Pachimiriyam Adiyappa

vijay · Post by **vijay** » 11 Jan 2007, 11:42

Just the one song, and not even a kriti at that - but a gem of rare lustre!

If we had more of his compositions, would he not rank alongside the trinity?! The only info I could glean from the net was that he was the guru (?) of Syama Sastri. What else do we know about this composer - any chance that other works might have survived the fickleness of collective human memory?

And while we are at it, can we assemble a collection of classsic Viribhonis from the great masters?

Vijay

coolkarni · Post by **coolkarni** » 11 Jan 2007, 11:44

aha !
this thread is going to be scintillating

ramakriya · Post by **ramakriya** » 11 Jan 2007, 11:46

tathAstu!

coolkarni · Post by **coolkarni** » 11 Jan 2007, 17:52

Vijay
You asked for classics and I will put up a cracker.Rather two.
Comes along with a Quiz.simple one though.

The two concerts has one artist playing different instruments in each.In the second one , he arrives in a breathtaking manner.
A True Genius.Identify him.

http://download.yousendit.com/86EF08AA79442486

http://download.yousendit.com/8247518C341DCFAC

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 11 Jan 2007, 18:29

I remember reading in kritimanimalai of RRI that this composer has composed several kRtis in kannaDa and telugu. I dont know what his reference was. It is not implausible as Adoyappayya came from Mysore after a family dispute. His descendants(family) were illustrious too- Seshanna, Subbanna et al.

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 11 Jan 2007, 22:34

A honey-dripping viribONi in Musiri's bhAva-laden voice.

http://www.rogepost.com/n/6285175316

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 11 Jan 2007, 22:38

After all these years(nearly 3 Centuries), "the varNa" is viribONi only. It holds its own and is a prototype and a paradigm for all varNas. There is no way a music student can NoT learn this varNa. It is like saying kOil withut any qualifiers and that would always be cidambaram/ tillai.

And the most famous of all tillAnas is the jhunjhUTi tillAna of vINe SEShaNNa- diranA tana dhImta. Is it just a coincidence that these master composers belong to the same lineage! One wonders.

ramakriya · Post by **ramakriya** » 11 Jan 2007, 22:41

Shrikaanth,

I did not know Sheshanna came from Adi Appayya lineage. please post a family tree if you have..

-Ramakriya

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 11 Jan 2007, 22:45

There is indeed another varNa of Adiyappayya known- madavati in rAmakriya/kAmavardhini. (Now I see Ramakriya has asked a question:)

Will fortune smile on us and let us have a rendering of this varNa? Anyone!

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 11 Jan 2007, 22:46

Another rendering by the latest SK- the ever imaginative TNS

http://www.rogepost.com/n/2186390410

Suji Ram · Post by **Suji Ram** » 11 Jan 2007, 23:06

drshrikaanth wrote:There is no way a music student can NoT learn this varNa. It is like saying kOil withut any qualifiers and that would always be cidambaram/ tillai.

I have to relearn this one.

meena · Post by **meena** » 12 Jan 2007, 00:53

Changed moi mind- DELETED!

meena · Post by **meena** » 12 Jan 2007, 02:42

There is indeed another varNa of Adiyappayya known- madavati in rAmakriya/kAmavardhini.

madavAti nI pai chAla.rAga: pantuvarALi. khaNDa aTa tALa.

P: madavAti nI pai chAla marulukonnAdirA
A:sadayUDow dakShiNa dvAraka chakkani shrI rAjagOpAla
(etugaDa pallavi):
dharalOna nIvE daya gala vAdani

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 12 Jan 2007, 02:58

Thanks meena. Can we have notation and if possible, a recording?

coolkarni · Post by **coolkarni** » 12 Jan 2007, 09:40

Doreswamy Iyengar
http://download.yousendit.com/01E9140A359E1BA7

vijay · Post by **vijay** » 12 Jan 2007, 11:20

Thanks for sharing, everyone. I second Doc's request for a recording/notation of the Kamavardhini Varnam.

Regarding Coolji's quiz - it has to be the one playing the mrudanga in the second one - absolutely fantastic. Who could it be...and which other instrument in the first one - I can't make out a Kanjira/Ghatam...a violinist/mrudangist? Improbable.... TVG was known to be a vocalist - did he play the violin as well? Or was he playing the drone? End the suspense please...A very fast paced Viribhoni for MDR!

Interesting to note the observation on D2/D1 in Bhairavi - is that really the case - was there a perceptible increase in usage of D2 by the trinity? I've heard that some people actually place Chetulara under Kharaharapriya Mela....be that as it may, I prefer the Viribhoni version any day. Maybe Doc and other experts could give us an overview of the important phrases and gamakas that bring out the raga bhava in Viribhoni - I myself never managed to grasp the "D1 P D2 N2 D1 N2 S' R2 S' phrase in the second swara passage...but it is quite beautiful to hear...

Vijay

coolkarni · Post by **coolkarni** » 12 Jan 2007, 11:43

Palghat Mani Iyer plays the Khanjira in the KVN track.His son Rajamani ,plays the Mridangam there.
you can hear others pulling him in...and then he makes his fine entry.

MDR track is with PMI on the Mridangam- as per my records.but I may be wrong there

vijay · Post by **vijay** » 12 Jan 2007, 11:59

Uhhh...so much for my guess! I did not hear the Kanjira in the second track as I was in a hurry to get the right answer. I will listen to it again...BTW, mrudangam in the KVN track was very good too....

ignoramus · Post by **ignoramus** » 12 Jan 2007, 12:04

coolji,, you are right on both counts. By the way just for your info, the great SRJ was absolutely happy over the 2 tracks, and the Kanjira entry.. He was saying, the cross rhythm appearing from the kanjira was marvellous. He was thanking you for giving him some great music. I too thank you once again.

vijay · Post by **vijay** » 12 Jan 2007, 12:16

Heard it now...I've heard about the Mrudangam "singing the song" but the Kanjira!

sr_iyer · Post by **sr_iyer** » 12 Jan 2007, 13:05

Coolkarniji:

The first clip is by MDR-LGJ-PMI (Mrdangam)
The second is KVN-LGJ-Rajamani (Mrdangam) â€“ PMI (Khanjira) â€“ I have come across this as listed from the England tour of 1965.

___
On Adiappayya, another composition that he is said to have given music to is the useni svarajati E manda. The SSP mentions that the sAhityam for this piece is said to have been composed by Merattur Venkatarama Sastri.
____

On the dhaivatam of bhairavi, the traditional view is that unless the dhaivatam acts as a bridge until the ShaDjam or higher, the lower degree of dhaivatam, d1 should be used. E.g. p d1 n d1 p and p d2 n s.

The Sangeeta Sampradaya Pradarshini (SSP) mentions that the â€œpancasâ€™ruti dhaivatamâ€

bala · Post by **bala** » 16 Feb 2007, 17:29

Can somebody explain how d1 and d2 is notated in the Viriboni varnam. This varnam is full of "d"s and is there any rule of thumb to say that a particular "d" should be d1 or d1?
thanks

vijay · Post by **vijay** » 16 Feb 2007, 17:59

It would be D2 in ascent and D1 in descent....in the first set of swarams there is one phrase which is D1PD2N2D2SN2SR2S - the third Dhaivatha it is difficult to tell whether it is in ascent or descent but it is D2....

arunk · Post by **arunk** » 16 Feb 2007, 20:45

to further clarify what vijay says: Basically D2 when ascending from da (to da doesnt mean anything), but D2 if descending from da (again to da doesnt mean anything). So d n e.g. as p d n would be D2, but p d p would be D1, n d p would be D1 etc etc.

This may seem like repating the obvious but before I knew more, at least i was confused about what exactly is meant by ascent/descent and thought why pa da wouldnt qualify as ascent and use D2

(or why d n d was allowed in kAmbhOji since arohana as p d s).

I may have been in the minority although i did know a few others who were similarly confused about interpreting arohana/avarona. All of us with no learning experience of course. This may seem silly to most people

Arun

mishram · Post by **mishram** » 16 Feb 2007, 22:22

I agree arunk.

"NND1-D1D1P-PM-ND1NPD1NMPD2NS*R*NS*..." phrase is the most beautiful demo of the usage of Dha1 in the Bhairavi varnam.

It brought back nostaligic memories when I read this post.

Sri. TM Thyagarajan once demonstrated the usage of dhaivatham in Bhairavi varnam. He had a few of us, his sishyas, demo it. The most common paatandharam uses dha2 in the aarohanam liberally - but as arunk pointed out - the rule is: if the prayogam extends to the Shatjam, the dhaivatham is dha2 - otherwise it is always dha1. Any prayogam that extends upto nishadham and wraps back without touching shatjam would use dha1.

Here is an example in the chittaiswaram: (shows how both nishadhams are used)
|mmpp d1d1nn ppp d2d2d2 nnn ssr|

arunk · Post by **arunk** » 16 Feb 2007, 23:09

mishram,

mishram wrote:"NND1-D1D1P-PM-ND1NPD1NMPD2NS*R*NS*..."

the rule is: if the prayogam extends to the Shatjam, the dhaivatham is dha2 - otherwise it is always dha1.

I guess I am still confused

In the bhaivari gItam does p d2 n2 n2 d1 p come? I thought p d n would employ d2 whether or not sa follows ni - like here.

Also I am confused why it is p d1 n m in the phrase above

Arun

sivapriya · Post by **sivapriya** » 16 Feb 2007, 23:43

Bhairavi has two dhaivata prayogams

In the ascending order, it is s g r m p d(2) n s, the descending order has s n d(1) p m g r s. However the old school view is that the D2 should not be sung as sharp and it is more of trisruti and not chatusruti dhaivatam.

Whilst in use, srgm can be permitted ocassionally only. After you land on the shadjam ( keezh shadjam), u can use m g r s, as in s m g r g. This prayogam comes in the 3rd swara of the varnam which is not sung by anybody else except by the Mudicondan school ( R Vedavalli and we, her students). There are in all four shitta swaas for the varnam asagainst three which are being sung popularly.

The 3rd which is not in vogue, is a swara passage, which starts at the lower octave as in (p d n s...) sung in the lower octave and winds with many unusual Bhairavi phrases, many unheard of slightly difficult to sing and remember. Maybe this could be one reason that it has become extinct.

One other interesting facet is that an anubandam is sung after the 4th swara, which is a long passage of sahitya which goes and joins Sri Rajagopala in the anupallavi. Again it is only sung by R V's school. Reference for this is available in SSP.

sivapriya · Post by **sivapriya** » 16 Feb 2007, 23:45

Errata ! Pls readonly s m g r g in the para 3 not s m g r s.Sorry about the typo erro

mishram · Post by **mishram** » 17 Feb 2007, 05:58

>>In the bhaivari gItam does p d2 n2 n2 d1 p come? I thought p d n would employ d2 whether or not sa follows ni - like here. <<

arunk - technically, it should be p d1 n n d1 pa. It would have been p d2 n n S only if the prayogam extended to Mel Shatjam.

>>Also I am confused why it is p d1 n m in the phrase above<<

Again, this winds down and does not touch the shatjam and hence d1 is used.

arunk · Post by **arunk** » 17 Feb 2007, 11:20

mishram,

there must be different interpretations. I was taught as p D2 n n d1 only for the gItam. I also see the same at http://www.ecse.rpi.edu/Homepages/shivk ... eetham.htm, and so others follow the same interpretation too. I havent learned the varnam (not there yet

).

Arun

arunk · Post by **arunk** » 17 Feb 2007, 11:24

i do see a reference in another thread http://rasikas.org/forums/viewtopic.php?pid=32739 (last post on that page) that the traditional interpretation conforms to what you are saying i.e. D2 when reaching mel-sa.

Arun

mishram · Post by **mishram** » 17 Feb 2007, 12:21

arunk - there are different interpretations - and as we all know, it depends on your school of thought!

bala · Post by **bala** » 19 Feb 2007, 17:41

My sincere thanks to everyone to help me out. I am trying to understand the concept as expressed by different members.
Thanks

svkashyap · Post by **svkashyap** » 22 Feb 2007, 13:56

Shivapriya please post the notation of the 3rd chitte swara of viriboni varnam

bala · Post by **bala** » 07 Apr 2007, 11:36

I would be grateful if someone gives Virboni varnams 2nd chittisvaras(after chiru novvu mo....).

The first is "MP G,,-R S-n, D,P...."

The third one is "S,RG SRG, R,,,, N,SR,,,,,,"

I want the second one which is not in the Panchapakesar iyer book. MS sings as |DNND DnDDm,,,,,|
Thanks

laxmiv · Post by **laxmiv** » 07 Apr 2007, 20:02

Bala,

here is the 2nd charanam of the varnam.

D, ||NNDD | , NDD | M; N | D PM , | , DPM |
GR , G | , MPD | MP, D | PDN D | NS*R*S* |
NG*R* N | , DPD | MP, M | GRSR || N#D#,N# | SGRG | ( Chi)

I couldn't figure out how to indicate the upper and lower sthayi notes.

Laxmi

bala · Post by **bala** » 08 Apr 2007, 15:28

Laxmi,
Thanks. I can manage the upper & lower sthayi by relating to MS song.
Bala

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 08 Apr 2007, 15:54

Laxmi, Bala,
I have made some corrections (swara lengths), indicated the tALa break up per beat and also the tAra and mandra sthAyi in Laxmi's post itself. Trust thats ok

prashant · Post by **prashant** » 09 Apr 2007, 10:50

There is yet another swara passage for this varNam which very few musicians sing. It's available in the SSP.

kaumaaram · Post by **kaumaaram** » 09 Apr 2007, 15:54

prashant wrote:There is yet another swara passage for this varNam which very few musicians sing. It's available in the SSP.

What is SSP please?

Is it
pa da ni sa ri ga ma ga ri sa ni da pa ma
ga ri sa ni da pa ma pa da ni sa ri ga ma
ni sa ri ga ma ni da ma ga ga .....

(vaguely remember this... but I am not good in writing notations anyway)

gravikiran · Post by **gravikiran** » 09 Apr 2007, 16:15

bala,
my version of the varnam book by panchapakesa iyer does notate the second ethugada swara passage beginning from "da ni ni da da".
ofcourse the Sangeetha Sampradaya Pradarshini (SSP) mentions an additional passage and infact gives two versions to that - one for novices and the other for experts!!!

ravi2006 · Post by **ravi2006** » 09 Apr 2007, 19:01

gravikiran wrote:Sangeetha Sampradaya Pradarshini (SSP) mentions an additional passage and infact gives two versions to that - one for novices and the other for experts!!!

Dear GRavikiran,

This sounds intriguing; do you have the notation for this passage in its 2 versions?

Ravi

Ashwin · Post by **Ashwin** » 09 Apr 2007, 20:24

gravikiran wrote:bala,
my version of the varnam book by panchapakesa iyer does notate the second ethugada swara passage beginning from "da ni ni da da".
ofcourse the Sangeetha Sampradaya Pradarshini (SSP) mentions an additional passage and infact gives two versions to that - one for novices and the other for experts!!!

Is this perhaps the anubandha sAhitya that follows "cirunavvumOmuna"?

Ashwin

rbharath · Post by **rbharath** » 09 Apr 2007, 23:07

Ashwin wrote:
gravikiran wrote:bala,
my version of the varnam book by panchapakesa iyer does notate the second ethugada swara passage beginning from "da ni ni da da".
ofcourse the Sangeetha Sampradaya Pradarshini (SSP) mentions an additional passage and infact gives two versions to that - one for novices and the other for experts!!!
Is this perhaps the anubandha sAhitya that follows "cirunavvumOmuna"?

Ashwin

no! this is the third of 4 eTTugada svarams metioned in the Pradarshini. The Anubanda sAhitya is after the 4th (actually, but the one sung as 3rd these days) eTTugada svaram.

rbharath · Post by **rbharath** » 09 Apr 2007, 23:09

bala wrote:I would be grateful if someone gives Virboni varnams 2nd chittisvaras(after chiru novvu mo....).

The first is "MP G,,-R S-n, D,P...."

The third one is "S,RG SRG, R,,,, N,SR,,,,,,"

I want the second one which is not in the Panchapakesar iyer book. MS sings as |DNND DnDDm,,,,,|
Thanks

this second one 'D NNDDnDDM' is indeed present in the Panchapakesa iyer book. Only the third one which begins as 'p d n s' doesnt exist in his book.

Ashwin · Post by **Ashwin** » 10 Apr 2007, 20:41

Oh ok I see - I think there is a similar situation with vanajAkShi ninnEkOri, the kalyANi aTa tALa varNam...I have learned an additional eTTugada svaram (as the third svara) which is in the SSP: NDD,MGRR,MGRND...

Ashwin

jayaram · Post by **jayaram** » 06 May 2007, 23:13

http://www.hindu.com/thehindu/fr/2006/0 ... 760500.htm

On `Viriboni' varnam

This is with reference to the review of a recital by Mohan Santhanam, `Gets the right perspective,' in these columns on June 9. The writer, Lalithaa Krishnan had mentioned that Mohan sang the Ata tala varnam `Viriboni' in Bhairavi. A reference was made to an additional third swaram in the charanam that he sang attributing it to Sangita Kalanidhi Mudicondan Venkatarama Iyer.

I wish to clarify certain facts here. The Telugu text of Subbarama Dikshitar's ``Sangita Sampradaya Pradarshini" was translated into Tamil by Dr. S. Ramanathan under the guidance and supervision of my guru Mudicondan Sri Venkata Rama Iyer and T.L Venkata Rama Iyer. This was brought out by the Music Academy in 1968. The Bhairavi Varnam is given in the book with four swarams in the charanam and an anubandham. I have learnt it that way from my guru, not because he composed the additional swaram but because that is the way it is given in the original Telugu ``Sangita Sampradaya Pradarshini" published in 1904. I have a copy of the book in Telugu for reference.

A lot of musicians today sing the varnam with only three swarams in the charanam and hence the confusion. It is important that the facts are brought to the attention of the readers and the record made straight. The swaram was not a later creation of Mudicondan Venkatarama Iyer but was part of the original composition by the legendary Pachimiryam Adiyappayya.

R. Vedavalli (Musician),
Chennai.

I would be interested in understanding a bit more on this topic. Learned readers' comments welcome.

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 06 May 2007, 23:16

Jayaram
There is nothing more to be added to Vid|Vedavalli's words. She has said it all.

jayaram · Post by **jayaram** » 07 May 2007, 04:15

My query was more about why today's musicians sing just the 3 swarams as Smt Vedavalli states. I would have thought the version available today would be the same for everyone, if it comes from SSP.

mohan · Post by **mohan** » 07 May 2007, 05:11

Most of the popular varnam books list (like the ones by Panchapakesa Iyer and TK Govinda Rao) only the 3 swarams. I think there is some explanation about this in Lalitha Ramakrishnan's book, "the Varnam" but I don't have access to that right now.