Jayachamaraja Odeyar (Mysore Maharajah) - Part II

coolkarni · Post by **coolkarni** » 18 Oct 2005, 16:48

http://rapidshare.de/files/6430031/bmk- ... t.mp3.html

http://rapidshare.de/files/6432474/SALA ... N.mp3.html

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 18 Oct 2005, 20:41

Brilliant Magnificent Kudos

This is easily the best Kalyani ever by a Kalanidhi. During the aalapana he covers the gamut of the raga in all the three ranges effortlessly. His voice is the 'MuraLi'. And he builds the taaLa on the praaNa ' G MPDN' of KalyaaNi and very aptly calls it the pancamukhi!

great choice! Congrats coolkarni!!

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 20 Oct 2005, 00:20

Hey. I am rather disappointed with the responses (or lack of it). :roll CML- congrats on being the sole respondent and thanks.

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 20 Oct 2005, 00:27

My dear mother has helped me decipher the lyrics that were inscrutable to me

. Here we go-

||vindhyAcalanivAsini||

rAga- harikAmbOdhi, khaNDa tripuTa tALa (2 kaLe)

vindhyAcalanivAsini pAhi mAm |
vINApustaka dhAriNi jaganmOhini ||P||

vidyuddAma sama prabhASAlini|
vidvanmaNi pOShiNi SrIvidyA vihAriNi ||
vEdOkta sakala mantrAbhimAnini nAdabrahmOpAsita paripAlini ||AP||

praLayakAlAgni svarUpiNi pAhi (?vANi) |
paramESvara santOShiNi phaNivENi |
kalimalApahAriNi kAmitadAyini
kalyANa guNaSAlini kAtyAyani ||
hIramaNimayAbharaNE bhaktAntahkaraNE harikAmbOdhi rAgAbharaNE ||

rshankar · Post by **rshankar** » 20 Oct 2005, 00:49

DRS,
When we did not weigh in, it was not lack of interest, but the fact that only fools would rush in where 'angels' (you and CML) had feared to tread!
Considering that I gloat when I figure out 'panchabANAri prANa priya saKI', I am most certainly not in your league!
I am glad that your mother was able to help you/us out! It appears that Wodeyar is once again equating 'kalaimagaL' and 'malaimagaL' in this composition!
Ravi

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 20 Oct 2005, 01:25

DRS
Blame it on the Fire! And don't be hard. I was afraid of a floodgate of materials on kalyaNi but you wanted only the rare pieces. coolkarni has justified with the sterling performance of BMK. I am still trying to decipher the 'wah wah's' on his yaman

You should have added more materials on kalyani such as Venkata mahi not giving it too much importance and that it was not very popular in ancient times. When did it attain the importance that it has now? I would have loved to hear some comments on why C Major is more important than G Major

Again though you may not agree I think the kalyani lyric is comparable in majesty to MD's kamalaambaam bhaja re. Why didn't it get more popular? (My wife who currently learned MD just complained that she would rather have learned Wodeyar for the navaratri season! She claims that the lyric is more smooth and easy flowing. The madhyama sahityam is indeed 'karnaranjana and karnaanandakara kalyaaNI' (nice mOnai)

Of course I did not want to prolong any discussion on Sanskrit not to leave out our audience. I expected some queries on mUka kavi, but none did, though MD has devoted some kritis to his exploits

We should move on....

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 20 Oct 2005, 01:29

Meaning of ||vindhyAcalanivAsini||

rAga- harikAmbOdhi, khaNDa tripuTa tALa (2 kaLe)

vindhyAcalanivAsini- You Who reside in the vindhyA mountain; pAhi mAm- Protect me;
vINApustaka dhAriNi- You Who hold the vINe and book in your hand;
jaganmOhini- Enchantress of the whole world;

praLayakAlAgni svarUpiNi- You Who is in the form of the all-consuming fire at the time of praLaya(destruction of the universe); pAhi (?vANi);
paramESvara santOShiNi- You Who please Siva; phaNivENi- You With braids that are like a snake;
kali mala apahAriNi- You Who erase all sins and its sequelae;
kAmitadAyini- Granter of all desired objects;
kalyANa guNaSAlini- The abode of all good, auspicious and exemplary attributes; kAtyAyani;
hIra maNi maya AbharaNE- You Who is adorned by various gem-studded jewels;
bhakta antahkaraNE- You Who is the soul/conscience of devotees (Or Who has compassion for devotees);
harikAmbOdhi rAgAbharaNE- You Who is bejewelled with the harikAMbOdhi rAga (or Who fulfills the rAga).

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 20 Oct 2005, 01:46

Ravi
I was getting frustrated because of being stymied by that one line. And I was hoping someone would come up with ideas by listening to the sound of lyrics. Sorry if I have hurt you/anyone.

CML
Much as you will find beauty and loftiness in oDeyar kRtis, they will lose out to MD`s kRtis when it comes to prosody. No competition there!
I did not write too much about kalyANi`s history as the emphasis in the thread is on oDeyar. The thread would never close if I started writing about all that comes to my mind

Anyway, you are right! kalyANi was considered an untouchable during the times of venkaTamakhi (at least by him). It is a dESIya rAga and may have been a fairly new entry to our music at taht time. He says it is popular among the masses but not fit to render weighty compositions. He also makes a snotty comment that it is dear to the lay public(pAMara) and the turks/muslims(turuShka). But it is clear from his own words that even then, it was popular. Even today, the very popularity and excessive use of kalyANi makes it sound unwelcome to some ears(Certainly not mine). It is also an easy rAga tohandle and is often the choice of freshly upcoming artistes.
As for C Major being popular than G Major, pratimadhyama as a note is a alte entry. Suddhamadhyama is one of the primary notes and is part of the prototypal consonat pair(vAdi-samvAdi S-M). It is only natural that rAgas with M1 are more popular. M2 is never a plain note and is more difficult to handle. It will sound harsh if rendered plain.

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 20 Oct 2005, 01:54

DRS
The madhyama sahityam is indeed 'karnaranjana and karnaanandakara kalyaaNI' (nice mOnai)

Of course I did not want to prolong any discussion on Sanskrit not to leave out our audience. I expected some queries on mUka kavi, but none did, though MD has devoted some kritis to his exploits

We should move on....

You hit the nail on the head CML. oDeyar`s kRtis are full of yati/mOnai or alliteration/assonance but very inconsistent in prAsa.
Do post details about mUkakavi. It will be an interesting and informative anecdote.

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 20 Oct 2005, 01:59

Thanks. I wanted to get that 'turuShka' from you

Was that the reason HM folks did't shy from it ? Perhaps kartik can comment (is Yaman more popular than bilaaval?)

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 20 Oct 2005, 02:04

DRS
Thyagaraja is copared to 'shakkara' and MD to cocoanut! (you know the metaphor).What would you compare odeyar to?

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 20 Oct 2005, 02:20

DRS
Thyagaraja is copared to 'shakkara' and MD to cocoanut! (you know the metaphor).What would you compare odeyar to?

tyAgarAja`s compositions are said to be drAkShA (grapes) pAka, SyAmASAstri`s kadaLI(banana) pAka and MD`s nArikELa(coconut) pAka reflecting the ease with which they can be understood and savoured. By the way it is said that nALikEra is the original word for coconut in sanskrit and nArikELa is a later variation. Can you briefly comment on this CML?
Can we say oDeyar`s style is like a walnut? :wink. Saying it in dEsi style, it is like cakkOtane haNNu- a citrus fruit. I shall leave the interpretation for others. Lets not waste time on this bit.

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 20 Oct 2005, 02:39

mUka kavi

His original name is not known. But he was born deaf and dumb. But he was a great devotee of Goddess kaamaakShi. By her grace he gained hearing and speech and great erudition. (more like 'vidyaapathi' in the popular movie Sarasvathi shapatham'). He became the 20th shankaracharya of the kaanchi maThaM (the present one vijayendra is the 70th). He died around 437 AD. There are references to him in MD's kriti EkAmranAthEshvarENa
as 'mUka mukhyavAkpradanipuNEna '

His composition 'mUka pancashati' (500 shlOkas) is well known

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 20 Oct 2005, 03:03

DRS
since cocoanut is not native to India (It came from Africa) no point discussing the etymology

I would compare OdeyAr to 'dhurian' fruit

srkris · Post by **srkris** » 20 Oct 2005, 04:49

CML, that's interesting information on mUka kavi.

According to the records maintained by Sringeri pItam, Dwaraka pItam and Puri pItam, Adi Shankara's lifetime is recorded as 788 - 820 A.D. Only the Kanchi pItham states his lifetime as 477 - 445 BC

That being the case, how could the records of 3 of the original 4 matams be wrong, and only that of the Kanchi matam be considered correct (that too when the authenticity of the Kamakoti matam's founding by Adi Shankara is questioned by some people)?

If the records of the Kanchi matam are wrong, that raises an important question about the lifetime and existence of mUka kavi, does it not?

If we take the Kanchi matam's records as correct, what happened to the Shankaracharyas of the other 4 matams prior to 788AD

Anyways, I am not sure, so forgive any unintentional errors. :8

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 20 Oct 2005, 05:21

chembai

it is very difficult to resolve these controversies. Some of these questions will crtainly be asked during the trial of JS since there are records that Kanchi maTham was moved from kumbakONam 150 years ago. But mUka pancashati is extant though we do not know the time period.

Just look at the following link for an interesting Chembai connection
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Bharath-H ... essage/191

(Chembai did not lose his voice at Suchindrum in Jan 7 1952 since I was there in the audience for that concert as he had already lost his voice then!)

coolkarni · Post by **coolkarni** » 20 Oct 2005, 07:38

Harikambhodi

This raga -I have always found mesmerising in a flute recital.especially after the halfway mark, gets into a such a blissful state, I can feel the whole auditorium swinging from side to side.I cannot explain it though.

Here is a rare vocal recital by ramnad krishnan accompanied by t viswanathan
http://rapidshare.de/files/6505271/ramn ... a.mp3.html

and another rendering by viswanathan at academy
http://rapidshare.de/files/6484097/Avat ... i.mp3.html

still searching for a MLV RTP in harikhamboji.will put it up.

srkris · Post by **srkris** » 20 Oct 2005, 16:16

Chembai did not lose his voice at Suchindrum in Jan 7 1952 since I was there in the audience for that concert as he had already lost his voice then!

Sorry for the digression again, but this is interesting. Do you mean to say that he lost his voice on some day before the Suchindram concert? You had elsewhere mentioned that you were there when he lost his voice mid-concert.

The Mysore connection:

Chembai seems to have grown in popularity with the Mysore Royalty. I have heard Chembai was honoured at Mysore by the Maharaja sometime in the 1930s and had been offered the post of Asthana Vidwan of Mysore Royal Court, but that he refused on certain grounds. Also some records indicate that the Mysore Palace contains a framed photo of Muthiah Bhagavatar doing royal honours to Chembai at the aforesaid time. Could someone confirm?

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 20 Oct 2005, 21:41

Yes chembai:

I was a witness of the events at Suchindrum! Chembai came in spite of his indisposition since he already had the voice problem (not that it developed during the concert as the story claims!). It was his sishya (I forget the name) who led the concert. But it was a mammoth crowd who insisted that Chembai should sing. He tried valiantly to oblige but it was pathetic see him struggle. I guess the Guruvaayurappan episode took place shortly after.

it is news to me to learn that sENgaalipuram had leprosy and got cured by the grace of Guruvaayoorappan.

Incidentally as someone e-mailed me, for the records I want to state that the famous 'mookambika' temple has no connection with mUka kavi. Amba is called mookaambikai since she killed mookaasura..

I am equally eager to hear about Chembai connections with Mysore...

coolkarni · Post by **coolkarni** » 20 Oct 2005, 22:06

the final set of tracks on harikAmbOdhi

http://rapidshare.de/files/6525385/somu ... a.mp3.html

http://rapidshare.de/files/6525668/vr_k ... I.mp3.html

http://rapidshare.de/files/6526683/pudo ... a.mp3.html

Raja Chandra · Post by **Raja Chandra** » 20 Oct 2005, 22:31

chembai, CML

i do not know where i got this small note, but i had stored it in my PC long ago!

A Matter Of Priorities [1937]

It was the tradition of the Mysore court to honour prominent artists by inviting them to give performances in the royal presence and to accept the title of asthana vidwan. In 1937 Maharaja Krishnarajendra Wodeyar extended an invitation to Chembai Vaidyanatha Bhagavatar to perform. Chembai accepted the invitation and gave a performance which was hailed as excellent by the king as well as by his courtiers. Next day Wodeyar presented the vidwan with a ponnadai (shawl) and other tokens of appreciation. Leading court musician Muthiah Bhagavatar also honoured Chembai and a photograph showing the two bhagavatars together is still on display at the Mysore palace.

The maharaja then expressed his wish to have Chembai enlisted as an asthana vidwan. Chembai was pleased to learn this but responded by saying that he would not be able to discharge the obligations of a court musician which would require his attendance at the court frequently and especially during Dussera. The vidwan was already committed, since many years before, to perform Navaratri pooja privately at home and therefore he was not available for any public engagements during that holiday period. His sense of priorities was such that he did not wish to break this commitment. Accordingly he explained his inability to accept the royal invitation to serve as the asthana vidwan of the Mysore court.

Far from being upset, the maharaja appreciated Chembai's sense of priorities. The courtiers too were struck by the character of Vaidyanatha Bhagavatar.

In subsequent years, Chembai gave performances at the court several times at the invitation of the maharaja.

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 20 Oct 2005, 23:14

RC
Thanks for that historical snippet!
HMB of course was senior to Chembai. Was he already at the Royal court by that time. I have heard the stories of how HMB got the grace of Mysore Royalty (and the famous 'Maanamu kaavalanE (sahaana) episode). Could you set the records straight?

Chembai
Has Chembai rendered any of HMB/Odeyaar compositions?

coolkarni
That harikambodhi of Somu just blew me off!!!

srkris · Post by **srkris** » 21 Oct 2005, 01:13

DRS,

Venkmal's request removed to a separate thread

Raja Chandra,

Thanks, this is from Chembai Selvam, a biography of Chembai written in 1954 by L.R.Viswanathan ("Ellarvi"), see images below

CML,

None that I know. Chembai has not even sung Papanasam Sivan's compositions. :!

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 21 Oct 2005, 03:59

Chembai

Not readable! (even when magnified!)

meena · Post by **meena** » 21 Oct 2005, 04:06

cml
Try increasing the 'text size' - under browser bar- view and select -text size.

abadri · Post by **abadri** » 21 Oct 2005, 05:31

CMLsir,

To go back to your Yaman vs Bilaval question - in my limited knowledge, yes Yaman is more popular.
In fact the main raga of the Bilaval thaat is Alhaiya Bilaval (which would scalically be equivalent to
Bilahari). [kind of similar situation with Kambhoji being the main raga of the Harikamhoji mela].

DRS or Kulkarni can comment further, but I don't think performances of Bilaval (scalically equivalent to
Shankarabharanam) are all that common.

question - does Yaman's poplarity with performers have anything to do with it's being one of
the first ragas taught to students?

Edit: links to Rajan Parrikar's articles on Bilaval & Yaman
http://www.sawf.org/newedit/edit07102000/musicarts.asp
http://www.sawf.org/newedit/edit01142002/musicarts.asp

abadri · Post by **abadri** » 21 Oct 2005, 05:35

Kulkarni,

A pretty tangential request, but one that occured to me given that
we're talking about HM and also Harikambhoji (Khamaj thaat).

Are there any vocal renditions of Jhinjhoti that you could share
with us?

Many thanks in advance.

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 21 Oct 2005, 07:16

Thanks meena!
I was able to read and relish the comments of ASP Iyer. He reflects the prejudices of the geneation I grew up with

My assciations with a lot of freedom fighters and Babuji changed my views dramatically (though some of my folks considered that I was brain-washed

)

Badri

Thanks for the comment and clarification. My mind wandered around the turuShka connection and I recollected coolkarni's postings earlier as to howmuch HM was an integrating force in the country! Unfortunately CM did not capitalize in that venture :-&

DRS

If you are waiting, I would like you to explain how MD excels Odeyar lyrically (musical alphabet) though language and idea-wise they seem to be at par (according to me!). Perhaps you can give some comparative examples! Thanks...

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 21 Oct 2005, 09:52

Here is the Harikambodhi RTP by DKP
http://rapidshare.de/files/6549801/11_R ... i.mp3.html

Coolkarni
Do post MLV RTP once you get to it.

coolkarni · Post by **coolkarni** » 21 Oct 2005, 21:58

badri

the only vocal rendering of jinjhoti with me is that of the Dhrupad Duo - Bhatt and Ginde.ThoughI would like to add the many renderings of chaurasia to the vocal List-he almost sings it with his flute....

http://rapidshare.de/files/6569339/Jinj ... _.mp3.html

I have been struggling to find similarities between Khamaj or Jinjhoti with harikhamboji but find it a lost cause.
I guess Harikhamboji has a spirit (Like DRS mentioned about atana) that can be captured only in CM.

Raja Chandra · Post by **Raja Chandra** » 21 Oct 2005, 22:11

Thanks Chembai,

But is it true that chembai and chowdiah appeared together in a kannada movie - vaani ?

CML,

To answer your questions on DR.HMB, it is necessary to undesrtand the genius of his patron Maharaja KRW IV a little more.

Maharaja Krishna Raja Wadiyar IV, was a rare gem to have emebellished the illustrious throne of Mysore. To read more about him kindly visit :
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Krishnaraja_Wodeyar_IV

Carnatic music is said to have reached its zenith under Krishnaraja Wadiyar IV. His period is called the golden age of Carnatic classical music. His father Maharaja Chamaraja Wadiyar was a violin virtuoso and was particularly fond of short pieces like "Lavanya Rama" and " Sujana jeevana" of saint Thyagaraja. Providing violin accompaniment to his classmate and court musician Veena Subbanna was his favourite past time.Thus Music flowed in Nalvadi's blood.

Nalvadi was an authority in all the three systems of music - carnatic, hindustani and Western Music. During his time Band stands were constructed in well known parks of Mysore and Bangalore and Music Bands - carnatic and western played regularly for public to enjoy. As he had a very poor voice he excelled in instrumental music. He was a accomplished player of eight instruments- veena, Flute, Violin, Mridanagam, Nagaswara, Sitar, Saxaphone, Harmoniam and Piano. In fact, he was instrumental in one Mr. Laksminarasimhiah to play carnatic music on saxaphone as part of the Palace Band. Kadri Gopalnath was influenced by him to become a virtuouso on saxphone. It is interesting to note that at http://www.carnatica.net/sangeet/saxophone1.htm, Kadri mentions that the Maharaja composed the kriti "Pranamamyaham" in raga Gowla, as opposed to some who believe that it is Mysore Vasudevachar's !!

Many illustrious members of the Agra Gharana including Nattan Khan and Ustad Vilayat Hussain Khan were guests of the Maharajah in Mysore. The legendary Abdul Karim Khan and Gauhar Jan were also his guests. Barkatullah Khan - one of India’s great sitar players was a palace musician from 1919 till his death in 1930.

It is difficult to find a well known Carnatic Musician of his time who did not visist the State during his benevolent rule and grace his asthan. But he was a hard critic to please. Veena Sheshanna, who was in fact his guru, has stated that he was afarid of paying before him as his knowledge was astounding and could find any fault immedaitely!

From this background it becomes relevant as how Dr.HMB's became Asthan Vidwan at Mysore !

Dr.H.M.B visited Mysore for Dasara celeberations in the year 1927. Though he was rewarded by the Maharaja , he was disappointed for not being appointed as Asthan Vidwan. Before returning, he visited Goddess Chamundeswari atop the Hill to offer his farewel prayers. Maharaja who was also offerring prayers at the same time .Dr.HMB is said to have sung his own compositions- " Tappulanni talukomma nadu" in bhouli and " manamu kavalenu talli" in shahana. Maharaja was highly pleased by his singing then and appointed him as Asthan Vidwan for a salary of Rs.100.00 per month. What followed is musical history.

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 21 Oct 2005, 23:53

Thanks RC for that historical insight.
It is indeed our good fortune and Goddess Chamundesvari's grace that the two met on that occasion. I had heard from one of my relatives in Harikesanallur that HMB was at his lowest ebb at that point in time due to physical and financial problems and that was the turning point in life. A diamond is just another glasspiece until it is cut and faceted bya jeweller and hence all the credit goes to HH. KRW !

DRS

I hope these distractions are not hurting you flow of thought...

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 22 Oct 2005, 00:07

Interesting to hear about the origin of praNamAmyaham. It has MV's mudra which I doubt woule have been affixed by him otherwise! I hope Lakshman would comment if he is reading this.....

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 22 Oct 2005, 00:23

coolkarni

Thanks for that jinjhoTi. It is sheer ecstasy! it desreves more 'wah wah's. Of course it is not harikambodhi. The loss is all the more for CM

meena · Post by **meena** » 22 Oct 2005, 07:10

RC
Ur writeup on shrI wodeyar (http://en.wikipedia.org/) is very informative. Thanku. Congrats

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 22 Oct 2005, 17:29

In hindUstAni the basic lessons are taught in bilAval (sarigama---) much like our mAyAmALavagauLa. Perhaps it is a cas of familiarity breeds contempt. The parallel in CM is obvious. Not too many poeple take up MMgauLa for elaboration.

knrh05 · Post by **knrh05** » 22 Oct 2005, 17:32

MLV - Kanyakumari - Srimushnam Raja Rao - Harishankar
Excerpts from Mylapore Fine Arts, Dec 31, 1983

-links deleted-

The recording quality is not very good (expecially in the pallavi track). This was a recording from AIR's live broadcast of the concert. I dated it as the tape incuded an AIR news bulletin (about a Nigerian coup).

Enjoy!

knrh05

Raja Chandra · Post by **Raja Chandra** » 23 Oct 2005, 06:13

meena,

thanks, but the site is not entirely mine. Just any one-even a unknown guest, can edit and even delete the information. So many have edited and added to the story ! once the entire site on JCRW was deleted by some unknown guest and i had do re do it. At times when ever i post some thing in this thread then i am adding it there too like the story on the curse.

harikesa · Post by **harikesa** » 23 Oct 2005, 21:44

Dr.H.M.B visited Mysore for Dasara celeberations in the year 1927. Though he was rewarded by the Maharaja , he was disappointed for not being appointed as Asthan Vidwan. Before returning, he visited Goddess Chamundeswari atop the Hill to offer his farewel prayers. Maharaja who was also offerring prayers at the same time .Dr.HMB is said to have sung his own compositions- " Tappulanni talukomma nadu" in bhouli and " manamu kavalenu talli" in shahana. Maharaja was highly pleased by his singing then and appointed him as Asthan Vidwan for a salary of Rs.100.00 per month. What followed is musical history

The important point to highlight here was that Dr.HMB,when he came into the palace in 1927,was stopped from entering as some of the Asthana vidwans took a hostile stance against him.But,he did put up with those insults and performed in the court of the maharaja.This was a very poor performance as he had severe cold and cough.He made no impression on the maharaja and was honoured as usual,on par with any visiting vidwan.

He went early in the morning before too many devotees came into the temple and sang 'Manamu Kavalaenu talli' and tappulanniyu in bowli.He realized that he must have visited the Divine Mother before coming to the palace and hence begged for forgivance in his bowli kriti,the meaning of which is obvious..The Maharaja who was on the morning visit heard Bhagavathar unseen and was so impressed by it that he gave directions fixing up his recital again. At the next recital he got into form and his performance was superb. And then there was no looking back for him.And as RC says,What followed is musical history

Raja Chandra · Post by **Raja Chandra** » 23 Oct 2005, 22:34

harikesa

welcome aboard,

impressive debut. Get cracking !

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 23 Oct 2005, 23:06

Shall we keep the discussion to oDeyar? I think it is a good idea to start another thread on HMB. IIRC a thread had been started before the old site crashed. Let us not lose track of oDeyar here.

CML
Here is the link to the thread on sangeetham. com where I penned a few posts on prosody in musical compositions. It will be clear from what I have written. what I meant when MD wins hands down when it comes to prAsa and yati.

http://sangeetham.com/bboard/quest.php3 ... 5&qid=5292

RajaChandra
I am not at all convinced that praNamAmyaham in gauLa is not by MV but by nAlvaDi. The composition is seen in the 2 volumes of MV`s compositions published MV himself with the benevolence of jayacAmarAja oDeyar. It was published in the 1940s if I am not mistaken. I seriously doubt MV wpuld have plagiarised anothers(a oDeyar`s!) composition and oDeyar would have smiled benevolently at this.

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 23 Oct 2005, 23:14

CML
Thanks for the DKP RTP. But I must say the recording is poor. Can something be done about it Coolkarni?
I heard the jhinjhOTi. It does sound like our junjhUTi but differs in that it is upAnga and also is not rendered in madhyama Sruti. I could discern several similarities with harikAmbOdhi itself.

knrh05
Thanks for the MLV RTP. the quality is not bad at all.

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 23 Oct 2005, 23:36

harikAmbOdhi is the 28th mELa. Its musical worth was discovered by tyAgarAja. But hang on. We cannot ignore dIkShitar too. He has composed in ISamanOhari which is very close to harikAMbOdhi. It has N3 as a foreign note and some special phrases.

coolkarni
Can you post MD`s jagadISamanOhari?

harikAmbOdhi is thus a fairly new entry to our music. It still is eclipsed by its more famous janya kAmbOdhi. Traditionally it has always been kAmbOdhi or kEdAragauLa that has enjoyed the mELa status. RShabha is very important in this rAga. So is niShAda particularly in ascent where it distinguishes this rAga from kAmbOdhi. The rAga can evoke many rasas. I personally find a lot of overlap between kamAc and harikAmbOdhi. The difference in scale is not enormous albeit more restrictive in kamAc. harikAmbOdhi is known by its innumerable janyas. It is similar to naTabhairavi in this respect although more popular in its own right. The rAga gives rise to 5 other mELas by SrutibhEda (the other BIG mELas:- 8th, 20th, 22nd, 29th and 65th mELas.)

Raja Chandra · Post by **Raja Chandra** » 23 Oct 2005, 23:44

DRS,

Iam too small a man to make such foolhardy comments. This is what Kadri has quoted in the site mentioned by me. He may have his own reasons and sources to say so. The fact remains there is no record of KRW IV as a composer, though he was an authority on the subject. If he has really composed, then this cannot be an isolated case. If you read the prof. VR's book he states KRW IV had seven volumes of rare compositions written in western notations thro' Vidwan. Venakata Giriappa in his arhives. May be some of his own if any may be hidden in the labryrinths of mysore palace.As already mentioned by me earlier in this thread some time back, first volume of MV was published in 1929 ( courtesy KRW IV) and second Volume in 1956 (courtesy JCRW). I understand Vidwan Channa keshaviah helped in compiling the second edition.

quote from an article on channa keshaviah:

Chennakeshaviah later learnt music from Vasudevacharya and spent many years in his close association. He set the Acharya's Kritis to Swara and assisted him in the work of bringing out his collected works, called 'Vasudeva Keerthana Manjari'. Vasudevacharya, who was in great appreciation of Chennakeshaviah's Swarajnana and sense of rhythm, started dictating his new composition to him.

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 24 Oct 2005, 01:38

The next kRti up for discussion is vijayatAm SrI rAjarAjESvari in viSvambhari.

http://rapidshare.de/files/6669375/vija ... i.mp3.html

CML
Can you please clarify if it is rAjESvarI or rAjESvari. What exactly is the meaning of vijayatAm (I mean in terms of vibhakti. Is it prathamA?).

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 24 Oct 2005, 01:52

mAtu for
|| vijayatAm ||

rAga: viSvambhari; miSratripuTa tALa

vijayatAm SrI rAjarAjESvarI viSvambharI |
vimalESvarI SrI kAncI nagarAdhISvarI ||P||

vijayatAm SrI vidyESvarI vidyullEkhEva bhAsvarI |
viShapAnAsakta SrI mahAdEva manOharI paSumAnuShAdi hRnmOhanakarI SankarI ||AP||

kanaka khacita maNivalaya SObhitA SivasahitA |
kamalAvAsa padma SrIkara kOmalapadA |
kanakAmbara karavIra suma mAlAlankRtA |
kamanIya vAgvilAsa SrI cakra vidyAvEdyA sarasa sangIta SAstra viSAradA ||C||

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 24 Oct 2005, 02:22

Meaning of
|| vijayatAm ||

rAga: viSvambhari; miSratripuTa tALa

vijayatAm SrI rAjarAjESvarI- Victory be to SrI rAjarAJESvari;
viSvambharI- Her Who nurtures and preserves the universe;
vimalESvarI- That pure and unsullied mistress;
SrI kAncI nagarAdhISvarI- the queen of the city of kAnci;

vijayatAm SrIvidyESvarI- victory to the mistress of SrIvidyA;
vidyullEkhEva bhAsvarI- Her with the luminosity of lightning;
viShapAna Asakta SrI mahAdEva manOharI- Her Who captivates the heart/mind of Siva Who is keen o consuming poison;
paSu mAnuShAdi hRnmOhanakarI- Her Who bewitches the hearts of animals and men alike; SankarI;

kanaka khacita maNivalaya SObhitA- Her bedecked with gold and gem-studded bangles/wristlets; SivasahitA- Her accompanie by Siva;
kamalAvAsa padma SrIkara kOmala padA- Her with feet that grant all prosperity and are tender as the lotus in which lakShmI resides;
kanakAmbara karavIra suma mAlA alankRtA- Her adorned with garland of kanakAmbara and karavIra flowers;
kamanIya vAgvilAsa SrIcakra vidyAvEdyA- Her with enchanting speech Who is realized by SrIvidyA; sarasa sangIta SAstra viSAradA- Her Who is an exponent of charming music and arts/studies.

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 24 Oct 2005, 06:12

DRS

rA~jnAM ISvarI rAjESvarI (overlord of all kings) is a tatpuruSha compound.
rajasya ISvarI rajESvarI (overlord of dirt) makes no sense.

vijayatAm is third person singular AtmanEpada Imperative (lOT) of vi + ji meaning 'let her triuumph'.

drshrikaanth · Post by **drshrikaanth** » 24 Oct 2005, 06:47

DRS

rA~jnAM ISvarI rAjESvarI (overlord of all kings) is a tatpuruSha compound.
rajasya ISvarI rajESvarI (overlord of dirt) makes no sense.

I am unable to understand this cryptic statement of yours. For a moment I thought there was a transcription error in my post. I checked and there isn`t. Can you explain? If this was meant to be humorous, sorry for throwing a wet blanket.

cmlover · Post by **cmlover** » 24 Oct 2005, 10:23

DRS

I was not trying to be cryptic. I thought it was quite clear.

The basic term is 'rAjan' which in compound become rAja+

Hence the ShaShThi tappuruSha is rAja + ISvarI = rAjESvarI which means
Controller or overlord of kings'. (note that rA~jnAM means of kings')

The word raja means dust or dirt. Hence the tatpuruSha compound raja+ISvarI =rajESvarI would mean lord of dirt which is nonsenxe.

I don't follow which you don't understand