vasya - it is very dangerous to try and guess a raga by what an artiste usually sings

Yes, thanks mohan. Lesson learnt

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 21 Jan 2007, 21:12

Vasya
The ShaNmukhapriya song is from a Malayalam movie.

rajeshnat · Post by **rajeshnat** » 21 Jan 2007, 21:23

DRS,
The Shanmughapriya malayAlam clip I got it. Actually I have heard very few malayAlam songs in my life.But this movie is the only malayAlam casette that I bought. I have heard rewinding and forwarding 100 times in my old recorder when I was in college and the tape got stuck with the recorder once when I heard pramadavanam vendum. But certainly this particular song did not interest me as much as other 2 songs in the film (devasabhathalam and pramadhavanam vendum)

The answer is gOpikA vasantham - shanmughapriya - movie is His highness abdullah and the music director is raveendran, the singers are chitra and the great yesudAs. You will hear DRS clip before the 2nd stanza.
http://www.musicindiaonline.com/music/m ... name.3343/

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 21 Jan 2007, 21:26

Great detection Rajesh Holmes. Yep Thats the song.

jayaram · Post by **jayaram** » 21 Jan 2007, 21:44

Darn, I must have heard this song at least thousand times...! (even sung it infront of small groups

)
Good one, DRS!

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 21 Jan 2007, 23:21

WoW!
The discussion provoked is more interesting than the Quiz itself. This is a block-buster. The Garland-maker has hit the jack-pot in this Production!
Three cheers for our Rasikapriya DRS.

Many approaches to solving the Quiz depending on the individual proclivity have been discussed. The common one is trying to recollect a kriti where the 'tune' would occur. The interesting one is that of Mohan who shutsup the sahitya and just listens to the notes (perhaps experimenting simultaneously on the keyboard!). While I tried (actually struggled) though the 'tunes' were familiar (most of them) I was unable to yank out an answer from my aging memory banks. I mentally tried to extend the aalaapana further filling-in with my imagination and often it led to multiple ragas and as I said I did not like 'playing the dice'. Now I would request DRS to explain how he himself will approach answering such a Quiz. Thanks to you all. You are all winners; and congratualtions to one and all (not just Mohan

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 22 Jan 2007, 02:27

Lets take the naThabhairavi clip that I posted. The swaras that SSI has sung in that clip are

S*R*G*M* M*G*R*S* NDN S*R*G*G*R*S* NDPDN S*R*G*S*,

One has to first make out the swarasthAnas clearly. As many of you in fact the majority of the responders identified the rAga as ShaNmukhapriya, it is clear that one could identify this as a sampUrNa rAga and mELa rAga. So it will be a lame excuse to say one rules out janyas by "arakorai" logic or such inanities. One has to be methodical in approach and use common-sense here.

To make it clearer further, as you can notice by the emboldened parts in the swara, the patterns of "SRGM", "MGRS", "SNDP" & "PDNS are clearly seen and this pretty much rules out the possibilty of a janya rAgas.

Catching the Suddhamadhyama is down to listening carefully and not jumping to conclusions. Especially when the clip is so short, always listen to the very end and dissect each swara to ensure the swarsthAnas have been discerned correctly. This done, the possibilty of goig wrong is very small.

SO clearly, we have to use a combination, of pattern maching, note-recognition and also ruling out some possibilities.

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 22 Jan 2007, 02:30

naThabhairavi being a not so-often heard rAga, one tends to pick up ShaNmukhapriya which is better known. But there is very likely some kind of dissonance when one tries to hear ShaNmukhapriya. this should alert us to the possibility of something being amiss. M1-M2 differentiation is crucial, not just here but in CM itself. While it is entirely plausible that we make mistakes sometimes in this recognition, there can be no "excuses" for not getting that right

ramakriya · Post by **ramakriya** » 22 Jan 2007, 07:32

rajeshnat wrote:The answer is gOpikA vasantham - shanmughapriya - movie is His highness abdullah and the music director is raveendran, the singers are chitra and the great yesudAs. You will hear DRS clip before the 2nd stanza.
http://www.musicindiaonline.com/music/m ... name.3343/

That's why I felt it was so familiar ! This was one of the 2 Malayalam movie cassettes which I must have listened to hundreds of times in early 90's. (Other being bharatam)

Thanks for the link rajeshnat

-Ramakriya

rbharath · Post by **rbharath** » 22 Jan 2007, 09:59

divakar wrote:
Swara 2- SSI singing swaras for tyAgarAja's cEtulAra SRngAramu !!
cEtulAra sRngAramu is sung in 'bhairavi', isnt it?

cEtulAra sRngAramu is rendered in kharaharapriyA by Smt R Vedavalli. SSI used to sing it in naTabhairavi, and there is a bhairavi version as well.

I am told the khpriyA version is the original. apparently ppl chose to change the rAgam in the 1940s-1950

rbharath · Post by **rbharath** » 22 Jan 2007, 10:17

DRS, when is the next round?

srinidhi · Post by **srinidhi** » 22 Jan 2007, 11:04

How were the points awarded? 1 point for every answer?

srinidhi · Post by **srinidhi** » 22 Jan 2007, 11:12

Am i the only one who got confused asaveri with Dhanyasi????

I wrote Dhanyasi for Asaveri

Dhanyasi and asaveri are a bit similar, but for those who got confused, a listen to DRS's lec dem on asaveri should clear away all doubts. If anybody wants I can post it (the lec dem) tommorrow morning.

divakar · Post by **divakar** » 22 Jan 2007, 13:33

cEtulAra sRngAramu is rendered in kharaharapriyA by Smt R Vedavalli. SSI used to sing it in naTabhairavi, and there is a bhairavi version as well.

rbharath, thanks for clarifying this point.

i've heard MLV and Chembai sing this kriti in bhairavi.

interesting! a tyAgarAja kriti being rendered in several rAgas.

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 22 Jan 2007, 17:06

rbharath wrote:DRS, when is the next round?

Tonight

It will be another theory round.

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 22 Jan 2007, 17:06

srinidhi wrote:How were the points awarded? 1 point for every answer?

1 Point for each subdivision (a,b,c). Totally 20 marks.

srinidhi · Post by **srinidhi** » 22 Jan 2007, 17:34

Thanks for clarifying DRS. I should have scored only 4 or 5. Thanks for being generous.

MaheshS · Post by **MaheshS** » 22 Jan 2007, 17:36

srinidhi wrote:
Am i the only one who got confused asaveri with Dhanyasi????

I wrote Dhanyasi for Asaveri
Dhanyasi and asaveri are a bit similar, but for those who got confused, a listen to DRS's lec dem on asaveri should clear away all doubts. If anybody wants I can post it (the lec dem) tommorrow morning.

Hmm I didn't confuse it, when I heard the clip, the first thing that came to mind was Ra ramainti - the bard's krithi in the raga.

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 22 Jan 2007, 20:23

I think 24 hours (not 12 as the 1st round) should suffice for the theory round. What do you all think?

SangithaRasika · Post by **SangithaRasika** » 22 Jan 2007, 20:57

Srinidhi, Please post the lec demo in Asaveri ... I wrote Dhanyasi too ! Also, i think we are more exposed to Dhanyasi than Asaveri in terms of songs and kritis which tricks our mind in thinking it is Dhanyasi if you arent a keen listener like me.

I am bringing this up as I got both swaraprasthara wrong (wrote Shanmukapriya as many did and the other one was way off )
The following might be just my lack of knowledge but no harm in trying to understand better from you people -
When I hear the swaraprastaras(not all but a few) of SSI or Alathur Bros(more than SSI) , if it is a long fast one and I hear it from the middle (without listening to the song or aalapana) I need more time to tell what raga it is than when I listen to say MMI, KVN or MDR etc. I think sometimes in the speed with which they(SSI, AB) render the gamakas are less pronounced which makes the contour of the raga fade into the background(or even lose it sometimes) and brings 'kanakkus' to the forefront. This process will make my mind ponder for the raga as I recognise the raga more by a gamaka and less by swara sthana(once I deduced Gowrimanohari by swarasthana, I was very happy I did it that way and got it confirmed !! ) .
Coming back, Has anyone experienced this during SSI or Alathur Bros swarprasthara rendition ?

-SR

ramakriya · Post by **ramakriya** » 22 Jan 2007, 22:23

Few quick tricks to differenciate asAvEri from dhanyAsi

asAvEri has s r m p d s while dhanyAsi has s g m p n s in the ArOhaNa mUrchane, which are quite distant from each other

In asAvEri in sanchAras like s r m, the rishabha can be shuddha or chatussruti;

In avarOhaNa mUrchane , look for s n s p, which is a very characteristic asAvEri sanchAra.

One sanchAra which might cause confusion is m p g.. r s which looks OK in both rAgas.

For more details, listen to the lecdem

-Ramakriya

ramakriya · Post by **ramakriya** » 22 Jan 2007, 22:39

drshrikaanth wrote:I think 24 hours (not 12 as the 1st round) should suffice for the theory round. What do you all think?

That looks OK to me ...

-Ramakriya

ramakriya · Post by **ramakriya** » 23 Jan 2007, 00:16

venkatpv wrote:its from a BMK-LGJ-UKS concert... sundari nee divya rupamu. the concert is available on surasa.net

For those who might be intereted, at the very end of tha AlApane, there is another nice grahabhEda by LGJ, to shuddha dhanyasi. ( 1963 Bombay concert); In the swara prastAra, there is grahabhEda to mOhana and hindOLa too.

-Ramakriya

Suji Ram · Post by **Suji Ram** » 23 Jan 2007, 00:37

drshrikaanth wrote:I think 24 hours (not 12 as the 1st round) should suffice for the theory round. What do you all think?

Should be fine with me too.

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 23 Jan 2007, 05:09

Friends
The Round 3 of the quiz is comig up shortly. It is going to be a theory round. Good luck.

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 23 Jan 2007, 05:36

Its up now.

mohan · Post by **mohan** » 23 Jan 2007, 11:43

Some real curly questions this time. I think I will be lucky to pass!

coolkarni · Post by **coolkarni** » 23 Jan 2007, 11:54

I will prefer to carry the Drinks for this Test match.

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 23 Jan 2007, 12:00

Yes mohan!
Some real curly questions this time. I think I will pass to be lucky

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 23 Jan 2007, 16:58

All of you- Please feel free to refer to your texts. The quiz is about learning and encouraging to refer to sources.

mohan · Post by **mohan** » 23 Jan 2007, 17:08

Oh this is an open book exam

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 23 Jan 2007, 21:32

Only 4 entries received so far- ammamaha, venkatpv, ksrimech and Vijay(Only just). Come on guys. Buck up!

vijay · Post by **vijay** » 23 Jan 2007, 21:36

Oh...didn't see that part about looking up texts (although I did look up my HM CM charts) - anyway, I don't think it would have helped much.

rajeshnat · Post by **rajeshnat** » 23 Jan 2007, 21:52

Who elaborated the 90 mELa system?

quizmaster , I have heard 19 mELa , by any chance is there a 90 too??? Can you crosscheck ?

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 23 Jan 2007, 21:53

Rajesh
Just answer the questions.

rbharath · Post by **rbharath** » 23 Jan 2007, 22:20

i wish to leave this round in choice.

arunk · Post by **arunk** » 23 Jan 2007, 22:36

drs,

i wont have time until this evening (my time - US central). This is sort of a lame excuse - i dont have my reference books here with me and i forgot to bring one which i was planning to

Arun

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 23 Jan 2007, 22:38

Arun
Try and get your entry in as soon as you can.

More entries received- vijay, vasya10, srinidhi

(Updated at 10PM GMT)- rbharath, rajeshnat, Ramakriya, Lakshman

ramakriya · Post by **ramakriya** » 24 Jan 2007, 03:31

DRS.

I have sent in my entry 3-4 hours ago..

-Ramakriya

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 24 Jan 2007, 03:50

Received Ramakriya. I have edited the above post and updated the list. Still some more to come

Mohan, Suji, Ranjani, Sriram, Jayaram, Sridevi, arunk- where are your entries guys?

I have seen all of you except Jayaram online today. Come one. Send them fast!

sridevi · Post by **sridevi** » 24 Jan 2007, 03:53

just sent mine in too... As DRS suggested I opened my books ( after dusting them off first...

Sridevi

ramakriya · Post by **ramakriya** » 24 Jan 2007, 04:06

drshrikaanth wrote:I have seen all of you except Jayaram online today. Come one. Send them fast!

The online indicator is not always correct - Some people (like me) never log out - So we are always shown as being online!

-Ramakriya

Suji Ram · Post by **Suji Ram** » 24 Jan 2007, 04:08

Sent mine..
Open book?....one with best googling skills wins .

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 24 Jan 2007, 04:11

ramakriya wrote:The online indicator is not always correct - Some people (like me) never log out - So we are always shown as being online!

It will log you out automatically once you close the window. ACtually you dont show up online all the time.

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 24 Jan 2007, 04:13

Suji Ram wrote:Sent mine..
Open book?....one with best googling skills wins .

Suji, did I note a bitter tinge in your post? If you note, I actually said referring to "Texts" was ok. But people took Google as included as well. Even so, I can assure you that some answers are not available on google. i did a search first:) Also, to be able to do a search, one has to have a clear idea of the answer to be able to search properly. Many questions are in such a format. SO, no the effect of googling skills is minimised.

Suji Ram · Post by **Suji Ram** » 24 Jan 2007, 04:16

DRS
You are right.

jayaram · Post by **jayaram** » 24 Jan 2007, 05:23

DRS - just sent you my answers. Today has been a very busy day for me, just had about 2 hours to spend on this quiz. Maybe next time we should keep this on a Friday?

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 24 Jan 2007, 05:30

5 more entries received adding up to a total of 15

Sridevi, Suji Ram, Mohan, Tanjavur, Jayaram.

Should we extend the time for this?

jayaram · Post by **jayaram** » 24 Jan 2007, 05:31

DRS - To be fair, I think you should stick to the previously agreed time deadlines.

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 24 Jan 2007, 05:33

Its only to be fair to those who have not had time that am thinking of extending. I did this for the first round too. Are we not being unfair to people who have been unable to send their entries for whatever reasons?