Chennai - Madras

Languages used in Carnatic Music & Literature
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ragam-talam
Posts: 1896
Joined: 28 Sep 2006, 02:15

Post by ragam-talam »

Interesting point of view on why Chennai should have retained the name Madras:
http://www.languagehat.com/archives/000653.php
Not to be outdone, the chauvinist government in Madras renamed the state of Madras as Tamil Nadu - "homeland of the Tamils" - and decided that the city of Madras too would be rebaptized.
The chief minister had been informed that "Madras" was actually a Portuguese coinage, derived either from a trader named Madeiros or a prince called Madrie - just as Bombay came from the Portuguese "Bom Bahia," or "good bay."

"Madras is not a Tamil name," announced the chief minister to justify his decision to rename the city Chennai. As with Bombay, name recognition - Madras kerchiefs, Madras jackets - went by the board as "Chennai" was adopted without serious debate.

Worse, however, the chief minister had overlooked the weight of evidence that Madras was indeed a Tamil name. It was derived, alternative theories go, from the name of a local fisherman, Madarasan; or from the local Muslim religious schools, madrasas; or from madhu-ras, from the Tamil word for honey.

Still worse, he had also overlooked the embarrassing fact that "Chennai" was not, as he had asserted, of Tamil origin.

It came from the name of Chennappa Naicker, the Rajah of Chandragiri, who granted the British the right to trade on the coast - and who was a Telugu speaker from what is today a different Indian state, Andhra Pradesh.

So bad history is worse lexicology, but in India it is good politics....

vasanthakokilam
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Joined: 03 Feb 2010, 00:01

Post by vasanthakokilam »

Without going into the political angle....

r-t, I do not understand why you interpret your quoted paragraph to mean "why Chennai should have retained the name Madras".. All that says to me is 'Chennai is not a tamil word either'.

BTW, even before the official change, Madras is often referred to as Chennai by the populace at large in various contexts. I remember seeing bus destination boards with 'madras' in English and 'chennai' in Tamil. That was more than 35 years ago. May be that is why, among all the name changes, this bothered me the least.

ragam-talam
Posts: 1896
Joined: 28 Sep 2006, 02:15

Post by ragam-talam »

Well, it was a logical conclusion...if Chennai is not a tamil word, then why go into the effort of changing madras to chennai at all? why not leave it as madras?

I have heard several pukka tamilians refer to the city as 'madras' when speaking in tamil. 'Naan madras-ku pOREn' used to be typical usage. not sure any more.

vasanthakokilam
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Joined: 03 Feb 2010, 00:01

Post by vasanthakokilam »

>Well, it was a logical conclusion..

Well, one of the conclusions ( logical or otherwise ).

Another interpretation is, we reverted back to the old name.

And as I wrote before, the reverting to the old name is really only for official purposes. Chennai had been in common usage through out.

isramesh
Posts: 77
Joined: 03 Feb 2010, 10:22

Post by isramesh »

In olden days, Madras used to be called "Chenna Patnam" in Telugu. I remember somebody commenting in the Telugu media citing this at that time.

sridhar_ranga
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Joined: 03 Feb 2010, 11:36

Post by sridhar_ranga »

Yes and it was "Chennai Pattanam" in Tamil. The "formal" Tamil name of the City has been Chennai for many decades. Many of kalki's reviews of carnatic concerts in the 1930s and 40s refer to the city as Chennai. All India radio would always announce itself as "Chennai Vanoli Nilayam". Ramalinga Adigal (aka VaLLalAr), a saint poet who lived in the 19th century, refers to the city as "dharuma migu chennai" - the verses that include this particular line have been sung as viruttam in many carnatic concerts, including IIRC by Sanjay Subrahmanyan once.

In informal speech it was fashionable to refer to the city as Madras. But most villagers in interior TN would simply call the city as "paTTanam" or "paTnam". There was but only one paTnam in the Tamil land (I guess) and that was Chennai. (This should not be confused with many town names ending with 'paTTinam" - 'paTTinam' is a suffix applied to a place on the seashore).

Nick H
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Joined: 03 Feb 2010, 02:03

Post by Nick H »

When I last read him on the subject, S. Muthiah, the guardian Angel of Chennai history, put forward various theories about the origins of both "Chennai" and "Madras", but not facts. It seems no-one will ever know!

vasanthakokilam
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Joined: 03 Feb 2010, 00:01

Post by vasanthakokilam »

>All India radio would always announce itself as "Chennai Vanoli Nilayam".

Quite true. I forgot about that. All the more reason why the switch to Chennai was not really a big deal for most people, since it did not feel like a change at all.

srkris
Site Admin
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Joined: 02 Feb 2010, 03:34

Post by srkris »

Chaavi is not the tamil word for 'key', so do we have to use tiravukOl (திறவà¯ÂÂ

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