Uday has hit the nail right. I am quite aware of Patanjali Yoga sutra as well as various forms of meditations. I have also visited the Maharshi Institute (Fairfield Iowa) and had discussions with folks doing serious scientific research on Meditation and Music (Gandharva vidya). The music therapy is used to tranquilize the mind and produce 'euphoria' (not enlightenment ). Meditation is 'introspection' which is intended to 'destroy the waves of thought ' from the mind so that buddhi/citta is in abatement:
yOgas citta vritti nirOdhaH
(Patanjali Yoga sutra 1.1)
Accordingly CM is totally incompatible with enlightenment. None of the Trinity were enlightened personnel in comparison with Bhagavan Ramana or Shankaracarya or mahAperiyavaaL who were not musicians/vaggeyakaras. The Trinity putatively attained salvation through bhakti (not through CM!) which is yet another route for Liberation. Gandhiji attained salvation (putatively) through Karma yoga. In other words Lord Krishna cites three approaches for Liberation from Samsara: Karma Yoga (path of niShkaamya karma), Gnaana Yoga (path of enlightenment), Bhakti Yoga (path of implicit devotion/surrender (sharaNaagati)). CM or any other forms of music are simple sensual enjoyments if unaccompanied by bhakti which is the sine qua non! Thyagaraja has succinctly summarised it in 'sangIta gnaanamu bhakti vinA ..'. To have that devotion the music should be understood which emphasizes the need for sahitya being understood to generate the bhakti. Accordingly Bhajans are far more effective than listening to aalaapan or RTPs. They no doubt produce 'euphoria' which has good physiological effects; but never any enlightenment!
CM and enlightenment
-
Shivadasan
- Posts: 251
- Joined: 03 Feb 2010, 07:52
Uday Shankar and cmlover are in the right track.
A distinction should be made between the ‘ahatha’ and anahatha’ nada. The music we hear though the ears is ‘ahatha’. ‘Anahatha’ is described as the nada that emanates from the inside. This music is heard by sadhakas during meditation without any external stimuli. It must be one of the types of experiences that occurs as one starts experiencing the Self.
A time would come in advanced sadhana when even the best music would appear to the sadhaka as an interference because it would create thought waves in his otherwise ‘still’ mind. He would prefer 'silence' to music. A verse in Soundharya Lahari by Sage Shankaracharya says that Goddess Saraswathi lays down her Veena as soon as she hears the voice of Devi which was sweeter than her Veena. Perhaps there is a hidden meaning behind it. Devi is Self and Her voice is the divine vibration of our inner conciousness. When the vibrations of inner conciousnes arise they are sweeter than the external music. Sri Ramana Maharshi also says that ‘doing nothing’ is the best method for enlightenment. CM is doing something. I used to wonder why a person like Pt. Vishmadev Chattopadhyay, after having achieved the very best in Hindusthani music preferred to drop it and join Aravindo ashram. Did something like this happened to him?
A distinction should be made between the ‘ahatha’ and anahatha’ nada. The music we hear though the ears is ‘ahatha’. ‘Anahatha’ is described as the nada that emanates from the inside. This music is heard by sadhakas during meditation without any external stimuli. It must be one of the types of experiences that occurs as one starts experiencing the Self.
A time would come in advanced sadhana when even the best music would appear to the sadhaka as an interference because it would create thought waves in his otherwise ‘still’ mind. He would prefer 'silence' to music. A verse in Soundharya Lahari by Sage Shankaracharya says that Goddess Saraswathi lays down her Veena as soon as she hears the voice of Devi which was sweeter than her Veena. Perhaps there is a hidden meaning behind it. Devi is Self and Her voice is the divine vibration of our inner conciousness. When the vibrations of inner conciousnes arise they are sweeter than the external music. Sri Ramana Maharshi also says that ‘doing nothing’ is the best method for enlightenment. CM is doing something. I used to wonder why a person like Pt. Vishmadev Chattopadhyay, after having achieved the very best in Hindusthani music preferred to drop it and join Aravindo ashram. Did something like this happened to him?
-
ksrimech
- Posts: 1050
- Joined: 03 Feb 2010, 04:25
Well said by both The King-Among-Modern-Poets and The-Queen_Amidst-Rasikas. This is exactly when SrIkRSNa repeatedly.arasi wrote: bArati says that gItA teaches us common sense (wisdom about living) and that many people do not see it but see dogmas in its place. So, good karmic activities are not a bad thing!
-
uday_shankar
- Posts: 1475
- Joined: 03 Feb 2010, 08:37
Shivadasan, I have no desire to enter into an argument but this is a total misrepresentation of the "teaching" of Ramana Maharshi. He said nothing of that sort. His only persistent unwavering advice to all sadhakas is to find out "who you are" and a "method", so to speak, that he often recommended for this is self-enquiry or atma-vichara. He said nothing about "enlightenment" or "doing nothing" in this world.Shivadasan wrote:Sri Ramana Maharshi also says that ‘doing nothing’ is the best method for enlightenment.
"nAda", "divine light", etc... are just metaphors often used in the literature to attempt to describe metaphysical concepts that have no counterpart in the sensory world. So it is utter foolishness to try to "see" the "divine light", whatever it is! Or try to "hear" the divine celestial nAda, whatever it is. Replace these verbs, "seeing", "hearing", etc... with something like "comprehending" and it might make better sense.
"Doing nothing" is indeed the aim of all spiritual sadhana but not in a superficial sense of the phrase. The idea is to lose a sense of doership, the identification with the false ego. Act ceaselessly but cease to be a Karta and be a Bhakta ! This wisdom comes out of a serious enquiry into the nature of life and death and one's own identity. Go back to the Kathopanishad. In fact spiritual sadhana does not have any "aim" at all and jnana is an automatic byproduct of genuine, selfless curiosity. The only thing certain in life is death and the only worthwhile thing in life is to find out what that's all about. Once you view the issue in these stark terms, all the nonsense disappears and you can enjoy the simple things in life, like Carnatic music, intellectual pursuits, etc... without seeking some esoteric "enlightenment" out of it. Live and love !
Arasi,
Ouch. I don't mean to "udai" anybody
.-
ragam-talam
- Posts: 1896
- Joined: 28 Sep 2006, 02:15
I disagree.Shivadasan wrote:Uday Shankar and cmlover are in the right track.
How can you dismiss the role of CM in the enlightenment process? One doesn't need to know sahitya to attain bhakti. Bhakti can be found in the swaras themselves, if one is so attuned. One can surrender to the nada inherent in the music and find salvation.
And surely the external divine music can potentially trigger the inner nAda?
To dismiss all this as impossible smacks of a certain extremism in thinking.
Btw, Mahaperiyaval was very knowledgeable in CM - don't know about Ramana Maharshi. Even if Ramana didn't, just the fact that one person reached the enlightened state without CM doesn't necessarily preclude the possibility that CM can help on this path.
And why dismiss something as 'euphoric' and not 'enlightened'. Sat-chit-ananda alludes to bliss as the last stage. My dictionary does say bliss and euphoria are synonymous.
-
cmlover
- Posts: 11498
- Joined: 02 Feb 2010, 22:36
Bhakti yoga is distinctly different from Gnaana yoga.The latter (which is enlightenment) distinctly requires the participation of the intellect. There are three basic processes: shravaNaM (listening), mananaM (reflection) and nididhyaasana (meditation). The first requires the participation of an 'enlightened' guru. The latter two require the intellect and which require a total understanding of the 'message'taught by the guru. How can one carry out the latter two without knowing the 'meaning' of the message? If one hears a jumble of sounds however musical how can it trigger the intellect prompting a critcal analysis that leads to 'atma gnaana'? Those pleasant sounds can only engender 'euphoria'(indriyasukha) and not 'enlightenment'. You cannot bypass the 'intellect':
vidyAM cAvidyAM ca yastadvEdObhayaM saha|
avidyayA m^rityuM tIrtvA vidyayAm^RitamashnutE|| (Isa U 11)
One must have both vedic and worldly knowledge. One passes beyond death through worldly knowledge and attains immortality through vedic kowledge.
In other words one should learn the survival skills through worldly knowledge (science/arts/language/music/..) and attain final salvation through the practice/meditation on the vedic knowledge. Understanding and discrimination are the key to both. That is the reason the first four parts of the six parts (shikSha, vyAkaraNa, nirukta, chandas, jyOtiSha, kalpa)of education emphasized the importance of learning the language correctly with understanding. Sama veda emphasizes the correct intonation 'with understanding'. However 'correct vedic chanting' do have the power to energize since they were divinely 'discovered' by the sages (mantra d^RiShTa). Hence the practice of congregational chantings of Rudram and suktas. CM as practised today (based on the 19th century model) do not belong to that category.
Regarding the Bhakti yoga one has to realize that CM is the result of the outpourings of bhakti by those saints and not the other way around. They expressed their intense devotion to their 'personal' God through CM compositions in their personal familiar language. The music is just incidental, just like the wrappings on the fruit. If you take just the wrappings and discard the fruit (by not understanding the content) you just get plain 'euphoria' and not enlightenment or bhakti. Nama sankirtanam focusses on the names of the Lord which automatically generates bhakti (not enlightenment!). Just because we enjoy CM should not entitle us to make spurious claims.
Incidentally mahaperiyavaaL was a simple plain Rasika of CM and not particularly attached to it. Even when he discussed music (e.g., the episode with ARI) he focussed on the meaning of the kriti and not on the musical excellence! To my knowledge he has never suggested that CM is the means of enlightenment.
Finally you have every right to define a word the way you want. But
vidyAM cAvidyAM ca yastadvEdObhayaM saha|
avidyayA m^rityuM tIrtvA vidyayAm^RitamashnutE|| (Isa U 11)
One must have both vedic and worldly knowledge. One passes beyond death through worldly knowledge and attains immortality through vedic kowledge.
In other words one should learn the survival skills through worldly knowledge (science/arts/language/music/..) and attain final salvation through the practice/meditation on the vedic knowledge. Understanding and discrimination are the key to both. That is the reason the first four parts of the six parts (shikSha, vyAkaraNa, nirukta, chandas, jyOtiSha, kalpa)of education emphasized the importance of learning the language correctly with understanding. Sama veda emphasizes the correct intonation 'with understanding'. However 'correct vedic chanting' do have the power to energize since they were divinely 'discovered' by the sages (mantra d^RiShTa). Hence the practice of congregational chantings of Rudram and suktas. CM as practised today (based on the 19th century model) do not belong to that category.
Regarding the Bhakti yoga one has to realize that CM is the result of the outpourings of bhakti by those saints and not the other way around. They expressed their intense devotion to their 'personal' God through CM compositions in their personal familiar language. The music is just incidental, just like the wrappings on the fruit. If you take just the wrappings and discard the fruit (by not understanding the content) you just get plain 'euphoria' and not enlightenment or bhakti. Nama sankirtanam focusses on the names of the Lord which automatically generates bhakti (not enlightenment!). Just because we enjoy CM should not entitle us to make spurious claims.
Incidentally mahaperiyavaaL was a simple plain Rasika of CM and not particularly attached to it. Even when he discussed music (e.g., the episode with ARI) he focussed on the meaning of the kriti and not on the musical excellence! To my knowledge he has never suggested that CM is the means of enlightenment.
Finally you have every right to define a word the way you want. But
Which is indeed 'pseudo bliss', distinctly different from blisseuphoria
Noun
a feeling of great but often unjustified or exaggerated happiness [Greek eu- well + pherein to bear]
euphoric adj
Collins Essential English Dictionary 2nd Edition 2006 © HarperCollins Publishers 2004, 2006
-
Shivadasan
- Posts: 251
- Joined: 03 Feb 2010, 07:52
Dear Uday Shankar
Your first paragraph contain statements which are factually incorrect. Why should Sri Ramana Mahrshi be denied the credit for what he has contributed. ? I found that understanding Ramana Mahrishi is not easy. I have studied almost all his books and books about him and he still eludes my understanding. He never asked any one to change the path which one was already following. There are instances when Maharshi even explained and praised mantra Sadhana and other sadhanas and recommended that they continue to follow their path. Later when his disciples asked him why he praised mantra sadhana instead of asking them to follow vichara marga, he said that there was no point in asking a person to change his method of sadhana. All sahdhanas would eventually lead to the quest for understanding one’s real nature. But whenever a person is new to spiritual path and asked his advice he recommended Vichara marga. There are not one but plenty of references to his advising people to ‘do nothing’ .The original Tamil words are "Chumma iru’ It has been translated by many authors as ‘doing nothing’ or ‘being still’. If you want references I will post them, but it will take some time for me to locate them.
Sri Ramana Mahrishi recommended two methods. One, "Enquire and find out who you are"
Your first paragraph contain statements which are factually incorrect. Why should Sri Ramana Mahrshi be denied the credit for what he has contributed. ? I found that understanding Ramana Mahrishi is not easy. I have studied almost all his books and books about him and he still eludes my understanding. He never asked any one to change the path which one was already following. There are instances when Maharshi even explained and praised mantra Sadhana and other sadhanas and recommended that they continue to follow their path. Later when his disciples asked him why he praised mantra sadhana instead of asking them to follow vichara marga, he said that there was no point in asking a person to change his method of sadhana. All sahdhanas would eventually lead to the quest for understanding one’s real nature. But whenever a person is new to spiritual path and asked his advice he recommended Vichara marga. There are not one but plenty of references to his advising people to ‘do nothing’ .The original Tamil words are "Chumma iru’ It has been translated by many authors as ‘doing nothing’ or ‘being still’. If you want references I will post them, but it will take some time for me to locate them.
Sri Ramana Mahrishi recommended two methods. One, "Enquire and find out who you are"
-
Shivadasan
- Posts: 251
- Joined: 03 Feb 2010, 07:52
Dear Ragam-Thalam,
I agree that one cannot dismiss the role of CM in the enlightenment process.
I would, however, like to add some explanation to your statement "Bhakti can be found in the swaras themselves, if one is so attuned. One can surrender to the nada inherent in the music and find salvation."
I agree that one cannot dismiss the role of CM in the enlightenment process.
I would, however, like to add some explanation to your statement "Bhakti can be found in the swaras themselves, if one is so attuned. One can surrender to the nada inherent in the music and find salvation."
-
Shivadasan
- Posts: 251
- Joined: 03 Feb 2010, 07:52
Dear cmlover,
You feel that "If one hears a jumble of sounds however musical how can it trigger the intellect prompting a critcal analysis that leads to 'atma gnaana'?
Many saints have emphasised that in gnana yoga a critical analysis is essential to overcome the hold of Maya or ignorance or whatever you may call it. It is used just like the bamboo pole that is used to kindle the fire in which a corpse is laid. Finally it is burnt out in the process and ceases to exist.
But in Bhakthi yoga no such analysis is required. The emphasis is on the sacrifice of one’s own interests while worshiping the Lord. This practice eliminates the ego to great extent and it also leads to the same state of mind a critical analysis leads to, viz., a state of bliss or ananda. So it is not impossible that hearing musical notes bestows a small portion of the bliss. It is unfortunate that a lover of CM should describe CM as ‘jumble of sounds’.
Shivadasan
You feel that "If one hears a jumble of sounds however musical how can it trigger the intellect prompting a critcal analysis that leads to 'atma gnaana'?
Many saints have emphasised that in gnana yoga a critical analysis is essential to overcome the hold of Maya or ignorance or whatever you may call it. It is used just like the bamboo pole that is used to kindle the fire in which a corpse is laid. Finally it is burnt out in the process and ceases to exist.
But in Bhakthi yoga no such analysis is required. The emphasis is on the sacrifice of one’s own interests while worshiping the Lord. This practice eliminates the ego to great extent and it also leads to the same state of mind a critical analysis leads to, viz., a state of bliss or ananda. So it is not impossible that hearing musical notes bestows a small portion of the bliss. It is unfortunate that a lover of CM should describe CM as ‘jumble of sounds’.
Shivadasan
-
uday_shankar
- Posts: 1475
- Joined: 03 Feb 2010, 08:37
Shivadasan,
You're right, I didn't put out an enumerated a list of "all" of Ramana Maharshi's so-called "teachings", if indeed he taught anything ! "Summa Iru" is indeed another key element of his jnana marga, apart from "Naan yaar", but I thought I addressed that too.
In any case, I apologize for entering into a discussion for which I have no taste whatever
.
You're right, I didn't put out an enumerated a list of "all" of Ramana Maharshi's so-called "teachings", if indeed he taught anything ! "Summa Iru" is indeed another key element of his jnana marga, apart from "Naan yaar", but I thought I addressed that too.
In any case, I apologize for entering into a discussion for which I have no taste whatever
.-
cmlover
- Posts: 11498
- Joined: 02 Feb 2010, 22:36
-
vasanthakokilam
- Posts: 10958
- Joined: 03 Feb 2010, 00:01
To a large extent, a lot of the 'techniques' are based on hypotheses on how our brian/internal mind operates. In that manner, let us hypothesize that a requirement for any type of atma-enquiry is a reduction in chaos. Let us loosly interpret Maharishi's 'summa iru' as 'reduce/eliminate your thought chaos'. Now what is chaos? If you open the faucet, water comes out in a turbulent fashion. You can reduce that turbulence by narrowing the faucet opening. Instead of water, if you use oil in the analogy, it is much less turbulent. There is an internal consistency to the flow, the thaila dara as our philosophers put it. The oil molecules do not go hither and thither but the whole flow is smooth with much less turbulence. There is a certan synchronicity among the various molecules that make up the oil flow.
Synchronicity is common in nature/biology and it is achieved through complex non-linear feedback. This is how all the heart cells beat together, for example and also how the audience claps together(!) without a conductor. As a working definition, synchronization is a process where two or more systems interact with each other in possibly complex fashion and learn to move/oscillate together.
Now, can external sounds (especially music) cause internal synchrony and thus reduce/eliminate internal thought chaos? We can not dismiss that though I do not know the exact processes that will be involved. If one accepts that, then a case can be made for certain types of music as an enabling tool, a tool that prepares the 'less chaotic thaila dara' ground on which the mind can do deep atma-vichara.
Here is a metaphor: Watch this video of a popular experiment on how feedback causes two systems to get in phase. ( remember this is just a metaphor, no claim is made this is exactly how sounds affect the mind )
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yysnkY4WHyM
Synchronicity is common in nature/biology and it is achieved through complex non-linear feedback. This is how all the heart cells beat together, for example and also how the audience claps together(!) without a conductor. As a working definition, synchronization is a process where two or more systems interact with each other in possibly complex fashion and learn to move/oscillate together.
Now, can external sounds (especially music) cause internal synchrony and thus reduce/eliminate internal thought chaos? We can not dismiss that though I do not know the exact processes that will be involved. If one accepts that, then a case can be made for certain types of music as an enabling tool, a tool that prepares the 'less chaotic thaila dara' ground on which the mind can do deep atma-vichara.
Here is a metaphor: Watch this video of a popular experiment on how feedback causes two systems to get in phase. ( remember this is just a metaphor, no claim is made this is exactly how sounds affect the mind )
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yysnkY4WHyM
-
Shivadasan
- Posts: 251
- Joined: 03 Feb 2010, 07:52
-
srikant1987
- Posts: 2246
- Joined: 10 Jun 2007, 12:23
-
ragam-talam
- Posts: 1896
- Joined: 28 Sep 2006, 02:15
Yes, but that's what I have been exploring in this thread. We know that not all people are touched equally by music, especially by classical music, so that must be mean there is an internal factor that needs to be present for the magic to happen.Shivadasan wrote:Only a true Bhaktha would be able to find Bhakthi in swaras. But it is doubtful that any amount of listening to swaras might evoke Bhakthi in the listener if he is not spiritually inclined. For the external divine music to potentially trigger the inner nAda, the listener should have the inner potential.
I am also looking into some of the external factors about CM that can help in this process. For instance, how can we be alert to the silences and gaps that arise in our music and find the divine there? To me, CM can be a great catalyst on the spiritual journey.
And bhakthi can also be for the nadabrahma in music, not necessarily to the standard god that does the rounds.
You wrote,"To dismiss all this as impossible smacks of a certain extremism in thinking"
-
ragam-talam
- Posts: 1896
- Joined: 28 Sep 2006, 02:15
Let me quote here a few kritis by Tyagaraja on this topic:
(reference - http://sahityam.net/wiki/Category:Tyagaraja )
1) svara rAga sudhA - Sankarabharanam
svara rAga sudhA rasa yuta bhakti
svargApavargamurA O manasA
O Mind! Devotion, together with the nectarine juice of Svara and Raga,
is indeed heaven and also emancipation!
charanam
bahu janmamulaku paini jñAniyai
baraguṭa mOkṣhamurA
sahaja bhaktitO rAga jñAna
sahituḍu muktuḍurA O manasA
Becoming a wise one after many births,
is certainly emancipation; but,
one endowed with the true knowledge of music together with devotion
is indeed emancipated (while still alive)
2) Raga sudha - Andholika
rAga sudhA rasa pAnamu jEsi ranjillavE O manasA
O My Mind! Exult by drinking the nectarine juice of music
charanam
sadASiva mayamagu nAdOnkAra svara
vidulu jIvanmuktulani tyAgarAju teliyu
Thyagaraja knows that those well-versed in the sapta svara, emanating from Pranava Nada,
which is of the nature of the Supreme Lord, are indeed the living-liberated
3) Nada loludai - kalyanavasantam
nAda lOluDai brahmA-
nandamandavE manasA
Attain the Supreme Bliss by being immersed in Nada, O Mind!
anupallavi
swAdu phala prada sapta
swara rAga nicaya sahita (nAda)
(Attain ... immersed in Nada), which consists of the seven swaras
and the multitude of Ragas that bestow sweet results
(reference - http://sahityam.net/wiki/Category:Tyagaraja )
1) svara rAga sudhA - Sankarabharanam
svara rAga sudhA rasa yuta bhakti
svargApavargamurA O manasA
O Mind! Devotion, together with the nectarine juice of Svara and Raga,
is indeed heaven and also emancipation!
charanam
bahu janmamulaku paini jñAniyai
baraguṭa mOkṣhamurA
sahaja bhaktitO rAga jñAna
sahituḍu muktuḍurA O manasA
Becoming a wise one after many births,
is certainly emancipation; but,
one endowed with the true knowledge of music together with devotion
is indeed emancipated (while still alive)
2) Raga sudha - Andholika
rAga sudhA rasa pAnamu jEsi ranjillavE O manasA
O My Mind! Exult by drinking the nectarine juice of music
charanam
sadASiva mayamagu nAdOnkAra svara
vidulu jIvanmuktulani tyAgarAju teliyu
Thyagaraja knows that those well-versed in the sapta svara, emanating from Pranava Nada,
which is of the nature of the Supreme Lord, are indeed the living-liberated
3) Nada loludai - kalyanavasantam
nAda lOluDai brahmA-
nandamandavE manasA
Attain the Supreme Bliss by being immersed in Nada, O Mind!
anupallavi
swAdu phala prada sapta
swara rAga nicaya sahita (nAda)
(Attain ... immersed in Nada), which consists of the seven swaras
and the multitude of Ragas that bestow sweet results
-
Shivadasan
- Posts: 251
- Joined: 03 Feb 2010, 07:52
I am just wondering why we are not taking into consideration Sree Ogirala Veera RAghava Sharma (Sree GnAnandhaTeertha) who appears to be one person in this era who did Nada Upasana and obtained the Grace of the Deity. Perhaps O.S.Ramakrishna will be able to answer some of our question from his guru’s as well his own experience. May be his krithis might contain some useful information.
-
ragam-talam
- Posts: 1896
- Joined: 28 Sep 2006, 02:15
Perhaps one of the performing artistes can also throw some light.
Here's a lovely exposition by vidyaarthi on Nada tanumanusam:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=93v2102aQ7M
Here's a lovely exposition by vidyaarthi on Nada tanumanusam:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=93v2102aQ7M
-
ragam-talam
- Posts: 1896
- Joined: 28 Sep 2006, 02:15
Very interesting article on this topic:
http://www.ipnatlanta.net/camaga/vidyar ... vation.htm
"Sri Thyagaraja Swami not only stresses the importance of recognizing and developing the ability to experience Mooladhara nada, but also more specifically asks the votaries to practice sangitopasana as a means and prelude to enjoying nadopasana."
and
"Indeed , through sangita he urged us to acquire the wisdom of perceiving Brahman, the intelligence to analyze and experience Him; the diligence to seek Him; and the patience to wait for enlightenment. He described his Rama as an embodiment of Nada. No other composer has in such a simple and appealing ways taught music as art, science, philosophy and ultimately, as a means to salvation."
Would be interesting to find out if Dikshitar or Syama Sastry also speak about nadopasana in any of their kritis.
http://www.ipnatlanta.net/camaga/vidyar ... vation.htm
"Sri Thyagaraja Swami not only stresses the importance of recognizing and developing the ability to experience Mooladhara nada, but also more specifically asks the votaries to practice sangitopasana as a means and prelude to enjoying nadopasana."
and
"Indeed , through sangita he urged us to acquire the wisdom of perceiving Brahman, the intelligence to analyze and experience Him; the diligence to seek Him; and the patience to wait for enlightenment. He described his Rama as an embodiment of Nada. No other composer has in such a simple and appealing ways taught music as art, science, philosophy and ultimately, as a means to salvation."
Would be interesting to find out if Dikshitar or Syama Sastry also speak about nadopasana in any of their kritis.
Last edited by ragam-talam on 30 May 2009, 12:45, edited 1 time in total.
-
arasi
- Posts: 16873
- Joined: 22 Jun 2006, 09:30
ragam_talam,
In this connection:
Ambujam Krishna:
SimhEndra madhyamam rUpakam
pAnam Seyya vArIr!--rAma nAma sudhA rasattaip (pAnam Seyya)
gAnam Seidu kazhal pOTRi, jAnaki ramaNan sEvai
kaliyil kaNDa tyAgarAja swAmi namakkaLitta amuda (pAnam)
vEdap poruL dAsaratiyaik kAdal pongak kanindu tuditta
nAda vEda pArangadar gAna rasattinaik kaLippuRavE (pAnam Seyya)
In this connection:
Ambujam Krishna:
SimhEndra madhyamam rUpakam
pAnam Seyya vArIr!--rAma nAma sudhA rasattaip (pAnam Seyya)
gAnam Seidu kazhal pOTRi, jAnaki ramaNan sEvai
kaliyil kaNDa tyAgarAja swAmi namakkaLitta amuda (pAnam)
vEdap poruL dAsaratiyaik kAdal pongak kanindu tuditta
nAda vEda pArangadar gAna rasattinaik kaLippuRavE (pAnam Seyya)
-
ragam-talam
- Posts: 1896
- Joined: 28 Sep 2006, 02:15
-
arasi
- Posts: 16873
- Joined: 22 Jun 2006, 09:30
CML,
I might have fooled around saying that my ASu kavi was yours, but I dare not take credit for AK's composition! It is from Geetha Mala
Vol: One. The song was tuned by V.V.Sadagopan.
Ragam_talam,
My interpretation. Ravi might do a better job!
Come, let's partake of the nectar of rAmA's name!
By singing praises of RamA and of his divine feet constantly, he could
see with his own eyes the beloved of jAnaki even in this kali yugam--and let's partake of that rAma nAma nectar which tyAgarAjA
has gifted to us.
dAsarathi who is the very essence of the vEdAs was worshipped by that tyAgarAjA with endless love and compassion. He was an exponent of nAda vEdA. Let's partake of his sweet music with joy!
I might have fooled around saying that my ASu kavi was yours, but I dare not take credit for AK's composition! It is from Geetha Mala
Vol: One. The song was tuned by V.V.Sadagopan.
Ragam_talam,
My interpretation. Ravi might do a better job!
Come, let's partake of the nectar of rAmA's name!
By singing praises of RamA and of his divine feet constantly, he could
see with his own eyes the beloved of jAnaki even in this kali yugam--and let's partake of that rAma nAma nectar which tyAgarAjA
has gifted to us.
dAsarathi who is the very essence of the vEdAs was worshipped by that tyAgarAjA with endless love and compassion. He was an exponent of nAda vEdA. Let's partake of his sweet music with joy!
-
Shivadasan
- Posts: 251
- Joined: 03 Feb 2010, 07:52
Dear Ragam-Talam
I have checked up a number of krithis of Dikshitar and I have not been able to locate any reference to Nadopasana or efforts to be taken by us to achieve the Ultimate. Perhaps his line of sadhana was not Nadopasana. Most probably his method was mantra sadhana and he must have had darshanas of many gods and goddesses through that upasana. He says in many of his krithis that music pleases the deities and indicates that music can be used as vehicle to please gods and goddesses. It appears that the purpose of his compositions were not an expression of his thoughts or emotions but were for a specific purpose, viz., leaving his treasure of knowledge of worshipping the deities for the posterity so that generations can obtain benefit from them.
Shyama Sastry on the other hand longed for the vision of goddess Kamakshi and his compositions pour out his bhakthi and emotions. Since I do not have access to any book on his sahityas I have not been able to make a search regarding what he says about Nadopasana.
Saint Thyagaraja appears to exhort the people to adopt true music that would take them towards enlightenment. He states that he has received all the secrets of the music and the swaras and possesses the knowledge of Swararnava imparted to Parvathi by Shiva and indicates that following that path would take one to life’s goal, viz., realization. His knowledge of music and its connection with spirituality is confirmed by his statements that Nada emanates from Mooladhara and the glorious sapta swaras originate from the various parts of the body (according to Spiritual Heritage). He addresses us and asks us to sing only after attaining the subtle knowledge of Maddala, Tala and Gathi . He was a pioneer in enlightenment through music who asks us to follow his steps.
Shivadasan
I have checked up a number of krithis of Dikshitar and I have not been able to locate any reference to Nadopasana or efforts to be taken by us to achieve the Ultimate. Perhaps his line of sadhana was not Nadopasana. Most probably his method was mantra sadhana and he must have had darshanas of many gods and goddesses through that upasana. He says in many of his krithis that music pleases the deities and indicates that music can be used as vehicle to please gods and goddesses. It appears that the purpose of his compositions were not an expression of his thoughts or emotions but were for a specific purpose, viz., leaving his treasure of knowledge of worshipping the deities for the posterity so that generations can obtain benefit from them.
Shyama Sastry on the other hand longed for the vision of goddess Kamakshi and his compositions pour out his bhakthi and emotions. Since I do not have access to any book on his sahityas I have not been able to make a search regarding what he says about Nadopasana.
Saint Thyagaraja appears to exhort the people to adopt true music that would take them towards enlightenment. He states that he has received all the secrets of the music and the swaras and possesses the knowledge of Swararnava imparted to Parvathi by Shiva and indicates that following that path would take one to life’s goal, viz., realization. His knowledge of music and its connection with spirituality is confirmed by his statements that Nada emanates from Mooladhara and the glorious sapta swaras originate from the various parts of the body (according to Spiritual Heritage). He addresses us and asks us to sing only after attaining the subtle knowledge of Maddala, Tala and Gathi . He was a pioneer in enlightenment through music who asks us to follow his steps.
Shivadasan
-
ragam-talam
- Posts: 1896
- Joined: 28 Sep 2006, 02:15
Interesting article that maps gods to organs of the human body.
http://www.hindujagruti.org/hinduism/kn ... -body.html
I already knew that Saraswati is supposed to signify a nerve in the tongue (vidya) and Ganesha is the guardian of mooladhara, but the above is of some interest.
Now, the question is whether CM can help to energise these organs, thereby improving health.
Spiritual growth can also be enhanced, of course.
http://www.hindujagruti.org/hinduism/kn ... -body.html
I already knew that Saraswati is supposed to signify a nerve in the tongue (vidya) and Ganesha is the guardian of mooladhara, but the above is of some interest.
Now, the question is whether CM can help to energise these organs, thereby improving health.
Spiritual growth can also be enhanced, of course.
-
gobilalitha
- Posts: 2056
- Joined: 03 Feb 2010, 07:12
-
Music
- Posts: 149
- Joined: 21 Jul 2006, 20:25
Someone pointed to Veena Gayathri's blog in this forum earlier. Read through her blog and you will see she seems to be on the path of enlightenment through CM.
http://egayathri.blogspot.com/
http://egayathri.blogspot.com/
-
ogirala sri ramakrishna
- Posts: 126
- Joined: 30 May 2006, 15:58
Sri Sivadasan writes
I am just wondering why we are not taking into consideration Sree Ogirala Veera RAghava Sharma (Sree GnAnandhaTeertha) who appears to be one person in this era who did Nada Upasana and obtained the Grace of the Deity. Perhaps O.S.Ramakrishna will be able to answer some of our question from his guru’s as well his own experience. May be his krithis might contain some useful information.
H H Bhakta Gnanananda Tirtha( Sree Ogirala Veera RAghava Sharma Garu ) , the Saint composer of 20 th century uses to say during his life time that the pujas etc we do will reach god like an ordinary post card. If we sing a song with devotion will reach god like a fax message .
Generally when we are sending a fax we will write reply by return fax.
Similarly whenever there is a problem the saint composer uses to compose a song. That will reach Goddess Gayatry . After seeing the message she uses to send messages by telling the solution to his problem appearing in his dreams. in some cases she was forced to come down to earth to solve his problems.
Once he received an offer from KAULALAMPUR to serve there as aprincipal of a music college from some tamilians threre. He has accepted the invitation for going to that place. After hearing this news his admirers late sri Rajaji, D.Venkataswamy Naidu, V.Nagayya etc arranged a farewell party in his honour.
In those days he is staying at REPALLY near GUNTUR,AP. After puja he has to catch the train. That is auspicious friday. After puja suddenly a song OMTARIGA VIDESAMULA KANUPAKA NA VEMTA RAVALE NAMMA in the raga vachaspati came out. The meaning of the song is through this song he is praying Gayatry to accompany him to foreign land, save & protect him from accidents and bless him with victory. He has send this song like a fax to Gayatry.
After the function he is sleeping at Madras. After receiving his message Gayatry appeared to him in a dream to solve his problem. then she told him not to go to foreign land. Then she told him that some persons will meet him in few days and go along with them where ever they take him and do what ever the job they give to him. He was very much surprised. After few days few persons came from Kovvur in West Godavari District of AP with a proposal requesting him to come to their place as a Principal of a Music College . Immediately he has accepted their offer and moved to Guntur.
This is effect of Nada yoga in the life of Saint composer.
In another incident once he has to prepare food for god as mahanaivedya. He started cooking in morning around 0700 hrs. Simultaneously he has started his nitya pooja. After pooja he has started singing songs in praise of Gayatry playing tanbura. In this process he has forgotten about his cooking. At 1400 hrs one child asked him to give food. Then he entered the kitchen. in normal experience the food will be spoiled.
but in this case food is ready with hot fumes in all the aspects. here the meaning is even though naivedya is a ritual god waited for the food. When he was not in the senses to prepare the food Gayatry herself was forced to come down to earth from heaven to cook his food. She has cooked the food and taken her share as naivedya and left back to heaven.
after seeing the cooked food a song VINNA NAMMA JANANI NI KATHA LENNO in the raga Maniramgu in praise of Kasi Annapurna. Meaning is KASI ANNAPURNA herself came to his house. Prepared his food, taken her share as naivedya and left to her abode.
this was the effect of nada yoga we have seen in ihe life of the saint composer.
He has spend his whole life worshipping Gayatry through nada yoga deatching him self from all other activities.
He told nada yoga will lead to salvation .
he told this in the song Nadanamda anubhava SAliki NANA vidha yoni janana badha lumdune manasa.
In this song he has declared there is no rebirth for a nada yogi .
You can go through the sahitya telugu / tamil from my site BHAKTA GNANANANDA TIRTHA under the section books.
On the science of music he composed one song. One day he was attending a cocert of his friend at Kovvur. During concert artist is dooing swara kalpana. Suddenly one Advocate who is an admirer of saint without seeing him commented not to make swara kalpana and instead sing some more songs. For this comment the saint composer became angry. After reaching the house he could not sleep. then a song came down from the depths of his heart like holy ganges. that song is SWARA JANITOMKARA NADA KHAMDA PAMJARAPU CHILIKA in the raga AArabhi.
In this the importance of swarakalpana by artist and the changes that occur in our body as a result were told.
In simple wods it was told that nada yoga will lead to salvation.
The saint composer lived 80 years on this earth. The whole life he prayed the god to bless him with bhakti and mukti in this birth only. he prayed the god for the welfare and prosperity of mankind.
In my experience singing the songs with devotion ie nada yoga will provide a hot line connection with god. we will be in touch with the god 24 hours.
I have learnt the songs of the saint composer. I donot know other songs. I will sing all his 85 regulalry which keeps me in contact with god.
I will share some more information later. If you wany any other clarification write me.
regards
o s ramakrishna
I am just wondering why we are not taking into consideration Sree Ogirala Veera RAghava Sharma (Sree GnAnandhaTeertha) who appears to be one person in this era who did Nada Upasana and obtained the Grace of the Deity. Perhaps O.S.Ramakrishna will be able to answer some of our question from his guru’s as well his own experience. May be his krithis might contain some useful information.
H H Bhakta Gnanananda Tirtha( Sree Ogirala Veera RAghava Sharma Garu ) , the Saint composer of 20 th century uses to say during his life time that the pujas etc we do will reach god like an ordinary post card. If we sing a song with devotion will reach god like a fax message .
Generally when we are sending a fax we will write reply by return fax.
Similarly whenever there is a problem the saint composer uses to compose a song. That will reach Goddess Gayatry . After seeing the message she uses to send messages by telling the solution to his problem appearing in his dreams. in some cases she was forced to come down to earth to solve his problems.
Once he received an offer from KAULALAMPUR to serve there as aprincipal of a music college from some tamilians threre. He has accepted the invitation for going to that place. After hearing this news his admirers late sri Rajaji, D.Venkataswamy Naidu, V.Nagayya etc arranged a farewell party in his honour.
In those days he is staying at REPALLY near GUNTUR,AP. After puja he has to catch the train. That is auspicious friday. After puja suddenly a song OMTARIGA VIDESAMULA KANUPAKA NA VEMTA RAVALE NAMMA in the raga vachaspati came out. The meaning of the song is through this song he is praying Gayatry to accompany him to foreign land, save & protect him from accidents and bless him with victory. He has send this song like a fax to Gayatry.
After the function he is sleeping at Madras. After receiving his message Gayatry appeared to him in a dream to solve his problem. then she told him not to go to foreign land. Then she told him that some persons will meet him in few days and go along with them where ever they take him and do what ever the job they give to him. He was very much surprised. After few days few persons came from Kovvur in West Godavari District of AP with a proposal requesting him to come to their place as a Principal of a Music College . Immediately he has accepted their offer and moved to Guntur.
This is effect of Nada yoga in the life of Saint composer.
In another incident once he has to prepare food for god as mahanaivedya. He started cooking in morning around 0700 hrs. Simultaneously he has started his nitya pooja. After pooja he has started singing songs in praise of Gayatry playing tanbura. In this process he has forgotten about his cooking. At 1400 hrs one child asked him to give food. Then he entered the kitchen. in normal experience the food will be spoiled.
but in this case food is ready with hot fumes in all the aspects. here the meaning is even though naivedya is a ritual god waited for the food. When he was not in the senses to prepare the food Gayatry herself was forced to come down to earth from heaven to cook his food. She has cooked the food and taken her share as naivedya and left back to heaven.
after seeing the cooked food a song VINNA NAMMA JANANI NI KATHA LENNO in the raga Maniramgu in praise of Kasi Annapurna. Meaning is KASI ANNAPURNA herself came to his house. Prepared his food, taken her share as naivedya and left to her abode.
this was the effect of nada yoga we have seen in ihe life of the saint composer.
He has spend his whole life worshipping Gayatry through nada yoga deatching him self from all other activities.
He told nada yoga will lead to salvation .
he told this in the song Nadanamda anubhava SAliki NANA vidha yoni janana badha lumdune manasa.
In this song he has declared there is no rebirth for a nada yogi .
You can go through the sahitya telugu / tamil from my site BHAKTA GNANANANDA TIRTHA under the section books.
On the science of music he composed one song. One day he was attending a cocert of his friend at Kovvur. During concert artist is dooing swara kalpana. Suddenly one Advocate who is an admirer of saint without seeing him commented not to make swara kalpana and instead sing some more songs. For this comment the saint composer became angry. After reaching the house he could not sleep. then a song came down from the depths of his heart like holy ganges. that song is SWARA JANITOMKARA NADA KHAMDA PAMJARAPU CHILIKA in the raga AArabhi.
In this the importance of swarakalpana by artist and the changes that occur in our body as a result were told.
In simple wods it was told that nada yoga will lead to salvation.
The saint composer lived 80 years on this earth. The whole life he prayed the god to bless him with bhakti and mukti in this birth only. he prayed the god for the welfare and prosperity of mankind.
In my experience singing the songs with devotion ie nada yoga will provide a hot line connection with god. we will be in touch with the god 24 hours.
I have learnt the songs of the saint composer. I donot know other songs. I will sing all his 85 regulalry which keeps me in contact with god.
I will share some more information later. If you wany any other clarification write me.
regards
o s ramakrishna
-
munirao2001
- Posts: 1334
- Joined: 28 Feb 2009, 11:35
Vedanta gives the ultimate achievement or benefit, at the end of knowledge(Vedanta) is attainment of state or SAT-CHIT-ANANDA.
CM, has developed with two major or vital motives - attainment of SAT - CHIT - ANANDA, for the spirutual seeker and 'Karna Etih Karnataka'- pleasing to the ears of the listener/rasika, seeking entertainment and relaxation(remedy from stress).
For the spiritual seeker, CM is good(San) and easy (sulabha) paths(Margas), for the attainment of SAT-CHIT-ANANDA, as claimed and adviced by the Great Vaggeyakaras and Great Sadhakas/practioners. The true meaning of SAT-CHIT-ANANDA is - SAT-knowledge of Fact and perception of reality; CHIT - State of being with Unconditoned Mind, ever fresh and free; ANANDA- Blissful- a state - thought less state - in which you forget outer self/ outward consciousness and drawn in to inner self/inward consiousness or supra consciousness, the momments you come out of that state and come back to original state of outward consciousness, you realize the heightened pleasure that moment has bestowed, energizing you. For spiritual seekers and sadhakas, the moment is being one with divinity. The experience resulting in ushering, peace of mind. For the believers and workshippers, the feelings at the moment of the darshan of the idol and for the non-belivers, the feeling when they have sight of vision of Nature's, breadthtaking wonderful scenerio - Mountains, Waterfalls, riot of colors of Sun's rays, greenery etc and the happiness, on realization, few moments after actual vision of the happening.
This energizing experience(s) are enlightenment. You gather momentum in Life or living and strengthened, to meet the challenges in life, with equanimity and truly enjoy the Life.
Music-Classical-CM, is realized as one of the best instrument - tools/technique-method or marga/road to achieve the Goal and Objective. You first enjoy the Nadanubhavam, through your practice and performance/singing and later partake the enjoyment with the listeners/rasikas. The rasikas/listeners acceptance, appreciation and support, giving the practioner ego satisfacftion of sense of achievement and motivation(rejuvenating feelings after thunderous applause-not mechanical, of course-nothing to beat it ). Rewards and Recogniton, too!
To internalize and live or conduct the life, with unalloyed happiness and striving for such happiness to all other living beings, if not, atleast not hindering the other's progress, consciously, is spirutuality. Factually, only very few attain such sidhi state and they become Saints/Gods.
The Pracrtioner/performer and rasika/listner has to have his/her clarity on the Goals and Objectives - either Enlightenment or Entertainment, to get total satisfaction out of CM.
CM, has developed with two major or vital motives - attainment of SAT - CHIT - ANANDA, for the spirutual seeker and 'Karna Etih Karnataka'- pleasing to the ears of the listener/rasika, seeking entertainment and relaxation(remedy from stress).
For the spiritual seeker, CM is good(San) and easy (sulabha) paths(Margas), for the attainment of SAT-CHIT-ANANDA, as claimed and adviced by the Great Vaggeyakaras and Great Sadhakas/practioners. The true meaning of SAT-CHIT-ANANDA is - SAT-knowledge of Fact and perception of reality; CHIT - State of being with Unconditoned Mind, ever fresh and free; ANANDA- Blissful- a state - thought less state - in which you forget outer self/ outward consciousness and drawn in to inner self/inward consiousness or supra consciousness, the momments you come out of that state and come back to original state of outward consciousness, you realize the heightened pleasure that moment has bestowed, energizing you. For spiritual seekers and sadhakas, the moment is being one with divinity. The experience resulting in ushering, peace of mind. For the believers and workshippers, the feelings at the moment of the darshan of the idol and for the non-belivers, the feeling when they have sight of vision of Nature's, breadthtaking wonderful scenerio - Mountains, Waterfalls, riot of colors of Sun's rays, greenery etc and the happiness, on realization, few moments after actual vision of the happening.
This energizing experience(s) are enlightenment. You gather momentum in Life or living and strengthened, to meet the challenges in life, with equanimity and truly enjoy the Life.
Music-Classical-CM, is realized as one of the best instrument - tools/technique-method or marga/road to achieve the Goal and Objective. You first enjoy the Nadanubhavam, through your practice and performance/singing and later partake the enjoyment with the listeners/rasikas. The rasikas/listeners acceptance, appreciation and support, giving the practioner ego satisfacftion of sense of achievement and motivation(rejuvenating feelings after thunderous applause-not mechanical, of course-nothing to beat it ). Rewards and Recogniton, too!
To internalize and live or conduct the life, with unalloyed happiness and striving for such happiness to all other living beings, if not, atleast not hindering the other's progress, consciously, is spirutuality. Factually, only very few attain such sidhi state and they become Saints/Gods.
The Pracrtioner/performer and rasika/listner has to have his/her clarity on the Goals and Objectives - either Enlightenment or Entertainment, to get total satisfaction out of CM.
-
munirao2001
- Posts: 1334
- Joined: 28 Feb 2009, 11:35
Shivadasan
Your post '31' is commendable.
About the effect of Tanpura/Tambura, I would like to share an interesting incident. When UN declared observation of 'World Music Day' for the first time, Yehudi Menuhin had requested suggestions from Musicians, all over the World for the observation day, with the theme as 'Peace through Music'. The request was also made to Late Dr.Sandhyavandanam Srinivasa Rao, Principal Central College of Music(Now known as Tamil Nadu Govt.Music College), a premier institute, located in Madras/Chennai. There were many suggestions by the vetern professors and lecturers. SSRao suggested, duly supported by the eminent faculty, to Yehudi Menuhin that at the start of the observation function, a finely tuned Tambura to be played for atleast for two minutes, the nada pervading signifies the Peace, which was the theme. The suggestion was accepted and the tambura was played for five minutes. He wrote to SSRao that this was one the Best suggestions he had received and thanked him for the suggestion. Late KVN, who was a lecturer at that time, used to narrate about this inspiring suggestion, on nuemerous occasions.
SSRao, my Father and Guru, ensured that, every time practice session was to start, the tanpura to be fine tuned and made me keep my ear on the kudam and silently and attentively listen to the drone. The effect can only be felt (as many of you must have experienced) and can not be put in words.
Your post '31' is commendable.
About the effect of Tanpura/Tambura, I would like to share an interesting incident. When UN declared observation of 'World Music Day' for the first time, Yehudi Menuhin had requested suggestions from Musicians, all over the World for the observation day, with the theme as 'Peace through Music'. The request was also made to Late Dr.Sandhyavandanam Srinivasa Rao, Principal Central College of Music(Now known as Tamil Nadu Govt.Music College), a premier institute, located in Madras/Chennai. There were many suggestions by the vetern professors and lecturers. SSRao suggested, duly supported by the eminent faculty, to Yehudi Menuhin that at the start of the observation function, a finely tuned Tambura to be played for atleast for two minutes, the nada pervading signifies the Peace, which was the theme. The suggestion was accepted and the tambura was played for five minutes. He wrote to SSRao that this was one the Best suggestions he had received and thanked him for the suggestion. Late KVN, who was a lecturer at that time, used to narrate about this inspiring suggestion, on nuemerous occasions.
SSRao, my Father and Guru, ensured that, every time practice session was to start, the tanpura to be fine tuned and made me keep my ear on the kudam and silently and attentively listen to the drone. The effect can only be felt (as many of you must have experienced) and can not be put in words.
-
ogirala sri ramakrishna
- Posts: 126
- Joined: 30 May 2006, 15:58
Could you post the song
VINNA NAMMA JANANI NI KATHA LENNO
with meaning (for us non-telugus) along with an audio if possible?
you can get the song with meaning in tamil and tamiltransliteration in my site BHAKTA GNANANANDA TEERTHA.
Pallavi: vinna namma janani ni katha lenno bhakTApanna rakshani vainatu :: vinna namma ::
Anupallavi: AnnapurNEswari ilalo AAkonnavari kamruTAnna midi brotuvani :: vinna namma :
Charanam : PAvana gamGA TIramamdu baragu VAraNAsi purini velasina
BHAvajaripu priya BHAminivai BHUbharamanachu RAghaVARchita BHAgaymani :: vinna namma ::
O S RAMAKRISHNA
VINNA NAMMA JANANI NI KATHA LENNO
with meaning (for us non-telugus) along with an audio if possible?
you can get the song with meaning in tamil and tamiltransliteration in my site BHAKTA GNANANANDA TEERTHA.
Pallavi: vinna namma janani ni katha lenno bhakTApanna rakshani vainatu :: vinna namma ::
Anupallavi: AnnapurNEswari ilalo AAkonnavari kamruTAnna midi brotuvani :: vinna namma :
Charanam : PAvana gamGA TIramamdu baragu VAraNAsi purini velasina
BHAvajaripu priya BHAminivai BHUbharamanachu RAghaVARchita BHAgaymani :: vinna namma ::
O S RAMAKRISHNA
-
cmlover
- Posts: 11498
- Joined: 02 Feb 2010, 22:36
Thanks
unfortunately the 'tamil' image #66,67 listed do not correspond to the song for getting the meaning!
11 Vinna namma Maniramgu Adi 53, 54 66, 67
at your lyrics site
http://ogiralaveeraraghavasarma.com/songs1.html
unfortunately the 'tamil' image #66,67 listed do not correspond to the song for getting the meaning!
11 Vinna namma Maniramgu Adi 53, 54 66, 67
at your lyrics site
http://ogiralaveeraraghavasarma.com/songs1.html
-
ogirala sri ramakrishna
- Posts: 126
- Joined: 30 May 2006, 15:58
The song PAdayuga saroruham in the raga bilahari indicates that H H BHAKTA GNANANANDA TIRTHA was a Nada yogi. This was indicated in anupallavi like this
anupallavi: VAdatarka rahiTAkhamda NAdaYOgi hrudBHAsita ;;PAdayuga saroruham::
in ihe song swara janita in the raga yoga process the awakening of kundalini , its journey were explained in the charanam.
He has composed the song NAmasuMARchana jetu in the raga MAyamalavagowla in the year 1978. After that he has advised us to sing that song regularly which is equal to your nitya puja. If you are unable to do your nitya puja due to sickness or you may be in journey at that time then also you can sing this song.
In my case I sing the song during all the three times in the day ie; morning, afternoon,evening.
His every song is a mantra. Singing that song means doing mantra japa only.
The mantras Gayatry, Sri Vidhya, Maha mrutyumjaya, Ganesa, Durga ,Lakhmi etc were in these songs. by rendering the songs we can get our bhukt and mukti also.
o s ramakrishna
anupallavi: VAdatarka rahiTAkhamda NAdaYOgi hrudBHAsita ;;PAdayuga saroruham::
in ihe song swara janita in the raga yoga process the awakening of kundalini , its journey were explained in the charanam.
He has composed the song NAmasuMARchana jetu in the raga MAyamalavagowla in the year 1978. After that he has advised us to sing that song regularly which is equal to your nitya puja. If you are unable to do your nitya puja due to sickness or you may be in journey at that time then also you can sing this song.
In my case I sing the song during all the three times in the day ie; morning, afternoon,evening.
His every song is a mantra. Singing that song means doing mantra japa only.
The mantras Gayatry, Sri Vidhya, Maha mrutyumjaya, Ganesa, Durga ,Lakhmi etc were in these songs. by rendering the songs we can get our bhukt and mukti also.
o s ramakrishna
-
cmlover
- Posts: 11498
- Joined: 02 Feb 2010, 22:36
I agree with VKR
Could you Munirao2001 or others post a 2 minute clip of inspiring tambura shruti (not the electronic one), the kind that you think will be peaceful and conducive for meditation. We can play it on a loop in the computer which will have a therapeutic calming effect whenever we are perturbed. As a specialist I need not overemphasize the effect of such 'sound therapy' for mental health! If SSRao had found the ideal 'sound' we would be much obliged if you can share it with us!
Could you Munirao2001 or others post a 2 minute clip of inspiring tambura shruti (not the electronic one), the kind that you think will be peaceful and conducive for meditation. We can play it on a loop in the computer which will have a therapeutic calming effect whenever we are perturbed. As a specialist I need not overemphasize the effect of such 'sound therapy' for mental health! If SSRao had found the ideal 'sound' we would be much obliged if you can share it with us!
-
munirao2001
- Posts: 1334
- Joined: 28 Feb 2009, 11:35
-
ragam-talam
- Posts: 1896
- Joined: 28 Sep 2006, 02:15
Just went back to read post 31 of Shivadasan:
When one is listening to (or performing) CM intensely, all thoughts fall by the wayside, and a deep restful feeling comes about. I suppose this is a taste of enlightenment.Enlightenment can be described as a condition of mind when it is in a peculiar state where it so much absorbed within in experiencing that ‘something indescribable’ that there is no desire to think. So no thoughts arise. The mind is blank. J.Krishnamurthy calls it a sate of ‘Choiceless Awareness’. If this state of absorption prevails all the time he would be considered as enlightened.
-
munirao2001
- Posts: 1334
- Joined: 28 Feb 2009, 11:35
ragam-talam
To me, Ananda-pure blissful state can be described as a conditon of mind, when it is in a unique state, where it is so much absorbed within, in experiencing that 'something indescribable moments' that, there is no desire to think. So no thoughts arise. The mind is in animated suspense.
Achieving awareness, the moments energizing, unconditioning mind, bursting forth with creativity afresh, is enlightenment. Taking Self less actions for the benefit of all living beings, continuously, unabated and remaining steadfast, is being enlightened.
When one is experiencing the ultimate Nada sakshatkara-Nadanubhavam, Ananda-Blissful state is attained for those moments. With cessation of Ego-Ego death, the performer offers music with enlightenment and the rasika with unconditioned mind, enjoys and is also enlightened.
munirao2001
To me, Ananda-pure blissful state can be described as a conditon of mind, when it is in a unique state, where it is so much absorbed within, in experiencing that 'something indescribable moments' that, there is no desire to think. So no thoughts arise. The mind is in animated suspense.
Achieving awareness, the moments energizing, unconditioning mind, bursting forth with creativity afresh, is enlightenment. Taking Self less actions for the benefit of all living beings, continuously, unabated and remaining steadfast, is being enlightened.
When one is experiencing the ultimate Nada sakshatkara-Nadanubhavam, Ananda-Blissful state is attained for those moments. With cessation of Ego-Ego death, the performer offers music with enlightenment and the rasika with unconditioned mind, enjoys and is also enlightened.
munirao2001