What is the technical word

vasanthakokilam · Post by **vasanthakokilam** » 11 Dec 2007, 08:51

I have been using the word 'Melisma' to refer to the singing with improvised florish at the end of the Pallavi, Anupallavi etc. like musicians normally do for songs in Mukhari and other ragas. For example, in Elavathara after finishing the pallavi, they normally sing 'Ee....' then a lot of Akaram taking through the brilliant contours of Mukhari, more or less to the beat but not necessarily strictly so.

I found out recently that Cadenza is a more appropriate English term for it. The dictionary meaning as applied to Western music is: 1. a parenthetical flourish in an aria or other solo piece commonly just before a final or other important cadence
2 : a technically brilliant sometimes improvised solo passage toward the close of a concerto

What is the CM terminology for this?

uday_shankar · Post by **uday_shankar** » 11 Dec 2007, 09:32

Neither term is appropriate methinks

.

I think the original meaning of melisma, as in Gregorian chants, where they intone singsong syllables has been lost in the pop context...I just read on the internet about melisma in pop music, american idol, etc.. I have no idea what that means. Tibetan chants also have that sing song syllable variations..may be called melisma.

I DO however know what a candenza is and it is way too inappropraite a term to describe the small flourishes at the end of the anupallavi. Although cadenzas are supposed to be "improvised" per the dictionary definition, in reality they are technically difficult and fairly elaborate appendages to main pieces (say the violin concerto by Beethoven), often lasting several minutes, composed by distinguished maestros over time and played by other maestros. The closest analogs in Carnatic music that I can think of are a) if several rounds of neraval were to be "composed" and permanently set in place by some great artiste (say like KVN) and repeated verbatim by others b) several rounds of chittaswaram added to a great composition by somebody other than the composer, say a distinguished vidvan. Neither analog captures the meaning of cadenza completely.

Dictionary meanings are woefully inadequate to describe a whole class of musical experience. The small flourish at the end of a pallavi or anupallavi, lasting perhaps an avardhanam of the talam, is best described as...a flourish!

vasanthakokilam · Post by **vasanthakokilam** » 11 Dec 2007, 23:14

Uday, Thanks for your comments. Very useful.

I am more interested in knowing if there is a word ( Sanskrit, SI Languages ) for that CM florish?

Regarding Cadenza, the dictionary gives three meanings:

1 : a parenthetical flourish in an aria or other solo piece commonly just before a final or other important cadence
2 : a technically brilliant sometimes improvised solo passage toward the close of a concerto
3 : an exceptionally brilliant part of an artistic and especially a literary work

I guess you are saying that number 2 is more the common meaning in Western Classical. That is right. But the first one 'parenthetical flourish....before a cadence' seems to match the subject of discussion. Again, I am with you, I do not think any one will relate to it if I start using 'Cadenza' to refer to the CM flousih.

Melisma was my own forced usage as it is used in Western Pop and R&B. It's what the pop and R&B singers do when they hit a phrase that ends in a vowel. The "ooo" sound in "you" becomes a sequence of up and down notes (also called "runs" ) which can go on for quite a few measures. Mariah Carey of the early 1990s comes to mind, among countless others. As you wrote, here the dictionary meaning is not of much help.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Melisma has some current and related information: ".....Melisma is also commonly featured in Western popular music, although this form of melisma usually involves improvising melismas (and melismatic vocalise) over a simpler melody, and is utilized by countless pop artists. The use of melisma is common in Indian classical and popular music......"

Anyway, I am curious about what Indian word to use for that CM Flourish.... Thanks.

gn.sn42 · Post by **gn.sn42** » 12 Dec 2007, 00:10

"cadenza" is technically correct.

However -

while referring to a short solo flourish at the end of a movement as a "cadenza" is correct, the word "cadenza" is strongly associated with a (usually composed) piece for solo artists.

A historical perspective may help. (In the interest of clarity, I'll make some simplistic statements here - I lack the knowledge to make it more nuanced.)

- musicians would frequently provide improvised flourishes at the end of movements - these were called cadenzas (this is the sense you want)
- as time went on, composers began to provide specific points in their compositions for improvised cadenzas (this limited the performer, but gave the composer more control over the shape of the work)
- due to the evolving nature of western classical music concert format - possibly involving predetermined playlists, rehearsals, timing of events, and so on - soloists began writing down their "improvisations" and performing them - these were still called cadenzas
- other soloists began performing the cadenzas popularized by previous greats
- the composers got into the act and began composing their own cadenzas!

So if you want to use "cadenza" to mean improvised flourish at the end of a movement, you'll have to say something like "cadenza in the original sense of the word" or something like that.

"melisma" is simply using multiple notes to sing one syllable. This is so prevalent in CM ("O Rangasayee" comes to mind) that you cannot use the term simply for the ending bit.

mohan · Post by **mohan** » 12 Dec 2007, 06:37

What is the word in thamizh?

arasi · Post by **arasi** » 12 Dec 2007, 10:42

Does muttAippu cover it? I do not find the word in my dictionary.

vasanthakokilam · Post by **vasanthakokilam** » 13 Dec 2007, 12:59

mutAippu captures the fact that it happens at the end of 'something' but the word seems to be used in another context, like in this article.

http://www.hinduonnet.com/thehindu/fr/2 ... 230400.htm

"......Anuragamule" in Saraswathi was played in a pleasant style, with a brief spell of kalpanaswaras, which included an interesting passage of `Kuraippu and Mutthaippu.'......."

What is mutthaippu in this context? Is it the one played for a few avarthanams after the Kuraippu reduces to one ( or zero? ).

sindhu · Post by **sindhu** » 13 Dec 2007, 13:17

Like Beginning is called 'eDuppu', this may be called 'muDippu' (not any paNa muDippu or so)

Mahalakshmi · Post by **Mahalakshmi** » 22 May 2008, 08:29

Is that not called a 'kaarvai'?

rshankar · Post by **rshankar** » 22 May 2008, 20:01

Isn't kArvai the silent pause in the tALa cycle? In bharatanATyam, if I understand, it is the pause that there is no step for - for instance, a jati in miSram within a composition set to Adi tAla will have a pause in each cycle - isn't that the kArvai?

http://korvai.org/notation/notation-htm ... tab:karvai

arunk · Post by **arunk** » 22 May 2008, 22:37

I think kArvai means a long elongated note - typically spanning few aksharas - may be half to full tala cycle. It is possible it also is intended to apply pauses as those that come after the arudhi of the pallavi - i am not sure. Usually for effect, the rhythm part may be "silent" - but then again it can be the other end to build a crescendo too

But when singing "kArvai koDukkiradu" (to give kArvai in tamil) means to "stand" on a note/swara and so the term applies within the context of a swara.

Arun

rshankar · Post by **rshankar** » 22 May 2008, 23:29

Arun,

So, kArvai is holding then? If so, then, it will have the same implication in dance, i.e., 'hold' without moving - could also be interpretted as 'silent' because there is no movement.

BTW, jatis in tiSram, miSram and sankIrNam within the framework of the 8 beat Adi tALa cycle are very beautiful....

arunk · Post by **arunk** » 23 May 2008, 02:42

yes - it means holding a swara. Ironically, I actually wanted to use that term in my last post but thought it may not convey the meaning

In cm, from what I have observed, it seems common for the kArvai to be given at the end of the first half of anupallavi as many compositions seem to typically reach up to tara shadjam at this point. That tara shadjam then provides a natural point. But here typically the mridangam "takes off" to accentuate the point rather than say to remain silent.

Although I dont understand the fundamentals (yet), I have indeed heard that Adi tala provides the maximum flexibility in terms of mixing up the jatis. (or maybe easiest way to achieve maximum flexibility)

Arun

sramaswamy · Post by **sramaswamy** » 23 May 2008, 02:59

Karvai,I think, is that the note goes for a relatively longer duration than the notes that were sung till then. And if kArvai means same as kOrvai then it will mean the note is for a longer duration, not necessary that you have to hold it. It can be also sung and there is a pause for rest of the duration. Note the following swaram pattern

srgp rgpd gpds
s; rgp r:gpd g:pds
sr:gp rg:pd gpd:s
srg:p rgp:d gpd:s

Take the first s; in the second line. You can either hold it for the duration of 4 aksharas or sing it for one akshara and give a pause for the next three aksharas. The mridangam ends in a kOrvai.

Disclaimer: I am absolute layman. My interpretation is to be taken with some caution and further vetting by someone. If properly validated, we should probably post in a glossary section.

rshankar · Post by **rshankar** » 23 May 2008, 04:39

arunk wrote:Although I dont understand the fundamentals (yet), I have indeed heard that Adi tala provides the maximum flexibility in terms of mixing up the jatis. (or maybe easiest way to achieve maximum flexibility)

Arun

I am not sure I get it either, but in this example, I think there are two kArvais - one in the laghu and one at the end of second dhritam, because the SolkaTTu is tai tai tAm; tai tai tai; in an Adi tAla format:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rk2GRy6rw3I

I think this is an example of a miSram type....

arunk · Post by **arunk** » 23 May 2008, 05:49

How/why would be miSram type? I thought maybe for miSram the patterns would in multiple's of 7 (and pauses) - so say 8*4 = 32, is divvyed up say as 7*4 interspersed with 4 pauses. But again - no idea

Here it is basically short short long type where long = 2*short in duration

Arun

rshankar · Post by **rshankar** » 23 May 2008, 05:54

Sorry - tiSram....goof up on my part.

arunk · Post by **arunk** » 23 May 2008, 05:57

Isnt allaripu (or pushpanjali?) usually have different varieties? We can also look at that to see how it is supposed to be.

vasanthakokilam · Post by **vasanthakokilam** » 23 May 2008, 08:01

sramaswamy: kArvai and kOrvai are not the same, though kArvai can be used for good effect in consturcting a Korvai. For an excellent practical introduction and elaboration, see our own Balaji's explanation here: http://www.rasikas.org/forums/viewtopic.php?id=2359 starting from post #5.

What you are probably referring to is the theermanam that the mridangist plays at the end of a section in triplets as the vocalist is holding a note. ( In dance, theermanam may have a very specific but related meaning as well as in 'theermanam for a varnam' ). Putting this all together, one can say kArvais can be found in Korvais and Theermanams.

There are two uses of the word 'kArvai'. In singing, kArvai is used to denote holding the note as Arun said.

In the thala ( and probably dance as well ) terminology, it is used to refer to pauses. It does not strictly mean silence since the nadham of the previous beat is still there but a kArvai is not explictly provided a beat on the drum. With that understanding, let us call them silence beats. In the above referred link, post #5 by Balaji, he has provided a table for constructing a Korvai of different counts using a combination of sounded sollus ( kanakkus as Balaji calls it ) plus karvais.

Say, you want 33 counts for the purvAnga of a Korvai. Look up the table for 33. There are 10 coordinates possible providing for various combinations of Sounded beats(kanakku) and silence beats ( karvai). Consider (6,5). This represents 6 sounded sollus and 5 silences. Since korvais involve repeating 3 times you get ( 6+5)*3 = 33. Consider (5,6). This represents 5 sounded sollus and 6 silences, again totaling to 33 upon repeating threice. Consider (7.4) consisting of 7 sollus and 4 silences again getting us to 33.

Ravi, is this what you mean by Tisram, Khandam and misram type jathis. (3,8) and (6.5) would be tisram, (5,6) would be khandam, (7,4) would be misram etc.? ( for a count of 33 )

Arun, I do not know why Adi is considered the most flexible. Balaji's table is independent of thala. The table is constructed at the sub-beat level and the beat boundary is not of much significance in the dynamics of the korvai. For example, let us consider a thala whose sub-beat count is 72. One can split that into 39+33 for Purvanga and Uttaranga and construct a korvai with many possibilities. One such possibility would be (5,8) for 39 and (7,4) for 33. And these two numbers 33 and 39 provide for all combinations involing, 3,4,5,7 and 9 sounded sollus.