List of compostions in the SSP

Miscellaneous topics on Carnatic music
Post Reply
shreyas
Posts: 251
Joined: 03 Mar 2018, 13:16

List of compostions in the SSP

Post by shreyas »

Here is a list of compositions in the SSP. However, I cannot somehow find 229 in the online version on ibiblio.org - only 218.

1. Kanakambari – Kanakambari – Tisra Eka
2. Sri Dakshinamurthim – Phenadyuti – Adi
3. Brihadisvaro – Ganasamavarali – Rupakam
4. Brhadamba – Bhanumathi – Adi
5. Guruguhaswamini – Bhanumathi – Khanda Triputa
6. Balambike – Manoranjini – Matya
7. Chidambara Nataraja – Tanukirti – Misra Eka
8. Jnanambike – Senagrani – Tisra Eka
9. Kamalambike – Janatodi – Tisra Eka
10. Rupamu Juchi (Varnam) – Janatodi - Adi
11. Ehi Annapurne – Punnagavarali – Adi
12. Kamalambikaya – Punnagavarali – Tisra Eka
13. Chandramu Bhaja Manasa – Asaveri – Matya
14. Kumaraswaminam – Asaveri – Adi
15. Sadachaleswaram – Bhupalam – Adi
16. Sri Guruguhamurthe – Udayaravichandrika – Tisra Eka
17. Vishwanatham – Natabharanam – Adi
18. Kodandaramam – Kokilarava – Adi
19. Sri Krishnam Bhajare – Rupavathi – Tisra Eka
20. Ramachandra Bhaktham – Geyahejjuji – Adi
21. Prasanna Venkateswaram – Vativasanthabhairavi – Adi
22. Sri Nathadi Guruguho - Malavagowla – Adi
23. Avyaja Karuna – Salanganata – Triputa
24. Sarasvatya Bhagavatya – Chayagowla – Triputa
25. Sri Bhargavi Bhadram – Mangalakaisiki – Misra Eka
26. Venkateswara Ettapa – Megharanjini – Tisra Eka
27. Sundaramurthim – Takka – Tisra Eka
28. Sri Guruna Palitosmi – Padi – Tisra Eka
29. Sada Vinatha Sadare – Revagupti – Tisra Eka
30. Renuka Devi – Kannada Bangala – Khanda Eka
31. Sri Mahaganapathi – Gowla – Misra Eka
32. Tyagaraja Palaya – Gowla – Adi
33. Hiranmayim – Lalitha – Tisra Eka
34. Gunijanadinuta – Gurjari – Adi
35. Rajarajendrachola Pratishtitham – Gundakriya – Triputa
36. Pancha Matangamukha – Malahari – Tisra Eka
37. Sri Parvathi Parameswarau – Bowli – Adi
38. Sri Ganeshathparam – Ardradesi – Khanda Eka
39. Namaste Paradevate – Devaranji – Tisra Eka
40. Suryamurthe – Sourashtram – Dhruva
41. Varalakshmim Bhajare – Sourashtram – Adi
42. Sri Guruguhasya Dasoham – Purvi – Misra Eka
43. Krishnananda Mukunda – Gaudipantu – Misra Eka
44. Maruvakadi Malini – Maruva – Adi
45. Sri Rajagopala – Saveri – Adi
46. Vasudevam Upasmahe – Malavapanchamam – Tisra Eka
47. Sadhujanachitta – Purnapanchamam - Triputa
48. Mangaladevathe – Margadesi - Adi
49. Rama Rama – Ramakali – Tisra Eka
50. Sri Sukra Bhagavantam – Paras – Ata
51. Chintaye Mahalingam – Paras – Adi
52. Gauri Girirajakumari – Gauri – Tisra Eka
53. Sri Minakshi Gauri – Gauri – Tisra Eka
54. Ramachandram Bhavayami – Vasantha – Tisra Eka
55. Vinapustakadharini – Toyavegavahini – Khanda Eka
56. Kalabhairavam – Bhairavam – Adi
57. Chayavatim Anandavallim – Chayavati – Adi
58. Himachalakumarim – Jhankarabhramari – Tisra Eka
59. Sri Neelothpalanayike – Nariritigaula – Tisra Eka
60. Nirajakshi – Hindolam – Tisra Eka
61. Manasa Guruguha – Anandabhairavi – Tisra Eka
62. Dandayudhapanim – Anandabhairavi – Tisra Eka
63. Tyagaraja Yoga Vaibhavam – Anandabhairavi – Tisra Eka
64. Anandeswarena – Anandabhairavi – Misra Eka
65. Kamalamba Samrakshatu – Anandabhairavi – Misra Eka
66. Sri Mangalambikam – Ghanta – Jhampa
67. Sri Kamalambike Avava – Ghanta – Adi
68. Margahindolaragapriye – Margahindolam – Adi
69. Santanarama – Hindolavasantham – Adi
70. Vinabheri – Abheri – Adi
71. Navaratnavilasa – Navaratnavilasam – Adi
72. Chintayamakanda – Bhairavi – Tisra Eka
73. Bala Gopala – Bhairavi – Adi
74. Sri Kamalambikaya – Bhairavi – Jhampa
75. Aryam Abhayambam – Bhairavi – Ata
76. Sri Kamalamba Jayati – Ahiri – Tisra Eka
77. Mangaladevathaya – Dhanyasi – Tisra Eka
78. Balakrishnam Bhavayami – Gopikavasantham – Adi
79. Ramachandrena – Manji – Rupakam
80. Sri Saraswati Hite – Manji – Adi
81. Pahimam Ratnachala – Mukhari – Adi
82. Panchabhutha Kiranavalim – Kiranavali – Khanda Eka
83. Sri Muladhara Chakra Vinayaka – Sri – Adi
84. Tyagaraja Mahadhwaja – Sri – Adi
85. Sri Varalakshmi – Sri – Tisra Eka
86. Sri Kamalambike – Sri – Khanda Eka
87. Mamava Pattabhi – Manirangu – Misra Eka
88. Tyagarajena – Salagabhairavi – Adi
89. Mangalambayai – Malavasri – Jhampa
90. Sri Dum Durge – Sriranjini – Khanda Eka
91. Ni Sati Daivam (Daru) – Sriranjini – Tisra Eka
92. Venkatachalapathe – Kapi – Adi
93. Sri Kalahastisha – Huseni – Jhampa
94. Soundararajam – Brindavani – Tisra Eka
95. Mahalakshmi – Madhavamanohari – Adi
96. Dharmasamvardhini – Madhyamavathi – Tisra Eka
97. Bharati Maddishana – Devamanohari – Tisra Eka
98. Rudrakopa – Rudrapriya – Tisra Eka
99. Tyagarajadanyam – Darubaru – Adi
100. Sri Kamalambikaya – Sahana – Triputa
101. Ishanadi – Sahana – Tisra Eka
102. Ranganayakam – Nayaki – Adi
103. Kaumari Gauri – Gaurivelavali – Adi
104. Viravasantha Tyagarajamam – Viravasantham – Adi
105. Saravati – Saravati – Tisra Eka
106. Maye Twam Yahi – Tarangini – Adi
107. Saurasenesham – Saurasena - Adi
108. Nilakantham – Harikedaragowla – Tisra Eka
109. Abhayambikaya – Harikedaragowla – Jhampa
110. Guruguhadanyam – Balahamsa – Adi
111. Mamava Raghuvira – Mahuri – Misra Eka
112. Sri Guruguha – Devakriya – Rupakam
113. Sri Vatukanatha – Devakriya – Misra Eka
114. Brihannayaki – Andhali - Adi
115. Saraswati Chayatarangini – Chayatarangini - Adi
116. Sri Ramam – Narayanagowla – Adi
117. Mahaganapathe – Natanarayani – Adi
118. Kamalambikayai – Kambhoji – Ata
119. Sri Valmikalingam – Kambhoji – Ata
120. Kasi Vishweshwara – Kambhoji - Ata
121. Sri Subrahmanyaya – Kambhoji – Tisra Eka
122. Sri Mathrubhutham – Kannada – Misra Eka
123. Jagadisamanohari – Isamanohari – Tisra Eka
124. Sri Gananatham – Isamanohari – Tisra Eka
125. Sri Vanchanatham – Surati - Adi
126. Sri Venkatagirisha – Surati – Adi
127. Balasubrahmanyam – Surati - Adi
128. Angarakam – Surutti – Tisra Eka
129. Tyagarajam Bhajare – Erukulakambhoji – Misra Eka
130. Diwakara Tanujam – Erukulakambhoji – Adi
131. Tyagarajo – Atana – Tisra Eka
132. Brihaspathe – Atana – Triputa
133. Budham Ashrayami – Natakurinji – Jhampa
134. Chetasri Balakrishnam – Jujavanti – Tisra Eka
135. Sadasivam Upasmahe – Sankarabharanam – Adi
136. Akshaya Linga – Sankarabharanam – Misra Eka
137. Dakshinamurthe – Sankarabharanam – Jhampa
138. Nagalingam Bhajeham – Sankarabharanam – Adi
139. Sri Kamalambikaya – Sankarabharanam – Tisra Eka
140. Sri Venugopala – Kuranji - Jhampa
141. Mahishasura – Narayani – Misra Eka
142. Sri Sarawati Namostute – Arabhi – Tisra Eka
143. Marakoti – Arabhi - Jhampa
144. Guruguhaya – Sama – Adi
145. Vathapi Ganapathim – Hamsadhwani – Adi
146. Hatakeswara – Bilahari – Tisra Eka
147. Kamakshi Varalakshmi – Bilahari - Adi
148. Sri Balasubrahmanya – Bilahari – Misra Eka
149. Srimata Sivavamanke – Begada - Adi
150. Tyagarajaya Namasthe – Begada – Tisra Eka
151. Sankachakra – Purnachandrika – Tisra Eka
152. Saraswati Manohari – Saraswati Manohari - Adi
153. Ananda Natana Prakasam – Kedaram – Misra Eka
154. Hastivadanaya – Navaroju – Misra Eka
155. Amba Nilayatakshi – Nilambari – Adi
156. Siddhiswaraya Namasthe – Nilambari – Misra Eka
157. Tyagarajam – Nilambari – Tisra Eka
158. Kshitija Ramanam – Devagandhari – Adi
159. Nagabharanam – Nagabharanam - Adi
160. Kalavathi – Kalavathi – Adi
161. Svetaganapathim – Ragachudamani - Triputa
162. Varadaraja – Gangatarangini – Tisra Eka
163. Kanjadalayatakshi – Manohari – Adi
164. Sankaram Abhirami – Manohari – Tisra Eka
165. Bhogachayanatakapriye – Bhogachayanata - Adi
166. Sri Sulinim – Sailadesakshi - Adi
167. Swaminatha – Chalanata – Adi
168. Pavanatmajagaccha – Chalanata – Jhampa
169. Kamakotipitha – Saugandhini – Adi
170. Sri Vidyaraja – Jaganmohanam – Tisra Eka
171. Mamava Meenakshi – Dhalivarali – Misra Eka
172. Sesachalanayakam – Dhalivarali – Tisra Eka
173. Nabhomani – Nabhomani – Triputa
174. Sachidananda – Kumbhini – Adi
175. Himagiri Kumari – Ravikriya – Adi
176. Namo Namasthe – Girvani – Triputa
177. Jayati Siva Bhavani – Bhavani – Tisra Eka
178. Stavarajadinuta – Stavaraja – Triputa
179. Sarasa Sauvira – Sauvira – Adi
180. Brihadisa – Jeevantika – Tisra Eka
181. Sringaradi – Dhavalanga – Khanda Eka
182. Narmada Kaveri – Namadesi - Triputa
183. Ucchista Ganapathau – Kasiramakriya - Adi
184. Minakshi Memudam Dehi – Gamakakriya – Adi
185. Vamsavati – Vamsavati - Adi
186. Bhaktavatsalam – Vamsavati - Adi
187. Samalangi Matangi – Samala - Adi
188. Pamarajanapalini – Sumadyuti – Tisra Eka
189. Hariyuvatim Haimavatim – Desisimharavam – Tisra Eka
190. Parandhamavathi – Dhamavathi – Tisra Eka
191. Nishadadi – Nishada - Triputa
192. Sri Sugandhikuntalambike – Kuntala – Tisra Eka
193. Mararatipriyam – Ratipriya - Adi
194. Sadhujanavinutam – Gitapriya - Triputa
195. Bhushavatim – Bhushavati – Tisra Eka
196. Bhajare Re Chittha – Kalyani – Misra Eka
197. Kamalambam Bhajare – Kalyani – Adi
198. Sri Mangalambike – Kalyani - Ata
199. Jambupathe – Yamuna Kalyani – Tisra Eka
200. Narasimha Agaccha – Mohana – Misra Eka
201. Parimalaranganatham – Hamviru – Tisra Eka
202. Arunachalanatham – Saranga – Tisra Eka
203. Tyagaraje Krityakrityam – Saranga - Jhampa
204. Guruguhabhava – Chaturangini - Triputa
205. Anandamritakarsini – Amritavarsini – Adi
206. Santanamanjari – Santanamanjari - Adi
207. Paranjoti – Joti - Adi
208. Matangi Marakatangi – Dhautapanchamam – Tisra Eka
209. Sri Rama Sarasvati – Nasamani - Adi
210. Kusumakara Shobitha – Kusumukara – Tisra Eka
211. Sringara Rasamanjari – Rasamanjari – Tisra Eka
212. Sri Vishwanatham – Ragamalika – Adi
213. Purnachandrika Bimba – Ragamalika – Tisra Eka
214. Manasa Veritarula – Ragamalika – Tisra Eka
215. Gananayakam – Rudrapriya - Eka
216. Tyagesam Bhajare – Rudrapriya – Adi
217. Ganesakumara – Desiya Junjhuti – Eka
218. Ananta Balakrishna – Isamanohari – Adi

Also, if a composition is not listed in the SSP, does that automatically indicate that it is spurious and not composed by Dikshithar?

RSR
Posts: 3427
Joined: 11 Oct 2015, 23:31

Re: List of compostions in the SSP

Post by RSR »

@1->Shreyas-> Thank you for the list.
I am puzzled that famous kritis like (1) mAmava pattAbirAma (2) rangapura vihAra (3) panchashatpeetaroopini (4) srisathyanarAyanam
....are all missing! ( or am I missing to locate them in the list?). Can they be spurious? Not likely. Scholars will clear your doubt.

SrinathK
Posts: 2477
Joined: 13 Jan 2013, 16:10

Re: List of compostions in the SSP

Post by SrinathK »

Take a look at the index : http://ibiblio.org/guruguha/ssp_cakram1-4.pdf
http://ibiblio.org/guruguha/ssp_cakram5-6.pdf
http://ibiblio.org/guruguha/ssp_7to12.pdf
http://ibiblio.org/guruguha/ssp_append.pdf - yes, this is also by Subbarama Dikshitar only.

And there is the other resource called dIkshita keertana prakASikai (DKP for short -- the only extra kriti in this one not in the SSP is mahA ganapatim vandE in tODi).

http://guruguha.org/dkp_p.pdf

Unfortunately both Subbarama Dikshitar and T S Natarajasundaram Pillai died before they could complete their mission. The DKP was to have more editions. SD wanted to compile the kritis of Thyagaraja and Syama Sastri and the padams of Kshetrayya. But this never came to pass.

Some of the other kritis come from the Dhanammal family, as Veena Dhanammal and T S Natarajasundaram Pillai both learnt them from Sathanur Panchanada Iyer who was directly Dikshitar's disciple.
Last edited by SrinathK on 09 Aug 2019, 23:52, edited 1 time in total.

RSR
Posts: 3427
Joined: 11 Oct 2015, 23:31

Re: List of compostions in the SSP

Post by RSR »

@3-> SrinathK
------------
Thank you. All the files downloaded. and found the maNirangu kriti.
Other kritis also will be there.
The DKP was to have more editions.
May I know the expansion for DKP here? or subconscious typo?

SrinathK
Posts: 2477
Joined: 13 Jan 2013, 16:10

Re: List of compostions in the SSP

Post by SrinathK »

The dikshita keertanai prakAshikA I meant. But the pun is very meaningful too. :lol:

shreyas
Posts: 251
Joined: 03 Mar 2018, 13:16

Re: List of compostions in the SSP

Post by shreyas »

Mamva Pattabhi Rama is there. However, more popular krithis like Rangapura Vihara, Sarasijanabha Sodari, Panchashatpeetha Rupini, Sri Satyanarayanam, Mahaganapathim Manasa, Sri Krishnam Bhaja Manasa, Hariharaputram etc. aren't there. I had to scour the entire book to make this list in the first place, and I made sure that these aren't there. The ragam for Kanjadalayatakshi is listed as Manohari, not Kamalamanohari, and there is a ragam called Mukhari which is a janya of mela 1 - Kanakambari. It is actually very different from what we expect from these krithis. Vathapi itself is a different version altogether. I was introduced to the SSP by TMK's versions and therefore I prefer to learn Dikshithar songs from his recordings.

RSR
Posts: 3427
Joined: 11 Oct 2015, 23:31

Re: List of compostions in the SSP

Post by RSR »

@6->Shreyas
-------------
There are some sites, which in my opinion, are precious , for learners , of Dikshitar kritis ( MD). One is by Sri.V.Govindan.
http://guru-guha.blogspot.com/2009/04/d ... -list.html

-----------------------------------------
The other very valuable site is
www.medieval.org/music/world/carnatic/dikshitar.html
-
A quote brings out its speciality. and highlights the contribution of Lakshman_ji.
"Compositions of Muttusvami Dikshitar (1776-1827)

The following list has been developed over the past several years, based on many contributions and updates. Most recently, it has been verified against the authoritative source Compositions of Muddusvami Dikshitar by Sangeetha Kalanidhi T. K. Govinda Rao, published in Chennai 1997.

The original list was taken from Alphabetical Index of Karnatak Songs by Lakshman Ragde, with extensive information from Raganidhi by B. Subba Rao. The next version was compared against Dikshitar Kirtanamala by A. Sundaram Iyer as supplied by P. P. Narayanaswami. Since then, clarifications from other sources and rec.music.indian.classical readers have been added.

With this information, the list ought to be fairly accurate. Nonetheless, I am happy to accept corrections and additions, especially with regard to the questionable attributions which are listed. Typographical errors are hopefully minimal at this point, although several have been found in T. K. Govinda Rao's publication, and several more have undoubtedly been introduced by me.

It must also be noted explicitly that the Melakarta system which Dikshitar used is not the modern one (both are given below), and that in some cases the ragas have changed. In all cases, reference in the list below is given to the original Dikshitar assignment. A similar policy has been attempted with talas, although they likely remain more haphazard at this point.

Hopefully this list will prove useful. It has been created laboriously over the course of several years. Now that more authoritative sources are available, it becomes possible to present it with some confidence. Most of the lyrics are now available at this site as well.

----------------------------------------

The second reference is very useful because it gives the songs in the order of MK system and the name given by MD school.
Hope that this helps.
**********************************************
A numbered list of all MD kritis at
https://karnatik.com/co1002.shtml
520 songs here. ( Lyrics contributed by Lakshman-ji mostly, if not for all).
Last edited by RSR on 10 Aug 2019, 13:10, edited 1 time in total.

Suryasriram
Posts: 59
Joined: 11 Sep 2015, 22:27

Re: List of compostions in the SSP

Post by Suryasriram »

You missed out on Naraharim Ashrayami in Jayasuddhamalavi. And isn't Manasa Veritarula by Ramaswamy Dikshitar?

SrinathK
Posts: 2477
Joined: 13 Jan 2013, 16:10

Re: List of compostions in the SSP

Post by SrinathK »

Do check out this space as well for more SSP and Old versions of rAgAs and kritis. When I thought of exploring the rAgAs of CM, somehow I bumped into Dr. T R Aravindhan, who's been pursuing this with a passion.

SrinathK
Posts: 2477
Joined: 13 Jan 2013, 16:10

Re: List of compostions in the SSP

Post by SrinathK »

Do check out this space as well for more SSP and Old versions of rAgAs and kritis. When I thought of exploring the rAgAs of CM, somehow I bumped into Dr. T R Aravindhan, who's been pursuing this with a passion. https://www.youtube.com/user/Vathathmaja/videos

Apparently this is still just the tip of the iceberg. Check out this : http://musicresearchlibrary.net/

venkatpv
Posts: 373
Joined: 02 Feb 2010, 22:23

Re: List of compostions in the SSP

Post by venkatpv »

shreyas wrote: 09 Aug 2019, 20:27 Also, if a composition is not listed in the SSP, does that automatically indicate that it is spurious and not composed by Dikshithar?
Here's a list of not-in-SSP kritis that are definitely Dikshitar's:

1. Mahaganapatim vande - Todi
2. Shri subramanyo - Todi
3. Nilotpalambikaya - Kannada gaula
4. Shri sundararajam - Ramakriya
5. Sadashraye - Chamaram
6. Abhayamba jagadamba - Kalyani

I am basing the above list on Prof. SRJ's observations.

Other contenders:
1. Agastishwaram - Lalita
2. Mayuranatham - Dhanyasi
3. Vadanyeshwaram - Devagandhari
4. Ardhanarishwaram - Kumudakriya

This smaller list is following a conversation I had recently with my good friend, and forumite, (keerthi) Naresh.

Suryasriram
Posts: 59
Joined: 11 Sep 2015, 22:27

Re: List of compostions in the SSP

Post by Suryasriram »

Suggestion to alter the Title of the thread to "List of DIKSHITAR compositions in the SSP".

shreyas
Posts: 251
Joined: 03 Mar 2018, 13:16

Re: List of compostions in the SSP

Post by shreyas »

Agreed. How are you so sure that those krithis you listed are composed by Dikshithar? Is there another text that is as authentic that I am not aware of?


venkatpv
Posts: 373
Joined: 02 Feb 2010, 22:23

Re: List of compostions in the SSP

Post by venkatpv »

shreyas wrote: 11 Aug 2019, 11:44 Agreed. How are you so sure that those krithis you listed are composed by Dikshithar? Is there another text that is as authentic that I am not aware of?
Mahaganapatim vande has the DKP stamp of approval. The rest are musically and lyrically of a standard comparable to any of the grand SSP compositions. Although the "musical standard" is a subjective opinion, anyone who has heard/learnt a lot of Dikshitar can vouch for these kritis. As for the lyrics, my understanding is, among other things, that the rules of 2nd letter consonance must be stringently met throughout the composition.

shreyas
Posts: 251
Joined: 03 Mar 2018, 13:16

Re: List of compostions in the SSP

Post by shreyas »

I wonder where all these spurious Dikshithar songs came from though. WIth Tyagaraja, at least, songs like Vinatasuta Vahanudai and Nidu Charanamule are attributed to KVS Iyengar. However, with Dikshithar, more than half of the songs we hear in the concert circuit are spurious. Indeed, a very large portion of such compositions are decidedly subpar and do not meet the MD standards even by half - Maha Ganapathim, Ekamresha Nayaki, Kailasanathena etc, others sound pleasant but definitely not MD-esque, like Panchashatpitha and Matangi, and others are so good that they might as well be classified as authentic MD creations; Sri Satyanarayanam, for instance, in my humble opinion. But why is it that we have such a profusion of fake MD in the first place?

SrinathK
Posts: 2477
Joined: 13 Jan 2013, 16:10

Re: List of compostions in the SSP

Post by SrinathK »

There are some songs which we can trace to the disciplic succession of Ambi Dikshitar. For eg. Recently guruguha ganamrta vidyalaya (Smt. Meera Venkataraman) informed me they had been singing Sri lakshmi varAham long before Semmangudi. So there are a few like this.

Even with these sources, I strongly believe each and every song of Dikshitar must be traced back to its source (who first sang it or taught it?) and analyzed linguistically and musically and contextually to see how far it can be proved authentic or not. This search throws up many dead ends and such compositions become suspect. Some compositions are no longer sung in their original ragas or distorted beyond recognition. Some compositions may be traced back to someone in the Dikshitar parampara and if you are familiar with his style and phrasing, we can infer that it could be a bonafide Dikshitar kriti.

Based on stylistic differences, I have not ruled out the possibility that some kritis attributed to Dikshitar may have been the compositions of others in his parampara either. Others may just be cast in the mold, but spurious. Up and till Subbarama Dikshitar, the parampara strictly adhered to the old school. After that changes started happening.

Another suspicious set are a group of Dikshitar kritis popularized by the Maharajapuram school. All are too modern.

CM being an oral tradition barring a few exceptions, that too where creativity and improvisation are prized, comes with a major problem - lack of enough documentation. The literacy rate in India was less than 3% at the turn of the 20th century, so people who could read and write were rare. While things have improved a lot now anything before that is very inadequately documented by international standards.

The pitfalls of a very creative oral tradition, poorly documented, are -- a lack of transparency and authenticity, a tendency to "innovate", compose, rebel, change and individualize one's music in secret, while maintaining an outward image of being traditional and obedient, combined with the limitations of human memory.

The cat is kept in the bag by a system of authority that forbids the spirit of enquiry. It is possible, if one is clever enough, to proliferate an entirely fabricated music tradition over time, with no one the wiser. You will still see many musicians not be transparent with (or mostly not aware of) the true sources of some compositions or versions for this reason. Most of the secrets are known only to the musicologists. By comparison we still have the original handwritten manuscripts of J S Bach.

The word "tradition" is therefore a great irony of sorts. Everyone claims to be traditional, everyone says "My guru taught me like this." But this does not stand up to what they actually do, which is amply visible in over a century of recordings. This is the exact opposite to the rigorous peer reviewed system of scientific research worldwide.

Given where music is right now in 2020, it would be healthier for manodharma sangeetham, the compositions and composers and tunesmiths and their expression of artistic individuality if all these issues were addressed more transparently and documented more thoroughly.

kmrasika
Posts: 1258
Joined: 10 Mar 2006, 07:55

Re: List of compostions in the SSP

Post by kmrasika »

Don't know whether this is mentioned in SSP or even included in KASI's books: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ft008YWvSME, but the artist learnt it from S Rajam, so there must be some authentication.

nAdopAsaka
Posts: 878
Joined: 20 Jul 2020, 17:05

Re: List of compostions in the SSP

Post by nAdopAsaka »

This urge to copy/imitate/duplicate/plagiarize happens with all great art…(many good forgeries of famous paintings are known)…..so too with Carnatic music…

It is my understanding that Maharajapuram Santhanam was a kind of “AsthanA vidwAn ?” at the Arsha vidyAlaya run by the Swami Dayananda Saraswati. It seems to me he may at that time have also “tuned” some songs for which the words were written by the Swami (such as Bho Shambho in Revati etc)..

Although these songs have become some-what popular, on both compositional and musical level perhaps not as elevated as Dikshitar’s or any of the other great composers.... the timeframe though (80's-90's) seems to coincide with the creation of some of these dikshitar-esque "knock-offs" !? The father (MVI) was a highly respected vidwan who doesn't seem to have this kind of reputation , however.

I think both musicians and the swamis (examples of each can easily be given) feel “energized” to try to “duplicate” these original vAggeyAkAras, but obviously this is not something you can truly duplicate.

The Swamis observe that Dikshitar or Tyagaraja have summarized, rather neatly, in their kritis a formula or an upAsana that takes into account quite a bit (if not all !) of what they are aspiring to proselytize. For the musicians, be it vocalists or instrumentalists, there is the sense that this kind of achievement could confer an immortality similar to that of the Trinity !

I do not condemn or mock these efforts however sophomoric or amateurish they are compared to say the trinity or the others…..even later accepted greats...Patnam Sub. Iyer , Papanasam S etc. have all had to nurture their art and skill under the bright glare of the Trinity. I have always admired many of the great swamis that the soil of BhAratvarsha has germinated and will continue to.

The Trinity and otherS like them..the Maharaja, Ksetrayya, etc. are kavis=poets ...apart from their musical vidwath and of course their relationships with deities, their concepts of dharma/tatva/bhakti (noted to me by shankarnk in another thread ongoing on Muthuswamy Dikshitar) are unique.

Indeed their productions/compositions are instinctive maybe even involuntary.

Aspiring to such greatness is innocent , even noble, however futile and hopeless, both for learned swamis or learned musicians.

Dikshitar is somewhat unique and a magnet for this subterfuge, because he seems to offer a formula (with all his "premeditated" methods) and gives the impression that perhaps being a tone-poet is straightforward.. if one has some swara-gyAnam, some self-appointed pedigree and some modest reading of scriptures. As I see it the vAggeyakAra/tone-poet is a gift, even an extension of the original promulgator of music/nAda.

I would not put it past the Ambi/subbarAma/etc. etc. Dikshitars to consider that some of that original intuition of Muthuswamy may have come to them as well , simply because they are descendants !! However this type of creativity does not travel genetically..

I do not mock sincere efforts at compositions but perhaps they should be condemned vigorously if the perpetrators are knowingly and openly committing this “identity theft”…regardless of their lineage or so-called pedigree.

I do feel our music (and our discussions) should not be bitter or about bitterness. To take the negative edge off this discussion, at the happy time of Devi Navaratri , here is an example, as I see it, of a fine composition which the composer (not a performing musician as far as I can tell) did not attribute to anyone else but himself.. and pays tribute to a swami also…

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=30TtrepuEt4

The devi can herself be considered the prime ornament of shiva, so I chose Sankarabharana !
MSS sweet voice does full justice to kriti and raga..

Vakulabharana
Posts: 37
Joined: 07 Dec 2017, 15:58

Re: List of compostions in the SSP

Post by Vakulabharana »

However this type of creativity does not travel genetically.
I think you are not aware of the works of Sri Subburama Deekshitar. He was a such a great musician and his greatness and vidvat was brought to my notice from the works of Dr Aravind and this forum introduced me to him.

He is no less tham Sri Muthuswamy Deekshithar in his musical prowess. Go through his channel in YouTube wherein he has uploaded many unheaed kritis of Subburama Deekshitar including a ragamalika in 30 ragas and refer to his articles.

It is because of Subburama Deekshithar we are able to even disxuss about the original tunes of Muthiswamy Deekshithar.

nAdopAsaka
Posts: 878
Joined: 20 Jul 2020, 17:05

Re: List of compostions in the SSP

Post by nAdopAsaka »

Yes I am aware of subbarAma dikshitar's compositions on you tube.

Regarding genes, of course Dikshitars father was also a great vidwan, likely his brother the violinist also had similar skills..
but the sheer, prodigious output and the systematic approach of the Trinity (and maybe a few others ) is
completely unique..and puts them in a different category..
So is their poetic skill and weaving in different aspects of raga, word and shrines..etc..

similarly subbarAya sAstri, with the genes of syAma sAstri has a handful of well known compositions...
but is not confused with the devi-upAsaka that his father was..

I am unaware if there are any knock-off or spurious (mis) attributions to either
subbarAma dikshitar..or subbarAya sAstri..

we are of course indebted to all those who have preserved an accurate legacy of great composers..,

Vakulabharana
Posts: 37
Joined: 07 Dec 2017, 15:58

Re: List of compostions in the SSP

Post by Vakulabharana »

Yes I am aware of subbarAma dikshitar's compositions
Can you please explain me the reason for you to say 'this type of creativity does not travel genetically'.

nAdopAsaka
Posts: 878
Joined: 20 Jul 2020, 17:05

Re: List of compostions in the SSP

Post by nAdopAsaka »

Sorry.. but I thought I did..

The way I see it the Trinity are a very special category and within them
Muthuswamy is perhaps even more unique...his musical approach to the Devi in the
Navavaranas etc. for instance.. since he combines mystical and musical elements in a comprehensive
way, while also paying tribute to the greater themes of faiths as he observed first hand in shrines and in scriptures.

bhakthim dehi
Posts: 539
Joined: 24 Feb 2014, 21:28

Re: List of compostions in the SSP

Post by bhakthim dehi »

while also paying tribute to the greater themes of faiths as he observed first hand in shrines and in scriptures.
Purandaradasar has done that even in 15th century. Explaining or referimg to philosophies can be found in the kritis of Tyagarajar too in abundance. Only explaining or referring about the shrines makes Deekshitar great?
Last edited by bhakthim dehi on 25 Oct 2020, 21:58, edited 1 time in total.

Vakulabharana
Posts: 37
Joined: 07 Dec 2017, 15:58

Re: List of compostions in the SSP

Post by Vakulabharana »

Sorry.. but I thought I did
Trinity are great. No doubt. But they have given their musical ideas to next generation too. Subbaraya Sastri and Subburama Deekshithar come under this category. Just go through his kriti tripurasundari. Look at the word play. How is this inferior from that of a Deekshithar kriti? Language and style might be different. But look at the the content. Look at the kriti amba paradevate. In what way it is musically inferior?
I need not say any more about Venkata saila vihara or janani ninnuvina. You can see the reflections of Deekshithar and Shyama Sastri in these compositions.

RSR
Posts: 3427
Joined: 11 Oct 2015, 23:31

Re: List of compostions in the SSP

Post by RSR »

Excellent work . Wont this be more useful if placed in composers section -> MD Kruthis?
Another request. Can these kruthis be arranged as group kruthis- following the information provided by the excellent biography by @RaviSri ? Thirutthani, Triplicane, Kanchipuram, Thiruvannaamalai, Chithambaram, Vaitheeswarankoil, Mayooram, Thiryvaaroor, Trichy and karur, Tanjore, Madurai, Rameswaram, Tirunelveli, Kallidaikkurichi, Nagapattinam, Mannaarkudi, and a few more?
@shreyas can easily do that with his passion and dedication.
Mods are requested to copy and place this thread in MD Kruthis thread. please. .

Post Reply