Tanpura patterns

periklistsoukalas · Post by **periklistsoukalas** » 25 Aug 2009, 05:29

Hello there !
In India I've heard that there are different patterns of playing the Tanpura. Not only the ordinary Pa-,sa,sa,Sa- (the 6/8 pattern). I've heard that ther're two generally ways of playing the rythmic patterns , the Hindustani and the Carnatic.

Can anyone give me a clue if there're any patterns and which are they? Names and rhythmic?How they're sound in rhtythm?
Thank you!

gn.sn42 · Post by **gn.sn42** » 25 Aug 2009, 05:42

I'm sure some experts will soon be here to provide detailed information, but meanwhile you might want see this thread on south and north Indian tamburas.

periklistsoukalas · Post by **periklistsoukalas** » 25 Aug 2009, 06:04

Thanks gn.sn42!

vasanthakokilam · Post by **vasanthakokilam** » 25 Aug 2009, 06:38

More than answers, I have follow up questions.

>Not only the ordinary Pa-,sa,sa,Sa- (the 6/8 pattern)

What is your Pa- and Sa- in your notation?

What 6/8 pattern are you referring to?

periklistsoukalas · Post by **periklistsoukalas** » 25 Aug 2009, 14:47

Hello vasanthakokilam.

Well for example let's say that we have a Tanpura tuned in Pa,sa,sa,Sa o.k.?
If you measure the rhythmic pattern when someone is playing, most common is to hear first a 'long' Pa (almost double in time) then a short sa, another one short sa and finally a long Sa (kharaj Sa which is also in double time). If you count the time / periods it goes: 2 beats for Pa, 1 sa, 1 sa, 2 Sa (kharaj). This is very common way of playing. I've heard that this is a 'hindustani loop' and my question comes: how is the Carnatic goes? Are there any more Hindustani or Carnatic 'ways of looping' the playing?
regards
Periklis

Radhika-Rajnarayan · Post by **Radhika-Rajnarayan** » 25 Aug 2009, 16:01

There are 2 preferences in plucking the tambura (tanpura). It is not really true that any particular style is 'Hindustani' preference or 'Carnatic' preference.
One is pa, - sa,sa,sa- (6-beat) with a 2-beat pa and 2-beat mandara shadjam (each of double the duration of the other notes).
The other method is pa,sa,sa,sa- (5-beat) which is without a long pa but has a 2-beat mandara shadja.
There are many South Indian musicians who play the tambura in the 6-beat style leading to the notion that this 6-beat style is the South Indian style. However there are many who do play in the 5-beat style.
Similarly, there are many North Indian musicians who play the tambura in the 5-beat style, causing it to be labelled as the 'North Insdian style' but plenty of others (including Pt Ravi Shankar) prefer the 6-beat style.

periklistsoukalas · Post by **periklistsoukalas** » 25 Aug 2009, 16:44

I see...

I had already noticed the 2 'kinds' of playing as you say and also couldn't find any worth notice differences in 'Carnatic style' or 'Hindustani style' and that's why i was asking. I've heard 6 beat and 5 beat playing in both Carnatic and Hindustani !!

Thank you very much Radhika-Rajnarayan !:)
Have a nice day !

vasanthakokilam · Post by **vasanthakokilam** » 26 Aug 2009, 01:50

OK, I understand. BTW, what is kharaj?

Actually, while we are at it, let us make it very clear how the four strings are tuned.

For ease of typing and ease of reading, let us just use this terminology for this specific purpose. Middle Octave S, Lower Octave S, Middle Octave P, Lower octave P, Higher Octave S and Higher Octave P

Can you map your notation for how the tampura strings are tuned using the above terminology, even if it is verbose?

periklistsoukalas · Post by **periklistsoukalas** » 26 Aug 2009, 06:37

Kharaj Sa is a term i got from an Indian musician and by this he wants to define the lower octave Sa of the Tanpura tnning. It's really a labyrinth the terminology matter,i understand...25 years now I've read too many books about Indian music, speak with Indian musicians in India and abroad and always had problems with the terminology stabilization. I always had to re define things. Anyway i tune as Pa,Sa,Sa (middle octave) and Sa (lower octave). Or Pa 5th, Sa octave, Sa octave, Sa root / base / lower octave.

vasanthakokilam · Post by **vasanthakokilam** » 26 Aug 2009, 08:50

periklistsoukalas, yes the terminology problem is immense. That is one of the reasons I picked the terminology above, so it is not overloaded with terms.

>Pa,Sa,Sa (middle octave) and Sa (lower octave).
Which octave for the first two?

>Pa 5th, Sa octave, Sa octave, Sa root / base / lower octave

I do not understand this at all.

Can you re-present it using my terminology and no other new terms

. Use 'Low', 'Middle' and 'High' against each note. Middle Sa is the tonic of the musician. Thanks.

Radhika-Rajnarayan · Post by **Radhika-Rajnarayan** » 26 Aug 2009, 10:13

To Vasanthakokilam-The tuning is as follows - lower octave pa, middle octave sa (aadhara shadjam - or the first sa that is sung in the series sa-pa-sa when you start your singing), repeat the middle octave sa, and lower octave (mandara) shadjam - or kharaj.
Another way to identify them is to pluck the open (second-string) mandara panchamam of the veena, pluck the first string (sa or saarani) twicw and pluck the 3rd string (mandaram) once.
So in your terminology, it is - low pa, middle sa, middle sa, low sa

vasanthakokilam · Post by **vasanthakokilam** » 26 Aug 2009, 10:47

Thanks very much Radhika-Rajnarayan

vasanthakokilam · Post by **vasanthakokilam** » 26 Aug 2009, 20:23

periklistsoukalas, thanks. I got it. Now I can think clearly about the various patterns of strumming and why and how they may matter to the overall production of the drone sound. If I have any observations ( no guarantees ), I will share.

periklistsoukalas · Post by **periklistsoukalas** » 26 Aug 2009, 20:57

My pleasure to read musicians adventures and discoveries ! This helps others as well !

I wish all a good continue of the music adventure!