Jayachamaraja Odeyar (Mysore Maharajah) - Part II

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 15 Oct 2005, 06:14

DRS/others

Please continue the discussions where we left off while the old-ones are getting restored.
Thanks

srkris · Post by **srkris** » 15 Oct 2005, 06:18

Yes, please continue the odeyar thread here, while I restore the older thread. Anyways Odeyar has become too famous to merit just one thread

I am giving here the last 10 posts in the thread to help you recollect the discussion:

Thanks DRS.
Is this the first composed by odeyaar?
I would appreciate other etymological derivations of nArAyaNA!

kapila munivaradAyakam
Kapila was a great devotee of Vinaayaka who blessed him and gave him the cintAmaNi (wishing stone) which he gave to Indra. He was the one who burned the 60,000 sons of sagara and bhagIrata brought the ganges to purify and send them to heaven

Are there other renderings of this fine lyric?

Yes this is indeed the first composition by oDeyar and it was composed on 17-8-1945.

SrIvidyA citprabhAnanda rAja yOgIndravanditam - Him worshipped by citprabhAnanda who is king and yOgi at the same time (this is a clear reference to oDeyar himself) - Yes - citprabhAnanda being his dIksha nAma.

SrI cAmuNDESvari dEvi-kannaDa-Adi tALa rendered by Rudrapattnam Bros - posted on bboard by simhapuravasi

http://rapidshare.de/files/6095258/02-s ... annada.mp3

DRS ji,
I was interested to know the meaning of 'Sindhurapriyam'.What is the relevance of this line?
Interestingly,HMB refers to Ganapathi as 'Kumkuma Sharira' in his Kanada composition-'Vara Siddhi Vinayaka.Sumuka'.

Kartik
Purandara dasa starts as
"sri gaNanaatha sindUravarNa..."
and hence association of kumkum with vinaayaka is an ancient concept. Is it because kumkum is his favourite or because he has that hue (being smeared by kumkum) since he is descried as white coloured elsewhere, I don't know. I would love to know if there is a puraNic reference in this context...

Meena

Nice work!

j~nAnamudrAlankRtam

This could simply mean that he is in the form of praNava (praNavaakaaram (see MD's vaataapi)).

Technically, j~naanamudra is:
"tarjanya^NguShThakau saktau agaratO vinyasEt h^Ridi|
vAmahastAmbujaM vAmajAnumUrdhani vinyasEt|
j~nAnamudrA bhavEt EShA rAmacandrasya prEyasI||"
I have not however seen vinaayaka in this posture in any representations!

Meena
You read my mind in posting the kannaDa kRti by rudrapaTNa brothers!

DRS ji,
I was interested to know the meaning of 'Sindhurapriyam'.What is the relevance of this line?
Interestingly,HMB refers to Ganapathi as 'Kumkuma Sharira' in his Kanada composition-'Vara Siddhi Vinayaka.Sumuka'.
karthik
The sAhitya is sindUrapriyam not sindhura which means elephant. Sorry for error in the lyric. But I had corrected it in the meaning that I posted. Meena has aptly pointed out sindUravarNa (or sinduravarNa) in purandaradAsa`s piLLAri gIte. There are 16 (32) well-recognized forms of gaNapati iconographically. Some of them such as rakta gaNapati and mahAgaNapati are red in complexion. Red is also a reference to rajas (guNa).

j~nAnamudrAlankRtam

This could simply mean that he is in the form of praNava (praNavaakaaram (see MD's vaataapi)).

Technically, j~naanamudra is:
"tarjanya^NguShThakau saktau agaratO vinyasEt h^Ridi|
vAmahastAmbujaM vAmajAnumUrdhani vinyasEt|
j~nAnamudrA bhavEt EShA rAmacandrasya prEyasI||"
I have not however seen vinaayaka in this posture in any representations!
This particular kRti of oDeyar clearly addresses mahAgaNapati, one of the 32 forms of gaNapati I mentioned earlier. mahAgaNapati is ruddy of complexion and does show j~nAna mudre.
Please peruse this page showing pictures of an giving some iconographical details of the 32 forms. mahAgaNapati is number 13 in the series here. The sketch clearly shows j~nAnamudre in the right lower hand close to the chest.

http://www.himalayanacademy.com/resourc ... ch-05.html

Had been to Mysore yesterday and was thrilled to see Mother Chamundeswari in all her splendour.

I also picked up a Kannada book on the patronage extended by Odeyars to the field of music(Department of archeology)..Has very nice writeups on many musicians who adorned the court of the Maharaja, while describing in detail about the contribution of His Highness himself.Also picked up a book on mummadi,

The Oriental Research Insitute in the University of Mysore has published the 3 volumes of Sri Tattva Nidhi.Every month between the 1st and 4th they extend a discount of 20-25% on the books.Each vol costs about 600 but the printing is topnotch.

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 15 Oct 2005, 09:13

DRS
Time to discuss aTaaNaa the prince among ragas. I know this is a raga whose spirit cannot be captured using its Aro/Avaro.

coolkarni

Is there a nice aTaaNaa RTP?

meena · Post by **meena** » 15 Oct 2005, 10:41

Kji/DRS/RC

aThANa AIR clip pl. or was it u/l???

coolkarni · Post by **coolkarni** » 15 Oct 2005, 19:17

atana clip was not there in my original bunch of 56.
must have been uploaded by DRS.

ATANA TRACKS.. will start looking for them.
got really rusty these last two weeks

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cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 15 Oct 2005, 20:03

aDaaDaa!
aThANA is throwing a spanner in our discussions. We never had an official (AIR) posting. Coolkarni had posted Neyyatinkara Vasudevan's rendering in response to my claiming that JC has not been rendered by concert artists. Also Shankar (I think) posted santhaanam's commercial version. I grudgingly accepted that. I certainly would like to know why this great (arthagarbhita) lyric is not more popular since it is also the very first of Odeyar. Has RKS rendered it? Again i am a little mystified that the first kriti of JC is in aThANA rather than in hamsadhvani or nATTai. DRS did harangue me on the choice of the raga,

but I am not giving up. My surmise is that JC perhaps was a rebel who wanted to break tradition and was on a war-path.

What more is appropriate than aThaaNa for that purpose (RC any historical insights).

Now I am waiting to be blasted by DRS and his gems of wisdom enlightening me (us) re: aThaaNaa

coolkarni

please post your best aThaaNa (maybe a HM ally too!). Time for mourning is over. Pl come out and join the 'grihayag~nyam'.

coolkarni · Post by **coolkarni** » 15 Oct 2005, 20:27

atana

starting with a wonderful sloka
http://rapidshare.de/files/6314719/trs- ... a.mp3.html

will put up some more nice ones of akc.trs,tns,manakkal within a day

coolkarni · Post by **coolkarni** » 15 Oct 2005, 21:27

http://rapidshare.de/files/6315537/trs- ... a.mp3.html
(The last 4 minutes of swaras are simply breathtaking !!)

http://rapidshare.de/files/6316136/trs- ... a.mp3.html

http://rapidshare.de/files/6317021/trs- ... a.mp3.html

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 15 Oct 2005, 22:19

What a delightful musical shower! it has put out the fire that tried to deter us!

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 15 Oct 2005, 22:20

...also the end of the drought...

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 16 Oct 2005, 01:14

aThANa is, as CML has correctly summed, a rAga that cannot be reduced to a scale. It is traditionally allocated a ubhaya sampUrNa scale. It is placed under the harikEdAragauLa or harikAmbOdhi mELa. Exceptions are more than the rule. During the present day, aThANa has lot of N3 and is also placed under dhIraSamkarAbharaNa, the 29th mELa. But N2 is invariably associated with D as an anuswara. It can also be placed under kharaharapriya comfortably as G2 also occurs. In places, shades of darbAr are palpably evident.
N2 and G2 are bhAShAnga swaras. N2 and N3 and many shades inbetween as also G2 and G3 and the intermediate shades are profusely seen. Also, contemporary aTHANa does not seem to have a straight SRGM or RGM usage. mudduvEnkaTamakhi`s gIte starts on "GPDS" which is not seen in current-day version. RMPN is the usual way of ascent with PDNS also occuring often. D is the most important swara. DP is always renderd as DN2P.
It is a uttarAnga pradhAna rAga with not too many forays below M. The lowest that one can go is upto the mandra dhaivata with most sancAras stopping at N3 itself. S*N3S*, *SN3D~ are seen with N3. N3 occurs when descending from S* and ascending again. There are many phrases where N2 or N3 can occur interchangeably. At times it is best not to try and reduce it to either swara.
There is a beautiful AditAL varNa of vINe subbaNa in the rAga. This rAga is considered dESIya and is very suitable for rendering SlOka and in operas, harikathe etc. Its essence can be very quickly captured in a phrase or two. Singing the rAga may not be too diffivult but swaraprastAra is a challenge to and a measure of ones vidwat.
oDeyar`s kRti is a lovely piece. MD`s bRhaspatE is a masterpiece portraying the rAga in all its majest in viLamba pace as only MD can do. sakalagrahabala nIne is purandara dAsa`s masterpiece in madhyamakAla.
Coolkarni
Can you post tyAgarAja`s "mummUrtulu gumigUDi". The first I heard this kRti live was by nAgmani Srinath in Tyagaraja gGana sabha (Vani school, rajaji Nagar, Bangalore). A great piece. Any varNas or rare pieces are welcome. Any MD`s kRtis are a treat including bRhaspatE.

rshankar · Post by **rshankar** » 16 Oct 2005, 03:45

skris: GREAT to see this site up and running again! (reminds me of the famous movie song by the Mangeshkar sisters from Mother India: 'gir girke musIbath pE samBalthE hi rahEngE, jal jAyE magar Ag pE chalthE hi rahEngE' - the never say die attitude!).
Here are a couple of tamizh songs - some of my personal favorites - in aTAnA:
This one is specially for CML - an aTAnA by NCV:
http://rapidshare.de/files/6331193/05_y ... _.m4a.html

The next is a padham by Smt. Vyjayanthimala Bali and party. The song is by Kavi Kunjara Bharati (the grandfather of Koteeshwara Iyer, who called himself 'kunjara dasan' in obeisence to his grandfather):
http://rapidshare.de/files/6331563/02_p ... _.m4a.html

BTW, isn't the song 'varugirAL unnai thEdi' from an old tamizh movie that Padmini dances to (MLV was the playback singer) also in aTAnA?

Has rapidshare decided not to send links via email anymore?
I did not get emails for the last 2 uploads.
Ravi

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 16 Oct 2005, 03:47

karthik_kris wrote

The Oriental Research Insitute in the University of Mysore has published the 3 volumes of Sri Tattva Nidhi.Every month between the 1st and 4th they extend a discount of 20-25% on the books.Each vol costs about 600 but the printing is topnotch.

SrI tattva nidhi is excluded from this discount offer. The rate is same anyday, anytime.

. If one is looking for a discount, it is wiser to buy the book from a shop in Bangalore (Sahitya Bhandara or Geetha book House in Chikpet) where a 10% discount is available. One may get the discount in Sapna book stall too.

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 16 Oct 2005, 04:25

Thsnks very much shankar! aThANA in the golden voice of NCV brings back pleasant memories. There is also another nice one which was popular in those days 'yaarunthanaippOl aatharippavar aaRumukaththarasE..' which was set to a dance in the old 'Sri vaLLi'.

DRS

Thanks for that succinct summary of all the controversies in aTHANA. It has a very honoured place in Harikathas as you mentioned. TSB does use it effectively. But green in my memory is the aThANA of HMB who was a past master in its use in the Harikathas. He had the commanding voice and the royal looks to go with it which suited this raga.

coolkarni

TKR is superb. Awaiting TNS (..and perhaps a shenay (is it too much to ask..)!

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 16 Oct 2005, 04:43

Here is SrI mahgaNapatim from the AIR series rendered by M.S.Sheela and R.A.Ramamani.

http://rapidshare.de/files/6333185/SrI_ ... a.mp3.html

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 16 Oct 2005, 04:58

Ravi
varugirAL unaittEDi by MLV is aTHANa. So is "yAr trauvAr inda".

Here is a beautiful kannaDa pada from the film raNadhIra kaNThIrava(1960). The song is sung by Radha-Jayalakshmi. Thie song is very apt here as the story is about Mysore oDeyar (as is clear from the name of the film). Even in the song, Mysore is mentioned.

http://www.musicindiaonline.com/p/x/PJy ... As1NMvHdW/

meena · Post by **meena** » 16 Oct 2005, 05:09

DRS thanks for the AIR clip

poongavur · Post by **poongavur** » 16 Oct 2005, 05:37

It feels great to see the site revived and the excellent discussion by DRS and others.

coolkarni · Post by **coolkarni** » 16 Oct 2005, 06:50

http://rapidshare.de/files/6318277/akc- ... A.mp3.html

Raja Chandra · Post by **Raja Chandra** » 16 Oct 2005, 12:53

Hi friends,

Nice to be back

thanks chemabi for my rebirth too. i just registered and was able to log in

There is some good news for kaapi and others who wanted tamil/telugu/malayalam transliteration of oDeyar kRuti's.

you can d/l the latest version of baraha from http://www.baraha.com. Then go to http://forumhub.com/indcmusic/15520.19.35.58.html, where in most of the kRuti's sahitya is available. You can use this and you can get the tamil/telugu/malayalam versions as per your personal preference.

CML has verified one of them and feels it is just ok.

if there is anything i can do in this direction, i will be very glad to do the needful.

you can d/l the first kRuti from http://rapidshare.de/files/6342764/jcrwg1_t.pdf.html and let me know.

Raja Chandra · Post by **Raja Chandra** » 16 Oct 2005, 15:06

DRS,

Thank you for that very informative site on ganapati. I was surprsied to see the similarities between shiva nidhi ( sri tattva nidhi) and this site.

shivanidhi's description and depiction of mah gaNapati can be downloaded :

http://rapidshare.de/files/6345753/mahA ... M.doc.html

but DRS , can you clarify on the use of phrase: paMcamAtaMgamuKaM !

Raja Chandra · Post by **Raja Chandra** » 16 Oct 2005, 16:30

CML,

You have quoted:aTaaNaa the prince among ragas .

Is'nt it appropriate for a prince to start his compostion with such a rAga !

It is a rAga with vIra rasa and hence suits a prince very well.

Knowing oDeyar's passion and mastery over western music it is almost axiomatic to expect that he choses a rAga which is janya with shaMkarAbharaNa.

I undsertand Adi shaMkara has composed this in aThANa:

galaddAnaguMDa miladbhRuMga KaMDaM
calaccAru shuMDaM jagatrANa shauMDam
lasaddaMta kAMDaM vipadbhaMga caMDaM
shivaprEma piMDaM bhajE vakratuMDaM ||

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 16 Oct 2005, 17:36

CML,
It is a rAga with vIra rasa and hence suits a prince very well.

Knowing oDeyar's passion and mastery over western music it is almost axiomatic to expect that he choses a rAga which is janya with shaMkarAbharaNa.

I undsertand Adi shaMkara has composed this in aThANa:

galaddAnaguMDa miladbhRuMga KaMDaM
calaccAru shuMDaM jagatrANa shauMDam
lasaddaMta kAMDaM vipadbhaMga caMDaM
shivaprEma piMDaM bhajE vakratuMDaM ||

It is true that aThANa is a janya of dhIra SankarAbharaNa. But I do not think oDeyar chose it ot of his passion for Western music. Far from it, athANa is a rAga that stands further than most in terms of handling the swaras. Its treatment is far removed from Western music. In fact rAgas like aThANa, SahAna, suruTi etc are filled with the essence of karNATaka sangIta. I also very much doubt if HM has an equivalent for aThANa. There is simply too much gamaka embellishment in the rAga that cannot be accommodated in HM.

As for the SlOka, AFAIK SankarAcArya did not compose in any pariticular rAga. (perhaps he did but they have certainly not been passed down). Maybe you have heard artistes rendering this particular SlOka in aThANa.

coolkarni · Post by **coolkarni** » 16 Oct 2005, 20:55

http://rapidshare.de/files/6336845/mv_d ... a.mp3.html

http://rapidshare.de/files/6337852/ARTI ... _.mp3.html

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 17 Oct 2005, 00:14

The next one in the series- mahAtripurasundari in kalyANi rendered by Nagmani Srinath and Chandrika.

http://rapidshare.de/files/6366422/mahA ... i.mp3.html

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 17 Oct 2005, 00:18

Raja Chandra
pancamAtangamukham. I had explained earlier but will repeat here as srkris will need some time before posting all the previous threads.
panca is used in the sense of wide. mAtanga is elephant. He is thu referred to as Him with a wide elephant face.

Ravi
I think ippaDiyallO by Vyjayanthimala is part of a commercial release.

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 17 Oct 2005, 00:32

mAtu of || mahAtripurasundari ||

rAga: kalyANi ; triSra jhampe tALa (2 kaLes)

mahAtripura sundari Sankari mAm pAhi ||P||

mahAdEva mArtANDa bhairava manOhari |
mahAlinga santOShiNi SrI vAgISvari ||
mahAnanda bharitE maNimaya vINApustakayute mUka kavi vAkpradAna vikhyAtE mahitE ||AP||

sarOjadaLa nEtrE ati pavitrE sucaritrE |
samasta brahmANDa nilayE himAdri tanayE |
sarasa sangIta tOShitE sAma vEda vinutE |
samarAsakta mahAmAyE mahOdayE ||
karNaranjana madhurabhAShiNi SrIvidyArUpiNi karNAnandakara nAda rUpiNi kalyANi ||C||

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 17 Oct 2005, 04:02

Notes on ||mahAtripurasundari||

rAga: kalyANi ; triSra jhampe tALa

mahAtripura sundari; Sankari; mAm pAhi- Protect me.

mahAdEva mArtANDa bhairava manOhari- You Who enchants/pleases the minds/hearts of Siva, sUrya and bhairava.
She pleases Siva with Her beauty, sUrya with Her anugraha/beneficience and bhairava with Her vAtsalya/motherly affection.
mahAlinga santOShiNi- You Who gladden Siva;
SrI vAgISvari- The presiding deity of speech and language;
mahAnanda bharitE- You Who is filled with great and eternal ecstasy;
maNimaya vINApustakayute- You with beautiful gem-studded vINe and book in Your hand;
mUka kavi vAkpradAna vikhyAtE- You Who is renowned and glorified for granting speech to the dumb poet; mahitE- You Who is praised and eulogised.

sarOjadaLa nEtrE- You with the eyes like the petals of a lotus;
ati pavitrE- Holy One; sucaritrE- You with a hallowed nature ,grace & disposition;
samasta brahmANDa nilayE- You Who is the abode of the entire universe (or You Who pervades the entire universe);
She is aNOraNIyAn mahatOmahIyAn

himAdri tanayE- Daughter of the snow-clad mountain;
sarasa sangIta tOShitE- You Who is gladdened by beautiful music;
sAma vEda vinutE- You Who is worshipped/sung by the sAma vEda;
samara Asakta mahAmAyE- mAyE(illlusion) that is enthusiastic about fighting and war;
mahOdayE;
karNaranjana madhurabhAShiNi- You with a mellifluous voice pleasing to the ears
SrIvidyArUpiNi- You in the form of SrividyA;
karNAnandakara nAda rUpiNi- You in the form of nAda (sound/music) that gives great pleasure on hearing; kalyANi.

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 17 Oct 2005, 04:14

SAntakalyANi/ mEcakalyANi, popularly called kalyANi is too well known and popular to merit an explanation from my side. It is a pleasing and fine rAga. It is also easy to sing and there are countless compositions in the rAga. It is hard to go wrong in composing a kRti in the rAga.Scale is
SR2G3M2PD2N3S* | S*NDPMGRS ||

oDeyar`s kRti is neat. The tALa IMHO appears an odd choice. Yes the tALa is in 2 kaLes. It might have equally well been in sankIrNa jhampe with 12 akSharas in each Avarta. The song evokes SAnta rasa. There is a judicious use of gamakas with no hint of excess anywhere.

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 17 Oct 2005, 06:06

It must be mArtaNDa (m^RitAt aNDAt jAyatE iti)

However the word mArtANDa is current in dravidian languages

bhairava is Siva in a different (terrible) form. There are eight of them. I have difficulty conceiving 'vAtsalyam' (motherly love) with this form of Siva. Any justifications?

srkris · Post by **srkris** » 17 Oct 2005, 11:04

CML, are you talking about the eight rudras, by any chance? What is the literal meaning of bhairava? I have heard of the following:

Bhava - existence
Sarva - he who has arrows
Pasupati - lord of the cattle
Ugra - dread
Mahadeva - great god
Rudra - howler
Isana - ruler
Asani - thunderbolt

I guess I am digressing here, sorry for that.

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 17 Oct 2005, 13:32

It must be mArtaNDa (m^RitAt aNDAt jAyatE iti)

However the word mArtANDa is current in dravidian languages

bhairava is Siva in a different (terrible) form. There are eight of them. I have difficulty conceiving 'vAtsalyam' (motherly love) with this form of Siva. Any justifications?

martaNDa and mArtANDa are both extant in sanskrit. They both mean the sun. In fact Cologne dictionary says mArtANDa is the earlier form and mArtaNDa is a later development from the former.

As for Her showing vAtsalya, sorry for not quoting the source for that earlier. That particular line, I have translated from Prof|V.Ramaratnam`s kannaDa original "maisUru oDeyaru mattu karnATaka sangIta". I found it somewhat odd myself and hence posted it for comments.

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 17 Oct 2005, 13:35

CML, are you talking about the eight rudras, by any chance? What is the literal meaning of bhairava?

bhairava means one who is terrible/fearful. It is derived from "bhIru". I had given details of aShTabhairavas in my notes on the rAgavardhini kRti "mRtyunjayam". I am reposting it here (thanks to many of our friends who spared no efforts in locating the posts when the forum crashed)

The aShTa bhairavas are, as the name suggests, eight in number. They are alocated one to each direction. This is the kShEtrapAla aspect of Siva by which he protects he city/grounds in all directions. bhairava is also associated with the cremation grounds.
Their names are ruru bhairava [S-E, agni], caNDa bhairava [S, yama], asitAnga bhairava [E, indra], kapALla bhairava [N.W, vAyu], krOdha bhairava [S.W, nirRti], unmatta bhairava[W., varuNa], samhAra bhairava [N.E, ISAna] & bhISaNa bhairava [N., rudra, kubEra] Alternativel they are-
mahA- , saMhAra-, asitAnga-, ruru-, kAla-, krodha-, tAmracUDa-/kapAla-, candracUDa-/rudra- bhairava.Note that the aShTa bhairavas are different from the aShTamUrtis of Siva.

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 17 Oct 2005, 21:14

weii done DRS. We have somuch of information in the backups and cannot afford to lose tham.

Chembai
It is EkAdasha Rudra (eleven). Remember Rudra cakra in the mELakarta!

DRS
I will look to see whether 'vatsalyam' can be justified! My objection to mArtANDa is etymological and not based on usaage.

coolkarni
Of course we have the superb yaman you posted earlier (perhaps you could add a Bismillakhan). But it will be a shame to pass kalyaaNi without some choice (your best) pieces!

srkris · Post by **srkris** » 17 Oct 2005, 21:20

Thanks DRS & CML.

Raja Chandra · Post by **Raja Chandra** » 17 Oct 2005, 22:03

DRS,

Here is report on concert at Mysore Palace during dasara which may evoke some comment from you:

The classical concert was by Vid. D. Balakrishna, a versatile proponent of Mysore Baani Veena and Vid. Vamshidhar, another Mysore Baani flautist. Both are disciples of the famous Vidwans of yesteryears, V. Doreswamy Iyengar, who taught his son on the veena and V. Deshi-kachar, who trained his grand son on the flute, respectively. Very fittingly, they started their concert with a composition of Jayachamarajendra Wadiyar, Sri Mahaganapathim (Athana, Adi).

Raja Chandra · Post by **Raja Chandra** » 17 Oct 2005, 22:14

DRS,

thanks for clarifying the use of pancamAtaMgamuKaM,

It was very easy to mistake it as five faced ganapathi, but the diificulty was mahAganapathi is not five faced like hEraMba Ganapa! But some sources have decsribed as such. Your description makes sense. thanks again!

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 17 Oct 2005, 22:55

weii done DRS. We have somuch of information in the backups and cannot afford to lose tham.
DRS
I will look to see whether 'vatsalyam' can be justified! My objection to mArtANDa is etymological and not based on usaage.

mArtANDa can mean egg or sun. It is derived from mRtANDa or marta+aNDa meaning basically "From a lifeless(seemingly) egg". Looking at it that way, mArtANDa seems to be correct rather than mArtaNDa. I am also aware of another explanation (cannot recall exactly what) where mArtaNDa fits the bill. It is something to do with the worlds being derived from the sun. Can you tell what is the nature of your doubt regarding the derivation?

abadri · Post by **abadri** » 17 Oct 2005, 22:56

A word document that contains some info on the Maharajah
and the Mysore royal family (courtesy of Shri Kulkarni).

http://rapidshare.de/files/6403438/Odeyar__info.doc

abadri · Post by **abadri** » 17 Oct 2005, 23:46

Another concert rendering of the Maharaja's aTANA kriti.

TVR - MSG - Tiruvarur Bhaktavatsalam in Mysore, 1999
[rapidshare link removed]

(This is song #3 from the concert I posted on the sangeetham forum,
over the weekend courtesy of Shri Bhargav).

Raja Chandra · Post by **Raja Chandra** » 18 Oct 2005, 00:37

Interestingly shiva nidhi quoting from ÃƒÆ’Ã†â€™Ãƒâ€šÃ‚Â¢??rudra yAmaLaÃƒÆ’Ã†â€™Ãƒâ€šÃ‚Â¢??, describes 64 bhairavaÃƒÆ’Ã†â€™Ãƒâ€šÃ‚Â¢??s grouped in to eight groups each further consisting of eight bairavaÃƒÆ’Ã†â€™Ãƒâ€šÃ‚Â¢??s .

They are:

1. asitAMgabhairavAShTakalakShaNa: In Golden color.

1.1 asitAMga, 1.2 vishAlAkSha, 1.3 mArtAMDa,
1.4 mOdaka priya, 1.5 svacCaMda, 1.6 viGnasaMtuShTa,
1.7 Kecara, 1.8 sacarAcara

2. rudrabhairavAShTakalakShaNa ; In pure white color

2.1 ruru, 2.2 kraMdadaMShTra, 2.3 jaTAdhara
2.4 vishvarUpa, 2.5 virUpAkSha, 2.6 nAnArUpadhara
2.7 vajra hasta, 2.8 mahAkAya.

3. caMDabhairavAShTakalakShaNa; In black colour.

3.1 caMDa, 3.2 pralayAMtaka. 3.3 bhUmi kaMpa
3.4 nIlakaMTha, 3.5 viShNu, 3.6 kulapAla
3.7 muMDapAla, 3.8 kAmapAla

4. krOdhabhairavAShTakalakShaNa: In Smokey gray.

4.1 krOdha, 4.2 piMgalEkShaNa, 4.3 abhrarUpa
4.4 dharApAla, 4.5 kuTila, 4.6 maMtranAyaka
4.7 rudra, 4.8 pitAmaha

5. unnattabhairavAShTakalakShaNa; In white color.

5.1 unnatta, 5.2 vaTanAyaka, 5.3 shaMkara
5.4 bhUtabhEtALa, 5.5 triNEtra, 5.6 tripurAMtaka
5.7 varada, 5.8 parvatAvAsa.

6 kapAlabhairavAShTakalakShaNa; In yellow color.

6.1 kapAla, 6.2 shashibhUShaNa, 6.3 hasti carmaMbaradhara 6.4 yOgIsha, 6.5 brahmarAkShasa, 6.6 sarvaj~Ja
6.7 sarvadEvEsha, 6.8 sarvabhUta hRudisthita.

7. bhIShaNabhairavAShTakalakShaNa: In Red color.

7.1 bhIShaNa. 7.2 bhayahara, 7.3 sarvaj~Ja
7.4 kAlAgni, 7.5 mahAraudra, 7.6 dakShiNa
7.7 muKara, 7.8 asthita

8. saMhArabhairavAShTakalakShaNa: In Golden Color.

8.1 saMhAra, 8.2 ati raktAMga, 8.3 kAlAgni
8.4 priyaMkara, 8.5 GoranAda, 8.6 vishAlAkSha
8.7 yOgIsha, 8.8 dakShasaMsthita

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 18 Oct 2005, 00:41

DRS

Sankrit grammar is not that simple!
You have to go by strict rules and not apply them according to your whims and fancies.

The derivation is:
Start with the dhAtu
'm^Ri^N prANatyAgE' tudAdi AtmanEbhAShaH meaning to die or perish
Now applying the krit affix (kvip) you form the kridanta 'm^Rit' keeping in mind ' h^Risvasya piti k^Riti tuk' (Pan 6.1.71).

Now form the compound with aNDa (egg) using the taddhita affix (aN) which requires vriddhi of the first letter. Thus

m^Rit +aNDa+aN = mArtaNDaH which means dead egg.

This figuratively denotes tha Sun since he was born from an egg donated by Kaashyapa to aditi (which was considered dead by her for the length of time it took to hatch) (see mahaabhaarata for full story!).

Raja Chandra · Post by **Raja Chandra** » 18 Oct 2005, 00:55

thanks badri for that note on oDeyar's

you can also read my own postings at

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jayachamar ... ar_Bahadur

and also

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wodeyar

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 18 Oct 2005, 01:39

Here is the next one- vindhyAcala nivAsini in harikAmbOdhi. This has been rendered by R.K.Padmanabha and D.V.Nagaraja.
Friends ! I need help in deciphering the first line of the caraNa. I have managed the other lines with considerable efforts [from me and my wife:-)].

http://rapidshare.de/files/6376531/vind ... i.mp3.html

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 18 Oct 2005, 01:55

CML
Thanks for explaining mArtaNDa. I find your statement about the derivation of mArtANDa very imaginative and spiced up.

mRtE(a)NDE yEna sanjAtE mArtANDastEna bhAskaraH says the skandapurANa.
She is called mArtANDabhairavArAdhyA in he sahasranAma.
mArtANDabhairava is also the name of Her upAsaka present between the 22nd and the 23rd prAkAras of the SrIcakra. It is quite conceivable that She has vAtsalya and anugrahabhAva towards a upAsaka of Hers.
And of course mArANDabhairava is a name of a form assumed by Siva for slaying maNimalla (a daitya).

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 18 Oct 2005, 03:47

DRS

Now you are talking. Your quotes are verbatim from BhaskararAya's commentary on laitaasahasranaama.

Thus mArtANDAbhairava is one word signifying the devotee in the SrIcakra between the 22nd and 23rd walls. Hence vaatsalya is automatic. No need to split the name here!

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 18 Oct 2005, 04:03

CML
If mArtANDabhairava refers to the devotee, mahAdEva in the beginning starts to stick out like a sore thumb. It really does not matter whether She had vAtsalya, SRngAra or anugraha in Her mind when enchanting the mind of mahAdEva/ bhairava. I quoted that bit from the book I mentioned earlier. Now that I think of it, I think the best way to interpret is consider mahAdEva as an epithet of mArtANDabhairava (all one word!) but that the latter refers to Siva rather than the upAsaka.

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 18 Oct 2005, 04:43

DRS

I see the problem caused by the extraneous 'vaatsalyam'. Let us forget it
mahAdEva mArtANDa bhairava manOhari |
is
mahAdEva ca mArtANDabhairava manOhari = you the one who is pleasing to the minds of Siva as well as your devotee mArtaNDabhairava

I listened to the vindhyaacala but it is too slurred and my hearing is not that good

coolkarni · Post by **coolkarni** » 18 Oct 2005, 10:38

cml
facing a few problems with rapidshare.should sort it out by tonight.or will send it to one of you who can pass it on over rapidshare here.
kalyani...you are right.how can one make a choice.so i will upload something different.
balmuralis kalanidhi "kalyani" where he reveals a new thala .
and a wonderful yaman by salamath (one of the nazakath-salamath bros) and his son- a private concert with lots of oohs and aahs , but one in which I found something very very different in yaman.
Though i will wait for the experts here to explain it to me

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 18 Oct 2005, 10:49

coolkarni

you are on!