CM knows no religious boundaries!

ragam-talam · Post by **ragam-talam** » 06 Jun 2009, 22:43

Fascinating video clip:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=25TuPz2wqGw

Here are the details from the video:
Broadcast on: DD Trivandrum
Category: "Islamic Shaasthreeya sangeetham"

Singer: JahAna Kharim
Composer: hamsa pATTaRa
Music: kaTakkal bAbu narEndran
Ragam: pUrvikalyAni
Talam: rUpakam
Pallavi line of kriti: "lailattUL khadiRil khuRanin avatAram / mekkayum medinayumAi khuRanin avatAram"
(in Malayalam - the song refers to the birth of holy Quran)

VK RAMAN · Post by **VK RAMAN** » 06 Jun 2009, 23:20

I have watched several of her renditions in kairali TV in 2005 - a good example of music knows no boundaries.

vganesh · Post by **vganesh** » 08 Jun 2009, 12:16

Recently I have watched a program in Makkal TV, a nun singing about Jesus said to CM completely.

chalanata · Post by **chalanata** » 09 Jun 2009, 08:32

the nun is a Ph.D in music and she was singing the sarva samaya samarasa keerthanaigal by Mayooram Vedanayakam Pillai.

sivachinta1965 · Post by **sivachinta1965** » 10 Jun 2009, 09:39

dear Nataji

Vedanayakam Pillai was a christian , that is why that nun is singing that. Otherwise to praise a hindu god is crime!

sivaprasad

sureshvv · Post by **sureshvv** » 10 Jun 2009, 10:02

Notwithstanding what Mayooram Vedanayakam was, from the "sarva samaya" part of the title, it appears that he may have praised various Gods in a manner admitted by different religions.

coolkarni · Post by **coolkarni** » 10 Jun 2009, 14:03

srikant1987 · Post by **srikant1987** » 10 Jun 2009, 14:34

Ustad, you mean?

coolkarni · Post by **coolkarni** » 10 Jun 2009, 17:35

vganesh · Post by **vganesh** » 11 Jun 2009, 08:59

Ustad, you mean?

At least HM does not have any specific relegious connections, If I am right! Only CM has very strong religious boundary as many people of them sung based on their Idols and Bhakthi. More over CM is more based on lyrics compare to HM.

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 12 Jun 2009, 02:54

coolkarni
We are quite aware of the muslim influence in HM and the attemts to secularize (or sacralize) HM subsequently. Was there any christian influence at all? Are there any lyrics relating to christianity?

vidya · Post by **vidya** » 12 Jun 2009, 03:48

coolkarni wrote:An interesting book I picked up the other day at the bargain table at Odyssey.
A lovely book.

Yes. This is a very lovely book and provides an objective and unbiased insight into the Social history of Indian music. However I did wish there was atleast one more chapter devoted to
the Gharanedhar musicians and how they percieved these modern methods (for the sake of completeness of perspective) more as a background to Chapter 6. But other than that it
is a must-read if you wish to understand the cultural milieu that existed then and where the motivations and perspectives emerge from. This is published by OUP in the US.

Shivadasan · Post by **Shivadasan** » 12 Jun 2009, 07:47

There are some styles in HM which have mostly songs based on Gods and Godesses. One is Dhrupad Style. Another is Haveli Sangeet. There may be others also.

Dhrupad was the original HM which was prevalent in the times of Swami Haridas and Tansen. The shithya contained praises on Hindu deities. It had only Pakhwaj for accompaniment. It was not influenced by Persian or Iranian or any other style of music. There were four styles existing previously and only one survives now. The Dhrupads are sung not only by Dagars ( who spread Dhrupad all over the world) to but also Hindu musicians in Dharbhanga and other places who were limited to Bihar and UP in their appearences. Dhrupad is a majestic style of music and does not cater to romantic and lilting tunes. The Thumri took care of it.

Haveli Music I understand is also based on Dhrupad Style. It is in use extensively in Rajasthan and Guajrat in Krishna and Vaishnava temples. I do not have experience of this music.

Khayal pattern appears to have been evolved to bring in lightness to the classicality of Dhrupad which was possibly too much for some of the Muslim rulers. It has almost no serious sahithya. Very simple romantic themes. The word Khayal, meaning ÃƒÂ¢Ã¢â€šÂ¬Ã‹Å“a thoughtÃƒÂ¢Ã¢â€šÂ¬Ã¢â€žÂ¢ indicates that originally it was an experiment on lightening the Classical music. In the Khayal style it mostly manodharma sangeetham without pre-composed music.

Muthuswami Dikshithar must have been influenced by the Dhrupad style and not Khayal style.

HM is used in most types of Islamic religious music.

coolkarni · Post by **coolkarni** » 12 Jun 2009, 09:38

girish_a · Post by **girish_a** » 12 Jun 2009, 11:39

Shivadasan wrote: Muthuswami Dikshithar must have been influenced by the Dhrupad style and not Khayal style.

Yes indeed. I remember hearing a concert on Worldspace radio in which someone mentioned this (I forget the name. It was someone quite prominent). He sang a few lines of Hiranmayeem Lakshmeem in Lalitha to illustrate that it can also be sung in Dhrupad style. Then he sang Parimala Ranganatham Bhajeham in Hamir Kalyani which follows a very Dhrupad-like pattern.

Which leads me to suggest to Coolji to please upload Parimala Ranganatham Bhajeham if he has a recording. It is a beautiful piece.

Rambling along, I feel that Hamir Kalyani has this wonderful quality of soothing your nerves more effectively than other ragas, and gives you a sense of fulfilment, or shall I say, takes you to a wellspring of inner peace and sprititual happiness and sets upon your being a meditative calm that few things can bestow.

padren68 · Post by **padren68** » 12 Jun 2009, 17:49

girish_a wrote:
Shivadasan wrote: Muthuswami Dikshithar must have been influenced by the Dhrupad style and not Khayal style.
Yes indeed. I remember hearing a concert on Worldspace radio in which someone mentioned this (I forget the name. It was someone quite prominent). He sang a few lines of Hiranmayeem Lakshmeem in Lalitha to illustrate that it can also be sung in Dhrupad style. Then he sang Parimala Ranganatham Bhajeham in Hamir Kalyani which follows a very Dhrupad-like pattern.

Which leads me to suggest to Coolji to please upload Parimala Ranganatham Bhajeham if he has a recording. It is a beautiful piece.

Rambling along, I feel that Hamir Kalyani has this wonderful quality of soothing your nerves more effectively than other ragas, and gives you a sense of fulfilment, or shall I say, takes you to a wellspring of inner peace and sprititual happiness and sets upon your being a meditative calm that few things can bestow.

http://www.bollywoodsargam.com/video_to ... video.html

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 12 Jun 2009, 18:04

Thanks Padmanabhan!

ragam-talam · Post by **ragam-talam** » 13 Jun 2009, 17:44

We also have the 'singing priest', Fr Paul Poovathingal
http://www.thesingingpriest.com/

His Ph.D thesis was titled 'Carnatic music and Christianity'

Facinating interview - http://mutiny.wordpress.com/2007/01/26/ ... ng-priest/

Is there any recording of his singing available in the public domain?

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 13 Jun 2009, 21:42

...fascinating
Let us see whether we can find any of his performances...

eppramod · Post by **eppramod** » 13 Jun 2009, 21:48

ragam-talam wrote:We also have the 'singing priest', Fr Paul Poovathingal
http://www.thesingingpriest.com/

His Ph.D thesis was titled 'Carnatic music and Christianity'

Facinating interview - http://mutiny.wordpress.com/2007/01/26/ ... ng-priest/

Is there any recording of his singing available in the public domain?

I have known this person through my cousin and Vocalist Shri Vaikom Jayachandran, under whom he learned for sometime
(he has mentioned this in his website).
I came across him as a nice person and singer with lots of talent.

Pramod

ragam-talam · Post by **ragam-talam** » 13 Jun 2009, 22:22

Just came across a video clip of his singing on youtube!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=98VR2QPaAQU

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 13 Jun 2009, 23:56

Nice to get a glimpse! He does take after KJY!

ragam-talam · Post by **ragam-talam** » 14 Jun 2009, 11:32

We also have the 'dancing priest', Fr Saju George: http://www.hindu.com/thehindu/mp/2003/1 ... 130100.htm
"I use both Hindu and Christian themes for my performances. Imageries of Radha Krishna share a platform with the crucifixion and resurrection of Jesus Christ."

munirao2001 · Post by **munirao2001** » 30 Jun 2009, 12:36

Shivadasan
In your post 13, you had mentioned 'Muthuswami Dikshithar must have been influenced by the Dhrupad style and not Khayal style'.

Indian Music was essentially, devotional - Divya Namasankirtans and prevalent in Maharashtra (Sant Vani) Bengal, Bihar, Tamil Nadu and some part of Andhra Pradesh. Both CM and Dhrupad had evolved out of Indian Music prevalent, at those times. Dhrupad had aborbed many aspects of CM in the 'Gayaki Ang'.
During the Mudduswami Dikshita's stay in Benares, he had heard HM and was inspired with their emphasis on purity of the Note, slow and steady build up of raga alap from note to note and vilabmkala. He was already exposed to Dhrupad form, through his Guru. At Benares, he was also exposed to other Gharanasin HM . He composed his immortal compositions, full of raga swarupa and vishradhi(contemplative), mostly in vilambakala. With the deep knowledge beuty of Veena playing, he used gamakas-dasavida gamakas and gave distinct identity to his compositions, within the CM system. He has used some of the ragas in HM, which will not be used by Dhrupadiyas. His 'Vatapi Ganapathim' in Hamsadhwani inspired HM Ustads/pandits- starting with Ustad Abdul Karim Khan, doyen of kirana Gharana, to adopt this raga and has become one the most popular raga, out of many ragas adopted in HM.

munirao2001 · Post by **munirao2001** » 30 Jun 2009, 12:48

Padren68,
I guess the prominent artiste you have refered must be Sri Trichur Ramachandran. TR learnt HM and can perform HM concert.
TR had learnt Mudduswami Dikshita's song from SSRao, a doyen and authority on Dikshita's compositions. You can get the 'Parimala Ranganatham' from his CD/Casette on Dikshita's compositions or from SSRao' National Programme of Music recording, a master piece, archieves from AIR ( his last concert on NPM - accompanied by VVS and Palghat Raghu). TR had mentioned in one of his interviews that, he wanted to have the most authentic version of this composition and after searching and waiting for full five years, he had the privelege of learning this composition from SSRao. B.Rajam Iyer and Kalpagam Swaminathan are the other Maestros, singing this composition.