3 kaLai caukaM

[keerthi]

is it possible to have an odd-numbered kaLai caukam pallavi or odd-numbered kalai rendering of a varNaM..? Does it have to always be 2-4-8-16 etc..?

[vasanthakokilam]

Keerthi: Good question. I do not see theoretically why not. We discussed this along with the full model here ( http://rasikas.org/forums/viewtopic.php? ... nadai.html ).

But there seems to be different schools of thought of what is in practise. Also, I have heard people taking objections to the terminology of 3 or 5 kaLai caukaM saying categorically that there can never be such a thing, it can only be 1, 2 and 4. I do not know if it is just a terminology thing or it is against some rules to have a 3 or 5 sub-taps per beat.

( When it gets to 3 and 5, this kaLai thing gets mixed in with naDai. Both are shown with more or less similar kriya but that is the only similarity there. It will be great if someone can critically review the contents of my model at http://rasikas.org/forums/viewtopic.php? ... nadai.html kaLai and naDai are separate aspects of the model. )

Hope the knowledgeable folks in the forum pitch in and discuss your topic.

There is a maNakkAl rangarAjan kAmbOdhi RTP in 5 kaLai caukam and he then does naDai variations in 2, 3, 4, 5, 6 and 7. It is in Sangeethapriya. Once I find it I will post a link.

( EDIT: I can not find it in sangeethapriya. It was under the 'sripathy' folder but it is not there now. The file name was
RTP-Demonstration.mp3 . If anyone has it, please upload and share the link )

[semmu86]

Keerthi, this is one topic which is discussed a lot in the laya circle along with "What is the difference between gathi and nadai". But unlike "gathi and nadai", most of the people with whom i have interacted with, seem to have a common opinion that kaLai should be only of 1,2,4,8,16 etc... There is no such odd numbered kaLai in our system.

Like VK said, any odd numbered kaLai is only the keezhkAlam of that respective nadai. For eg, if we take the krithi "birAna varA lichchibrO" (or any Adhi thAlam thisra nadai krithi for that matter), it can also be sung in Adhi thAlam 3-kaLai or the krithi's thAlam can be specified as Adhi thAlam 3-kaLai. But it is not so. The same applies to khandam and misram.

If someone can upload that pallavi, we can have a better understanding.

[keerthi]

VK,

very, very impressive essay. Not just in the topics covered (which would more or less be the same set for anyone writing on gati-nadai kalai etc,), but the clarity of articulation, and the cogent flow of ideas is remarkable.


Even in the case of topics I was familiar with, your article helped to put things in perspective. I strongly suggest that you put it all down, in a more article-ish format, and publish it in some music journal, (probably one of the not-so-technical ones like shruti or sanmukha) and it may turn out to be a much referred paper!

Also visibility among music oldies, who may know more, but who aren't net-savvy, will improve, in a journal, and could elicit responses from them as well.



I also see that you have glossed on the topic of what may be seen as a tALamAlikA -

Note 2: gathi and kaLai shift.

An artists can shift from one gathi or kaLai to another gathi or kaLai. For a given song, this framwork stipuates the constancy of the metronome beat. As long as that is obeyed, shifts to gathi and kaLai can be accomodated. All we need to remember is, gathi shift involves change in number of thala sub-beats and kaLai shift involves change in number of metronome beats. You can shift one by keeping the other unchanged. The adventurous types can change both parameters together ( though rare ). (It should be noted that some people believe that change in kaLai is equivalent to changing the thala and so they fall in the category of thalamalika. )

This reminds me of the difference of opinion regarding what is acceptable gathibhEdaM in say, a pallavi.

i have heard pallavi-s, where the length of the laghu was twice that of each (identical) druta, and each of these anga-s had a different (internal) gathi/naDai variation. Internal here meaning that the same time interval was redistributed into 3 or 5 equal parts, instead of the 4 parts that were previously reckoned.

I have also heard pallavis were each unit was in a different gati/ naDai but it appeared as if the lengths of the druta-s were no longer equal, and each unequal druta was no longer half the length of the laghu.

this latter kind of pallavi singing was puzzling and I was wondering what kind of mAlikA it is..?

Also whether such pallavis are accepted by all musicians as legitimate.



p.s - the word for fast tempo is druta kAlam, not durita kAlam. Unfortunately this misnomer is widespread among all music-speakers, Tamil or non-Tamil, and I have heard great mahAvidwan-s use this wrong term.

durita means sin!

[vasanthakokilam]

Thanks very much keerthi. I will follow up on your advice when I have some time.

I did not know the druta is the right term for fast tempo. Thanks for the info. But as you stated, the toothpaste is out of the tube!!

On the specific pallavi structure you mention, I am not the one to say if it is acceptable or not, but it can be accommodated in the model, though it may be considered as a stretch. When people quote 'sruthi matha laya pitha', they do that for many reasons. In one context, it means that those two are the foundations of our music system. In another context, people quote that to stress the unvarying nature of sruthi and laya in a song. We understand the sruthi part as the constancy of the AdhAra Shadjam and the rest of the swarasthanams derived from it. On the laya side, there does not seem to be a well defined understanding. People intuitively understand it as 'unvarying kAlapramANam' within a song.

But what is kAlapraMaNam? It has to do with tempo ( and not speed ). The principle can be restated as 'unvarying tempo'.

In the model I proposed, I distinguish between metronome beats and thala beats and stipulate that tempo is defined by metronome beats. The principle now becomes 'unvarying metronome beats'.

This frees up both speed ( gathi ) and thala beats to be free from the above principle as long as the metronome beats are constant for a song. That is, if one follows this model, there are two allowances and relaxations which I suspect purists vehemently disagree with. They are: a ) the thala beats in a thala cycle can be of different lengths b) The relationship between thala beats and metronome beats can be fractional and not necessarily integral. That is, one thala beat can be 1.25 times the metronome beat.

>each of these anga-s had a different (internal) gathi/naDai variation

This first scenario is the usage of different gathis for different angas while keeping the thala beats the same. So there is no violation of this principle, though some schools may consider gathibedam with in a thala cycle as unacceptable. ( on aesthetic grounds or other reasons that no one really understands anymore ). Personally for me, it is a nice variation to try.

>the lengths of the druta-s were no longer equal, and each unequal druta was no longer half the length of the laghu.

This second scenario is further along the adventurous side. If purists object to the first scenario, they may walk out if the second scenario is practiced. In terms of my model, It brings in both of the relaxations I mentioned above while still keeping with the fundamental principle of 'constancy of metronome beats'.

Say, for the drutham, they switch to kandam which elongates the thala beat. One way to model this as a simultaneous thala beat switch and a gathi switch. First, don't change the metronome beat. Second, increase the thala beat to 1.25 times the metronome beat, third switch to kanda gathi on the new thala beat interval.

Again, it is not for me to say if it is in agreement with any stated or unstated classical rule but if it provides for some aesthetic expression, then it is fine with me. For example, if one wants to structure an RTP on their own aesthetic, artistic and abstract principle: 'inner ripple' is constant but the 'outer ripple' is not, then they have to use techniques such as this to implement it. If they can produce a overall rasa that matches their intended principle, then I personally do not see why not.

[cmlover]

The word 'duritam' means fast in Tamil. Hence tamilian artistes use the word durita kaalam knowing the meaning only and it has obtained currency among them. The sanskrit meaning of 'sin/calamity' does not obtain in Tamil!

Good enlightening discussion! Keep going...

[cmlover]

VK/keerthi
Can we have a definition of 'kaalapramaaNam'. Your appeal to the metronome is scientically satisfying but may not be the one used by our ancients. Any idea how they defined it. My simple understanding for not varying 'laya' is not to vary the stipulated taala in a particular kriti. For example one cannot switch to rUpaka taalam in the middle of a adi taalam. Though if possible the rUpaka can be accommodated within the adi taalam using gati change. This is simple trickery isn't it?

[vasanthakokilam]

My simple understanding for not varying 'laya' is not to vary the stipulated taala in a particular kriti. For example one cannot switch to rUpaka taalam in the middle of a adi taalam.

I do not think so. The suLAdis are in talamalika. For example, Sri. Shrikaanth's rAmAyaNa mangaLa rAgamAlikA suLAdi is set to the suLAdi sapta tALas. ( and in the ragas SrIrAga, dhanyAsi, vasanta, asAvEri, mOhana, saurAShTra, suraTi ). Purandaradasa's suLAdis are also like that.

The prescription is more along the intuitive lines of

a) Keep to the same tempo. i.e ODal is no good. ODal (literal translation "running") can be sensed with many artists where at the beginning of the song, it is slow and steady but after some super fast kalpanaswaras, they had unconsciously switched to a faster way of singing the pallavi line. I think that is the spirit behind the prescription of constancy of kAlapramANam to admonish artists to train themselves to not do that. One can change the apparent speed by packing in more swaras but it should still be in the same tempo. I would expect that in thala malika like the suADis, the tempo needs to remain constant in the midst of the thala changes.

b) The key question is what is the right/official definition of tempo. It is normally thought of as the thala beat interval.

In my reference model, I generalized that to an abstract metronome beat interval (MBI) thus freeing up the thala beat interval (TBI) from that prescription. ( there is still a mathematical relationship between TBI and MBI ) I fully realize it may not be acceptable to everyone, but it was done to accommodate ( and legitimize ) situations like what Keerthi heard in his second scenario. A similar situation arises in the song 'Chandra chuda' ( raga malika starting with Shankarabharanam ) where one of the charanams shifts to khandam while keeping the sub-beat interval the same thus elongating the thala beat interval.

Of course, my way of modeling it using reference framework as a simultaneous switch of both gathi and kaLai while keeping the metronome beat as constant can be considered a big stretch. It is a big stretch because we need to invoke fractional kaLai. When people quibble about legality of 3 kaLai, fractional kaLai will be treated as an abomination. But fortunately, the situations where we have to invoke such things are extremely rare. Second, there can be a legimate criticism that by invoking fractional kaLai to explain these rare situations, it opens it up for very many different possibilities including abuses to legitimize anything and everything. On the other hand, it is all on the theoretical side anyway. The aesthetics and musicality of these practices will ( should ) decide the fate.

[CRama]

Theoretically, nothing wrong in singing a 3 kalai pallavi. About 5 years ago, Smt. Nithyasree Mahadevan sang a 3 kalai pallavi in Kolkata (Rasikapriya) in the ragam Hindolam. Other details of the pallavi now I do not remember.

[mridhangam]

Yes i also heard a 3 Kalai pallavi from Nityasri some years back at Mylapore Fine Arts Club ....

J.Balaji