N.C. Vasanthakokilam

Carnatic Musicians
RSR
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Re: N.C. Vasanthakokilam

Post by RSR »

rshankar-> NCV had a great voice. She did not die in 'penury'. She had TB and passed away when she was just 31. Saregama is uploading quite a few records by NC Vasanthakokilam. recently. ( more than 20). APK Saptha Gireesan also is uploading great , forgotten songs by NCV in films like Haridas, Krushna Vijayam and such. I am having quite a few links about her ( not from Randor Guy). but from a relative of her. Also Vembar Manivannan. Recently, tube is bursting with grand uploads of classics of the past. One such is Kutchey set by Madurai Mani Iyer. No license issues involved. We can use on-line tools to extract the music from tube. Kindly write directly to me ( rs.ramaswamy@gmail.com). I will be very glad to share about 50 very nice songs ( some , though from films, are based on pure classical). and also some gems like 'Sarasadhala Nayana' by Dhikshithar. in Kamaaj. and 'Maaye'. I presume that you are from Tamilnad so that I can send many of her tamil songs ( by Suddhananda Barathi).

RSR
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Re: N.C. Vasanthakokilam

Post by RSR »

SrinathK wrote:NCV had one of the best voices I've ever heard -- incredibly powerful with a gigantic vocal range, with seemingly endless power in the upper octave. She could hit stratospherically high notes almost easily with no need for a falsetto (just listen to her rendition of mAyE in tarangiNi) - by my reckoning, it was a greater range than even MS Amma -- while I didn't want to get into comparisons, I had no other yardstick. Sadly though, she wasn't blessed with the same longevity.
100% in agreement. Her 'saarasa dhala nayanaa' -Dheekshithar (Kamaj) is a grand classic. ..I wish that MS had given more records of Barathy songs during 1945-50. There are only two records 1) a ) mannum imayamalai 1) b) oLi padaittha kaNNinaay ... 2)a) yAmarintha mozhikalLilae 2) b) centhamizh nAdenum pothinilae .. ..During the same period NCV gave a priceless gem of a ragamalika in piLLaip pirAyatthilae ( thilang, beemplas and kamaj) and pozhuthu pularnthau ( boopAlam). Luckily the first song is available . Saregama has placed all these songs in youtube. public domain. There was another excellent ragamalika 'sanganaadham ketkuthu..saantha Gandhi satthiayatthin' . Lovely piece. Out of circulation now. The importance of preserving legacy!
Last edited by RSR on 17 Nov 2016, 21:44, edited 1 time in total.

RSR
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Re: N.C. Vasanthakokilam

Post by RSR »

In the process of creating a website for all the NCV songs and related materials like biography . https://sites.google.com/site/ncvasanthakokilam As a forum member has requested, can anyone help by giving the link to NCV rendering of 'unnaiyallaal vaerae gathi' in Simmendhramadhyamam ( koteeswara iyer) ? also any other song not covered in the above site under creation? There must be quite a few.

RSR
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Re: N.C. Vasanthakokilam

Post by RSR »

thanjavooran-> Sir, Happened to come across the following link of a song with great slides on N.C.Vasanthakokilam
https://sites.google.com/site/ncvasanth ... m-patalkal....GYANA GURUBARANE
The slide mentions your name for the brief biography and her music. It is written in chaste thamizh. Thank you Sir.
Is the great song of Barathy 'Pozhuthu pularnthathu' rendered in Boopala ragam by NCV , a film song ,as mentioned in the presentation? If so, may I know which film? I am desperately in need of that song . Can you help?

RSR
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Re:

Post by RSR »

Lakshman wrote:I thought I heard bilahari and nIlAmbari after kAmbhOji, then bhairavi and shankarAbharaNa.
--------------------------------
Lakshman ji, just today, read the article on N.C.Vasanthakokilam films and songs in 'Mambalam times'.by Randor Guy Reproducing the para here.
"The musical talents and singing skills of Vasanthakokilam were used
to maximum advantage in this ‘Krishna Vijayam’. Her proficiency in
classical Carnatic music surfaced and soared skywards as never
before in any of her other films. She sang songs in many ragas including
a ragamalika about the birth of Lord Krishna ‘Porumai Kadalaagiya
Bhoomadev
i’ in

------------------------------
1)Bilahari,
2)Neelambari,
3) Bhairavi,
4)Shankarabharanam,
5)Thodi,
6) Pantuvaraali,
7)Mohanam,
8)Sree Ragam,
9) Anandhabhairavi
and
10)Hamsnaadham

-------------------------------------
Recently, there was an article by Thirunindravoor Santhanakrishnan ( if I remember the name right) in dhinatthanthi on carnatic singers in tamil films. He too has mentioned that NCV song under discussion had 10 ragams.
Experts may give opinion. I will give the audio link in next post

RSR
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Re: N.C. Vasanthakokilam

Post by RSR »


RSR
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Re: N.C. Vasanthakokilam

Post by RSR »

Dr.Pasupathi-> N.C.Vasanthakokilam acted in her first film with V.V.Sadagopan in Venuganam. in 1940, the same year as MS Sakunthalai. and her last film was Krushnavijayam in 1950. During that decade, she was very famous in classical carnatic concerts and gramaphone records. Kalki has written about DKP and MS. I am curious to know if he had reviewed any of the film songs, records, concerts of NCV . May I have your help?

Pasupathy
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Re: N.C. Vasanthakokilam

Post by Pasupathy »

RSR ... I don't have any so far. Will be on the lookout.

RSR
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Re: N.C. Vasanthakokilam

Post by RSR »

Pasupathy wrote:RSR ... I don't have any so far. Will be on the lookout.
Dr.Pasupathy -> Thank you. It will be invaluable .

thanjavooran
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Re: N.C. Vasanthakokilam

Post by thanjavooran »

RSR wrote:thanjavooran-> Sir, Happened to come across the following link of a song with great slides on N.C.Vasanthakokilam
https://sites.google.com/site/ncvasanth ... m-patalkal....GYANA GURUBARANE
The slide mentions your name for the brief biography and her music. It is written in chaste thamizh. Thank you Sir.
Is the great song of Barathy 'Pozhuthu pularnthathu' rendered in Boopala ragam by NCV , a film song ,as mentioned in the presentation? If so, may I know which film? I am desperately in need of that song . Can you help?
Shri RSR,
It is not me. I was just 11 yrs old when she died. But I have heard her records in my childhood days.
Thanjavooran
25 11 2016

RSR
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Re: N.C. Vasanthakokilam

Post by RSR »

thanjavooran-> Sir, It is OK. When you come across the song , kindly inform.

RSR
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Re: N.C. Vasanthakokilam

Post by RSR »

I was just 11 yrs old when she died. But I have heard her records in my childhood days.
Thanjavooran
25 11 2016
Respected Sir, I was only 9 year old when NCV passed away in 1951. "But I have heard her records in my childhood days" ditto....especially 'paamaalaikkinaiyundo', 'thanthai thAy irunthAl ', 'pozhuthu pularnthathu', 'anthanAL ini varumo' etc. Luckily, we are able to retrieve most of the songs thanks to youtube and mp3 sites.

RSR
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Re:

Post by RSR »

rshankar wrote:CML,
I have been itching to ask: who named her vasanthakOkilam, and why? As far as I can tell, her name was Kamakshi. Did she start performing concerts after DKP?
Thanks.
Ravi
-----------------------------------------------
pardon me .. I am a new entrant. N.C.Vasanthakokilam , (Kamakshi) might have got that name from famous director K.SUBRANYAM. .
A good article by Sriram Venkatakrishnan in The Hindu. "In 1936, the family moved to Madras, when based on the encouragement given by film director K. Subrahmanyam, it was believed that young Kamakshi stood a good chance in films. Her name was changed to N.C. Vasanthakokilam (the nightingale in spring). ‘N’ was for Nagapattinam and ‘C’ of course was her father’s initial. "
---------------------------------------------------
"Almost the first big singing opportunity was at the Music Academy’s annual conference of 1938, presided over by Ariyakkudi Ramanuja Iyengar and declared open by the Yuvaraja of Mysore. The first prize in vocal music went to Vasanthakokilam. From then on, she became a musician in demand. While the Academy was her launch-pad, it was the Indian Fine Arts Society, with its long tradition of supporting women artistes, that gave her many concert opportunities. Yet another Sabha that featured her often was the Nellai Sangeetha Sabha in Tirunelveli. "
http://www.thehindu.com/todays-paper/tp ... 436477.ece

RSR
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Re: N.C. Vasanthakokilam

Post by RSR »

ABOUT ALATHOOR BROTHERS:
"In fact, it was due to the efforts of Palani that they gave a concert in the Music Academy in the senior slot. Their concert followed the one by N.C. Vasanthakokilam at her peak and many wondered whether the brothers’ concert would click after the mellifluous concert of NCV It not only clicked but the brothers became a sensation in Madras (Chennai) and Palani’s mridangam support was a major factor in the success of this and several later concerts of the brothers.
(SOURCE) http://www.palanisubramaniapillai.org/m ... -page2.htm
-----------------------
' it was at this juncture that palani subramanya pillai used his good offices by obtaining an opportunity for them at the music academy in 1939. ' ( from 'carnatic summer' by Sri.V.Sriram. )

vasanthakokilam
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Re: N.C. Vasanthakokilam

Post by vasanthakokilam »

RSR, thanks for your diligent work in assembling a lot of NCV's songs in one place. I had a great time listening again to a few of my favorites of NCV

One surreal portion for me is in 'nI dayarAdA' the second kalapanaswara segment by the violinist (https://youtu.be/hgnn8jCAAdI?t=173 2:57). The violinist goes on their own and brings in quite a dreamlike flavor of vasanthabhairavi. Curious if anyone knows who the violinist is in that piece...

vasanthakokilam
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Re: N.C. Vasanthakokilam

Post by vasanthakokilam »

Let us fill out the raga names for the songs that do not have them yet. All, please confirm if what I have written below are correct and fill in the rest.

19. yArO vandennai - attana ( https://sites.google.com/site/ncvasanth ... o-vantenai )
21. kuzhalOsai - Kamas/Harikambhoji ? ( https://sites.google.com/site/ncvasanth ... -kulalocai )
22. vAsudEvan avaDariththAn - Mohanam, ??? ( https://sites.google.com/site/ncvasanth ... na-vijayam )
23. porumai kaDal - bilahari,nIlAmbari, Bhairavi, Shankarabharanam,.... (https://sites.google.com/site/ncvasanth ... hnavijayam )
25. iniYakilum manadE - mOhanam ( https://sites.google.com/site/ncvasanth ... lum-manate )
26. pAngAna sOlai - kApi ( https://sites.google.com/site/ncvasanth ... kana-colai )
28. AnDavanE - Shanmukhapriya ( https://sites.google.com/site/ncvasanth ... 8-antavane )
29. varuvAnO vanakkuyilE - kApi ( https://sites.google.com/site/ncvasanth ... anakkuyile )
30. Senthamizh Osai - dEsh ( https://sites.google.com/site/ncvasanth ... tamil-ocai )
31. Thillai Sthalam - sAmA ( https://sites.google.com/site/ncvasanth ... llaistanam )
32. udaya sundari - viruththam - Begada, Shanmukhapriya, mohanam ( https://sites.google.com/site/ncvasanth ... ya-cuntari )
33. bharathi pAttennum - behag ( https://sites.google.com/site/ncvasanth ... p-pattenum )
34. Arva thIyAl - viruththam - kAnaDa, Bilahari, hamasanandi, kApi ( https://sites.google.com/site/ncvasanth ... rvat-tiyal )
35. thithikkum senthamizh - Sankarabharanam, Mohanam ( https://sites.google.com/site/ncvasanth ... m-centamil )
38. Kalai vANi - Dhanyasi (https://sites.google.com/site/ncvasanth ... ul-purivay )
39. kadiravan udayam- Bilahari ( https://sites.google.com/site/ncvasanth ... ritas-film )
40. enadu uyir - Paras ( https://sites.google.com/site/ncvasanth ... ritas-film )

RSR
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Re: N.C. Vasanthakokilam

Post by RSR »

vasanthakokilam wrote:Let us fill out the raga names for the songs that do not have them yet. All, please confirm if what I have written below are correct and fill in the rest.

19. yArO vandennai - attana ( https://sites.google.com/site/ncvasanth ... o-vantenai )
21. kuzhalOsai - Kamas/Harikambhoji ? ( https://sites.google.com/site/ncvasanth ... -kulalocai )
22. vAsudEvan avaDariththAn - Mohanam, ??? ( https://sites.google.com/site/ncvasanth ... na-vijayam )
23. porumai kaDal - bilahari,nIlAmbari, Bhairavi, Shankarabharanam,.... (https://sites.google.com/site/ncvasanth ... hnavijayam )
25. iniYakilum manadE - mOhanam ( https://sites.google.com/site/ncvasanth ... lum-manate )
26. pAngAna sOlai - kApi ( https://sites.google.com/site/ncvasanth ... kana-colai )
28. AnDavanE - Shanmukhapriya ( https://sites.google.com/site/ncvasanth ... 8-antavane )
29. varuvAnO vanakkuyilE - kApi ( https://sites.google.com/site/ncvasanth ... anakkuyile )
30. Senthamizh Osai - dEsh ( https://sites.google.com/site/ncvasanth ... tamil-ocai )
31. Thillai Sthalam - sAmA ( https://sites.google.com/site/ncvasanth ... llaistanam )
32. udaya sundari - viruththam - Begada, Shanmukhapriya, mohanam ( https://sites.google.com/site/ncvasanth ... ya-cuntari )
33. bharathi pAttennum - behag ( https://sites.google.com/site/ncvasanth ... p-pattenum )
34. Arva thIyAl - viruththam - kAnaDa, Bilahari, hamasanandi, kApi ( https://sites.google.com/site/ncvasanth ... rvat-tiyal )
35. thithikkum senthamizh - Sankarabharanam, Mohanam ( https://sites.google.com/site/ncvasanth ... m-centamil )
38. Kalai vANi - Dhanyasi (https://sites.google.com/site/ncvasanth ... ul-purivay )
39. kadiravan udayam- Bilahari ( https://sites.google.com/site/ncvasanth ... ritas-film )
40. enadu uyir - Paras ( https://sites.google.com/site/ncvasanth ... ritas-film )
*************************************************************************************************************
Respected Sir, I was waiting eagerly for your participation. Thank you. My plan is to give the lyrics for all the songs along with ragam information and also as much additional information as possible( scrupupously avoiding 'gossip' items) . Sri. APKoil N Sapthagireesan has provided many links , Prof.Rajagopalan has offered to provide the lyrics and also ragam information ,one by one. Kindly take over and rope in all our ragam experts as well as thamizh poetry experts . and let us ensure that it becomes a fit tribute to that hapless singer. .
....A bit ambitious objective perhaps...but if Music academy can give posthumous award, does she not deserve it? Either from Thamizh Isai movement angle or service to literature by popularizing Yogi Suddhananda Barathi songs, Barathy songs, natioalistic , patriotic songs, devotional songs, classical songs of Dikshithar and Thyagaraja swami? in angelic voice? . many rasikas will agree that she deserves the highest honour when her hiden contributions are brought to light by diligent research.... concerts from 1939 to 1950 at Chennai and Nellai and also AIR concerts. Parama rasikas like shankar, SrintahK, Lakshmanji, Dr.Pasupathy, and many more will contribute readily under your leadership. Thank you and Best Regards

RSR
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Re: N.C. Vasanthakokilam

Post by RSR »

very happy to share
http://nostalgiaofcarnaticmusic.blogspo ... de-to.html .
"Following are the two articles appeared in a famous magazine Titled SRUTI , in its issue dated Auguse 15 2007: ".1)A GOLDEN VOICE Story by S. RAJAM on N.C. Vasanthakokilam, as told to S. JANAKI: N.C. Vasanthakokilam’s music career was short, but while it lasted, she was one of the topmost women vocalists in Carnatic music. Vasanthakokilam, or NC as she was popularly known, could sing with great felicity. She was gifted with a golden voice which was the envy of many a Carnatic musician. It was a voice with a rich and pleasant timbre, very pliant and malleable (“kambi pol saareeram”) which could accommodate briga-s and fast paced renderings, without any distortions (pisiru) or losing its melodious quality. She was not very healthy, but her voice belied her weak physique. Although she was thin and frail, her voice combined melody with tensile strength. I have heard her sing without a mike.NC was perfect in whatever she sang — intonation, sruti suddham, emotion and clarity of words. The purity of notes in her rendering and her adherence to sruti were remarkable. Her voice could traverse the middle and higher octaves with effortless ease. Her voice rang with vibrancy, a reenkaara, as she crossed the tara shadja and dwelt on the rishabha It is my impression that M.S. Subbulakshmi took NC’s music as a model. In the Simhendramadhyama kriti 'Unnai allaal verey gati', NC sang a number of sanchara-s above the panchama and in the tara sthayi. Listeners were astounded by her rendition of this Kotiswara Iyer composition. She would often take up niraval on the phrase “Kai mel palan arul deivamey”. The song was a great hit. Thanks to NC, this song gained in popularity and other musicians also started including it in their recitals. NC carried the music lovers along with her on the strength of her simple music and fine voice. Like MS, she too was guided by a Sadasivan. In this case Sachi, as he was better known, supported and assisted her but he was not a patch on the famous Sadasivam. I knew C.K. Sachi because he directed ‘Radha Kalyanam’ the second film in which I acted, for which the music was by Harikesanallur Muthiah Bhagavatar. Sachi took NC under his wing but she did not live long and succumbed to tuberculosis. We must be thankful that she has left behind many recordings through which her music lives on." (second article follows)https://sites.google.com/site/ncvasanth ... uthi-cover

RSR
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Re: N.C. Vasanthakokilam

Post by RSR »

Following is a copy of the Story by Sulochana Pattabiraman written for the issued dated 15th August 2007 of a house-magazine named SRUTI : Remarkable musical and emotional consciousness Sangeeta vidushi N.C. Vasanthakokilam truly had the voice of a “kokilam” combined with the magical quality of spring. She was a worthy member of a female musical triad — M.S. Subbulakshmi, D.K. Pattammal and N.C. Vasanthakokilam. Although nothing much has come to light about her novitiate and the guru-s who had moulded her inherent talent to performing levels, it cannot be gainsaid that she established a very special equation with the rasikas-s.

Her repository was overflowing with compositions of Tyagaraja, Muthuswami Dikshitar, Papanasam Sivan, Gopalakrishna Bharati, Subramania Bharati and other greats. Her raga alapana-s were marked with substance and style and studded with euphonious prayoga-s that immediately targeted one’s heart. Her kriti renderings had remarkable musical and emotional consciousness that lifted the ambience to an elevated plane. D.K. Pattammal had the reputation of being a laya virtuoso and a past master in the rendering of intricate nadai pallavi-s.

Once this writer heard Vasanthakokilam at a chamber concert rendering the inimitable Bhairavi varnam of Adiyappaiyer, set to Ata tala. The ease and fluency with which she negotiated the composition in various nadai-s left an everlasting imprint in the minds of the handful of rasika-s assembled. Among the rasika-s was the inimitable Alathur Venkatesa Iyer. Even he, the uncompromising great, gave a nod of approval after the rendering of the Viriboni varnam.
On another occasion, when she presented a concert at the Srinivasa Gandhi Nilayam, her delineation of Kambhoji in the three octaves held the audience captive.

Sarasadala nayana in Khamas, Mayetvamyahi in Tarangini, Sundari nannindarilo in Begada and the piece de resistance Tanthai taai irundal in Shanmukhapriya, were some of the sparkling gems in her vast repertoire. It is a pity that she crossed the great divide before her song could be adequately sung."(src: http://nostalgiaofcarnaticmusic.blogspo ... de-to.html

Pasupathy
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Re: N.C. Vasanthakokilam

Post by Pasupathy »


என். சி. வசந்தகோகிலம் - 1

வாடாத இசை தந்த வசந்தகோகிலம்!
வாமனன்
http://s-pasupathy.blogspot.com/2017/02/1_34.html

RSR
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Re: N.C. Vasanthakokilam

Post by RSR »

This wonderful song of Barathy rendered in BoopaaLam ( Pozhuthu Pularnthathu yaam seytha thavatthaal) by N.C.VASANTHAKOKILAM is very difficult to locate. Just now found that it is available in
http://www.worldcat.org/title/polatu-pu ... c/48858806
Can any of our esteemed members , access the library , download the song and share with me please? or post it in youtube and inform.

RSR
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Re: N.C. Vasanthakokilam

Post by RSR »

On the eve of Saraswathi Pooja today, may I share this gem of a poem by SUBRAMANYA BARATHY on SARASWATHI rendered by N.C.VASANTHAKOKILAM in mesmerizing and divine voice( 1947?) ? A ragamalika (Tilang, Beemplas, Kamaj). SAREGAMAE has donated this record to youtube. ( though the composer's name is shown wrongly as Suddhanandha Barathy..). The poem is in thamizh. For the benefit of those who cannot follow Thamizh, I am giving a gist ( not a translation..that is beyond my capabilities).
https://youtu.be/IxkyKHMzPJM
Thamizh original poem at
https://sites.google.com/site/ncvasanth ... 01-pillaip
-----------
" In my childhood days, I was enslaved by her charm . My mind did not like the school education. The vision of Sraswathi Devi seated in White-lotus, with Veena and shining face, enslaved me.
Coming back from school, in dancing steps,I would see her appearing in the street corner having a palm-leaf in hand and reading from it sweetly. If we approach her with devotion, She would teach many arts and wisdom, and make our lives sweet. But if we desire to learn everything, she would let go a mocking look in the eyes and leave.
Alone in a 'mandapam' in the river side, I was enjoying the breeze. She came then and gave me a poem. Receiving it with grateful joy, but when I asked her to be my constant companion in life.. she vanished with a gentle smile.
--------------------

rshankar
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Re: N.C. Vasanthakokilam

Post by rshankar »

piLLai pirAyattilE was discussed exhaustively a while ago - not just the verses on sarasvati Smt. NCV sings, but the ones on lakshmi and pArvati too.

RSR
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Re: N.C. Vasanthakokilam

Post by RSR »

rshankar-ji-> Thank you for the link to the earlier discussion. Barathy wrote three poems respectively on Saraswathi, Lakshmi and Durga. .. (Pillaippiraayatthile only is about Saraswathi) He takes poetic license. These goddesses are personification of Scholarship, Material prosperity and Valour. ..Traditionally and rightly so, our approach is one of veneration of these Goddesses. The three Goddesses are our Mothers. . Barathy also is of the same mindset in his poems on them. (ex) Nenjukku Neethiyum song by MS. ( it is a pity that it is barred by saregama/tube, globally!). Barathy is the last person in the world to bring in the idea of 'love' and 'matrimony' in the commonly understood sense with respect to Sacred Mothers like these Three. ... Personally, I fell in love with those three stanzas just due to the rendering by NCV and the ragams in the ragamalika., all my favourites. If I had not heard that , I would have turned away in revulsion, . It is just to turn our thoughts away from such association , interpretation and understanding of a nice poem otherwise , I avoided word by word translation. Frankly, whenever Barathy brings in the theme of 'love', he oversteps the limits of decency. . I venerate Barathy for his patriotic songs, and his 'Panchali Sabadham'
( https://sites.google.com/site/homage2ms ... -thum-haro
and a few other poems.

VVS Iyer a great Thamizh schoalr ( besides being a scholar in Sanskrit, Latin and Greek) admired Barathy for his Patriotic songs. 'In his words 'Akshara Laksham perum' songs. In the same introduction, he points out the above weakness of Barathy. Something like Jayadeva Ashtapathi. It is always safe to interpret the poem not too literally.
To reiterate , the song by NCV and not the full poem is my favourite.

vasanthakokilam
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Re: N.C. Vasanthakokilam

Post by vasanthakokilam »

RSR wrote: 29 Sep 2017, 14:50 On the eve of Saraswathi Pooja today, may I share this gem of a poem by SUBRAMANYA BARATHY on SARASWATHI rendered by N.C.VASANTHAKOKILAM in mesmerizing and divine voice( 1947?) ? A ragamalika (Tilang, Beemplas, Kamaj).
There is nIlAmbari between Tilang and BImplAs, right?
Also, what is the raga at the end starting at around 5:32 ? Anything? That sounded distinct.
Traditionally and rightly so, our approach is one of veneration of these Goddesses. The three Goddesses are our Mothers. . Barathy also is of the same mindset in his poems on them. (ex) Nenjukku Neethiyum song by MS. ( it is a pity that it is barred by saregama/tube, globally!). Barathy is the last person in the world to bring in the idea of 'love' and 'matrimony' in the commonly understood sense with respect to Sacred Mothers like these Three. ... Personally, I fell in love with those three stanzas just due to the rendering by NCV and the ragams in the ragamalika., all my favourites. If I had not heard that , I would have turned away in revulsion, . It is just to turn our thoughts away from such association , interpretation and understanding of a nice poem otherwise , I avoided word by word translation. Frankly, whenever Barathy brings in the theme of 'love', he oversteps the limits of decency
Of course it is your personal thing and I know it is all part of years of conditioning in conservative families and getting influenced by the opinions of great people (who have their own conditioning based on their environment and their elders ) so I am not trying to demean that position. I just want to convey the point of view that such casting of ideas on education and knowledge by anthropomorphizing Sarasvathi is deeply part of our culture and soaked in bhakthi of the utmost kind. He is by no means overstepping anything let alone any cultural standards of decency. He is operating very much inside the bounds of our culture. Of course that does not mean you need to like it or feel comfortable about it but there is nothing demeaning about Bharati's use of such memes.

kvchellappa
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Re: N.C. Vasanthakokilam

Post by kvchellappa »

Love is the most sacred of emotions and has been covered in our scriptures and puranas even with gods and goddesses with abandon. The prudish views are of later influence. Our poets and musicians are no exception and there is nothing to feel awkward about what is nature's unreserved gift.

RSR
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Re: N.C. Vasanthakokilam

Post by RSR »

@'Sri.Vasanthakokilam '-> I do not find any trace of neelambari as you mention and in the final (third) stanza i remember just kamaj . May be experts like Srinath and Varsha may be able to help
Conservative upbringing has nothing to do with my criticism of this particular poem by Barathy. When we carefully read the poem, the 'proposal' comes in second and third stanza only. and how we understand is left to our mental makeup I still hold the opinion that it is the reader who has to correctly understand and interpret the sentiment expressed and it is the poet's fault to have given scope for a 'common' interpretation . I dont think, in any decent society, mothers are objects of 'matrimonial proposal'. Even in the West? of Mother Mary about whom Barathy has given a poem(?)/ Let us revert back to Music
------------------
Can we trace NCV song of Koteeswara Iyer? Namakkal Kavigyar on Gandhiji ( sanga naadham ketkuthu) , Barathy song on Mother India ( Pozhuthu pularnthathu..Boopaalam )?
-----------------
NCV became famous right from 1938 ( ref: V.Sriram article on the 1938 music academy matters). She was 18 then. Her first or second film was with the renowned musician V.V.Sadagopan. ( Venuganam?) (1940). She must have definitely given great many concerts in Chennai and Nellai. and Tanjore areas during the decade 1940-1950.
Are there no veterans to give their reminiscences about her during the dacade? No one to share more songs by her than alkready given by saregama and others? Was she such an ' unmentionable' artiste? Has even Kalki given atleast an oblique reference to her, anywhere? It is puzzling. I am not talking about anything except her musical performances. How wonderful it would have been if MS and NCV had sung a few songs together for gramaphone company? ( something like 'Imaginary Conversations')
--------------------------

RSR
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Re: N.C. Vasanthakokilam

Post by RSR »

@k.v.chellappa-> Sir, I am completely out of touch with sanskrit originals and even thamizh translations of the great epics Valmiki Ramayana, Mahabaratham and of course Srimath Bagavatham. I dont think, of the thousands and thousands of lines there, there are many which speak of 'carnal' love explicitly. Our Thamizh classic Silappathikaram completely avoids such references even in the PukAr kAandam... We have some fine literary traditions... Of course, coarse minds, there always have been , like the creator of Devi Bagavatham, which would make even a western hippie blush at and our konark sculpture. Art is meant for uplifting the common people. Pure music ( even without lyrics as in HM classical, and later Western classical) , Architecture ( of Gothic school) have that potential. The less of visual or verbal voluptuousness, the better for Art. Also, less of Ego consciousness. .. All that apart, our cultural understanding of even family life is different from the focus on 'pleasure' but on social duty.(saha dharmini, dharma pathni) . If that is so even for normal gruhasthas, how much more so, the reverence should be to Mother Goddess? CNAnnadurai perhaops had a valid point in his 'kambarasam'' about descriptions of 'Sitha piraattiyaar.'.
'Carnal love' is just animal level. definitely different from Romantic bond and even Platonic love. ' Quoting a famous passage 'What the heart lifts above and the heavens reject not...The desire of the moth for the star , of the night for the morrow, the devotion to something afar from our sphere of sorrow'.
indian tradition is for the lady to pine for the Lord and not the other way round. Now.. pardon me for this 'literary' and 'cultural' detour. Let us talk of N.C.Vasantahkokilam's music.

CRama
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Re: N.C. Vasanthakokilam

Post by CRama »

RSR wrote: 03 Oct 2017, 16:09 @k.v.chellappa-> Let us talk of N.C.Vasantahkokilam's music.
Yes. NCV's music. It is much intriguing that we are not able to trace even a radio recording other than the large number of 78 rpm. records. I will like to share one of my experiences in searching for NCV concert. When I was in Mumbai, I acquainted with a person who was collecting music concerts. He gave me one concert labelled as NCV concert. When I heard it, it was M.S.Sheela's concert. The same person introduced me to another young techie in Chembur who told that he has got NCV concert. That person played lot of hide and seek with me and then I left him concluding that he is just befooling me.

Today only I happened to see the complete list of NCV records referred to in this thread. I could hear a few songs which I was not having. Thanks for taking the pains to collect them. Two songs from that list- one in Manirangu and another song could not be played. There is one song Sattileni which is in Poorvikalyani- composition of Ponniah Pillai. This seems to be from a radio or live concert as there is considerable difference in the voice texture and recording quality. Even this song is incomplete. The song is listed as Kasiramakriya and some lament that the pidis of this ragam has since been changed and it is told as Panthuvarali. Actually what is sung is Poorvikalyani as the song is presented by all the musicians. That may be edited.

vasanthakokilam
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Re: N.C. Vasanthakokilam

Post by vasanthakokilam »

RSR wrote: 03 Oct 2017, 15:44 @'Sri.Vasanthakokilam '-> I do not find any trace of neelambari as you mention and in the final (third) stanza i remember just kamaj .
Let us make sure we are all listening to the same link: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IxkyKHMzPJM

The initial instrumental prelude is Tilang. nIlAmbari is evident at 1:44 to 1:51 when singing 'ammA' isn't it? (https://youtu.be/IxkyKHMzPJM?t=103)

(btw, the first stanza following the musical interlude does not sound like Tilang)

RSR
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Re: N.C. Vasanthakokilam

Post by RSR »

@Sri.'vasanthakokilam'. Yes Sir. It is a rather complex musical composition, As I hum the song. I found similarity with other famous songs like 'Santhi Nilava vendum 'by DKP,'Shyamasundara' by MS, 'Yadhunandhana' by MS. and was struck by the unique rendering by NCV. of the stanza. perhaps not easy to set to music . Primarily the first stanza is Tilang and may have faint shades of the other ragam. ( I may be wrong). Similarly, the second stanza also is not anything like the usual bimplas. Again, due to difficulty in giving music to the poem's lines.That is why it has been very special song for me. As for the last stanza, after finishing, I find that it leads me seamlessly to 'apadhooru '. ! when humming. You are the better judge. I wonder who set it to music!

RSR
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Re: N.C. Vasanthakokilam

Post by RSR »

@CRama-> Respected Sir, I have been an avid follower of your posts. I liked your article in Sruthi on Smt.MS much. You had given a photostat copy. May I type it and place in my website for MS? ..
I am working on sites devoted to MS, DKP and NCV. . and just recently began a site for MLV songs. ( only the best). with lyrics and other information.(as prompted by Srinath and Varsha_ji ) The NCV SITE is yet to be brought to final shape. So difficult to get the lyrics as sung by her. correctly. Got diverted to DKP site.
Yes Sir, You are right. 'Sathilenu' upload is by Raju Asokan. and he opines that the raga mentioned by him is right. Panthuvarali, also is mentioned by some. Poorvikalyani may be the correct ragam. I have given the tube link in the page. I request you to add your comment in tube page so that other listeners can get a better idea. He has mentioned that it was a from an old tape. If there are other songs not in our list, they will be precious.
I did not want to miss any link to NCV , as the concerts are so rare to get as you have pointed out. That is why I have added it. Can improve gradually. .
Some of the pages are yet to be finalized. They may even be blank now. Lyrics have to be added.
I am all appreciation and amazement at your on-going project of writing about all the great artistes from Kerala, who reside and resonate in Kerala itself. Best Regards.

vasanthakokilam
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Re: N.C. Vasanthakokilam

Post by vasanthakokilam »

Primarily the first stanza is Tilang and may have faint shades of the other ragam.
Definitely get a second and third opinion and hopefully other members will pitch in but I do not think the first stanza is 'Tilang with a faint shades of other ragas'. I am going the other way. I hear Tilang in the instrumental prelude and not much after that.
But starting at 49 seconds, https://youtu.be/IxkyKHMzPJM?t=49
that is not Tilang, is it? It is somewhere in the complex of Nilambari, Shankarabharanam, may be wandering a bit into Harikambodhi, YKK (just a trace) etc.
Similarly, as I wrote above, starting at 1:44 nIlambari stamp is quite evident https://youtu.be/IxkyKHMzPJM?t=103

Others please chime in so we can conclude this without too much ambiguity

varsha
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Re: N.C. Vasanthakokilam

Post by varsha »

It is much intriguing that we are not able to trace even a radio recording other than
....
https://archive.org/details/NCVasanthak ... TyAgarAja-

CRama
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Re: N.C. Vasanthakokilam

Post by CRama »

Varsha, I can not thank you enough for the Emijesite. Had never heard a lengthy rendering by NCV. By any chance, do have you the rest of the songs in that concert. I am greedy when it comes to music. Pardon me.

varsha
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Re: N.C. Vasanthakokilam

Post by varsha »

Pl keep watching this space.
I will let you know when I have exhausted :D

RSR
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Re: N.C. Vasanthakokilam

Post by RSR »

Varsha_ji is GREAT. He will surely give us many more from concert pieces. Awaiting more from him.
---
I just want to share the moments in NCV classic 'pillaippirAyatthile'. ( whatever be the ragam). First stanza.
'veLLai malaranaimEl avaL veenaiyum kaiyum virintha mukamalar' . When she repeats the above lines, .
வெள்ளை மலரணைமேல்-அவள்
வீணையும் கையும் விரிந்த முகமலர்
வெள்ளை மலரணைமேல்-அவள்
வீணையும் கையும் விரிந்த முகமலர்
.wonderful

vasanthakokilam
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Re: N.C. Vasanthakokilam

Post by vasanthakokilam »

CRama wrote: 04 Oct 2017, 12:54 Varsha, I can not thank you enough for the Emijesite. Had never heard a lengthy rendering by NCV. By any chance, do have you the rest of the songs in that concert. I am greedy when it comes to music. Pardon me.
Indeed. Thanks Varsha.
The violin is sparkling as well, isn't it? Shadowing NCV excellently in an understated fashion to provide a wholesome listening experience. The high pitch violin tone is so clean.


RSR
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Re: N.C. Vasanthakokilam

Post by RSR »

Chennai Music season is approaching. and there will be many stalls opened during the festival where we can get very fine dvd/cd packs of all the greats in Carnatic music. May I share the information about a fine CD dedicated to wonderful songs by N.C.Vasanthakokilam? It contains the following songs. 1) yen paLLi kondeerayya ( mohanam)
2) mahAlakshmi jaganmAthA (sankarabaranam) 3) antharangamellAm ( vachaspathi) 4) pAmAlaikku iNai undo (harikambodhi)
5) needhayaraadhaa (vasanthabairavi) 6) sundari nannindarilo ( begada) 7) Anandha natanam AdinaaL ( kamboji) 8) sArasadhalanayanaA (KAMAJ) 9) yelAvathAramu (muhari) 10) Maaye ( Tharangini) 11) thanthai thaay irunthaal (shanmugapriya). It is a saregama release. CDNF 147 909 . Available from amazon(india) on line too. These are among the BEST by NCV.

varsha
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Re: N.C. Vasanthakokilam

Post by varsha »

http://www.mediafire.com/?nohu4q7ze0b3n

I have uploaded all available material on NCV . Would like tracks numbered 1,2 etc to be identified .
And corrections with others too are welcome.
thanks in advance

RSR
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Re: N.C. Vasanthakokilam

Post by RSR »

varsha_ji, Fantastic work. THANK YOU. I am beginning the work of identifying the numbered songs. Hope to complete the correct identification within a week. Top priority ,as I am hoping that I may find the songs that I have been longing to locate may be there. . ( andha naaL ini varumo ?...is a 'hamsanaadham ragam' ). the other ' named ' songs are in the vasanthakokilam site. https://sites.google.com/site/ncvasanthakokilam/home/10
Best Regards

RSR
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Re: N.C. Vasanthakokilam

Post by RSR »

quoting a para from SrinathK's post in another thread with approval
"Now let's look at NC Vasanthakokilam - listen to mAyE tvam yAhi at 17:50 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S1CkdJ9w9KY and with how much power she hits the upper N2 (M1 in madhyama shruti) in guruguhOdayE (it's almost like her voice explodes like TR Mahalingam's). If you pause and listen closely, there seems to be just a bit of strain on sudhA -- that's not strain, that's a register bridge. This is as good as it can ever get.
(voice range..thread)

RSR
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Re: N.C. Vasanthakokilam

Post by RSR »

varsha_ji, here are SOME song openings : 06 - யாரோ வந்தென்னை ஆசை காட்டி(yaaro vandhennai aasai kaatti)
07 - பாங்கான சோலை அலங்காரம் (paangaana solai alankaaram)
08 - பாரதி பாட்டெனும் பைந்தமிழ் (barathi paattenum painthamizh)
09 - குழலோசை கேட்குதம்மா (kuzhlosai ketkuthamaa).

varsha
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Re: N.C. Vasanthakokilam

Post by varsha »

RSR
Thanks Sir

RSR
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Re: N.C. Vasanthakokilam

Post by RSR »

varsha_ji , Just now went through the list . There are two or three Dhikshithar kruthis ( very likely to be concert songs). Very rare indeed. . ....(Nitthiraiyil vandhu nenjam kudi konda ' song is Jonpuri.) There are about six or seven songs which I see for the first time. The link to n.c.vasanthakokilam songs ( streaminjg and buying) on per song basis will be very useful to the diaspora
https://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_noss ... thakokilam
She has sung 'eppo varuvaaro' jonpuri in film with slight change in lyrics. 'Also
'a 78 rpm record of Barathy's poem doing the rounds now ' Asai mukam marandhu poache' in jonpuri.)(?) . There must be atleast 20 more records and many many concerts which we are on the verge of losing irrevocably . without people like you to retrieve them from the past . Keep up the GREAT WORK. ( I am plain RSR , no 'sir' needed)

RSR
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Re: N.C. Vasanthakokilam

Post by RSR »

The link http://www.worldcat.org/title/polatu-pu ... c/48858806 is for two great songs of Subramanya Barathy in 78 rpm record by N.CVasanthakokilam. a) pozhuthu pularnthathu yaam seytha thavatthaal. (ragam boopaaLam) b) paarukkulle nalla naadu . ( Pāratiyār; N C Vasanthakokilam; James Rubin Collection of Indian Classical Music.). Is it possible for any of our forum members residing in USA to get the mp3 and share?

RSR
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Re: N.C. Vasanthakokilam

Post by RSR »

very happy to share a rare find by varsha_ji of vintage NCV song ( composer Patnam Subramanya Iyer) entha nerchina (saveri) . https://sites.google.com/site/ncvasanth ... manya-iyer

CRama
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Re: N.C. Vasanthakokilam

Post by CRama »

RSR, The song Entanerchina is not playing.

RSR
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Re: N.C. Vasanthakokilam

Post by RSR »

@99-> CRama, Respected Sir, Excuse me for the lapse. I have just now created the link.
I am not sure if this is really NCV vintage (however, very likely to be). Kindly test the link in the page and let me know. I was confused by almost identical opening line 'entha nerchina' by Thyagaraja Swami and this song by Patnam Subramanya Iyer. There was confusion in the ragam also
https://sites.google.com/site/dkpattamm ... thyagaraja
( DKP enttha nerchina in Udhaya Ravichandrika ( as per sangeethapriya/ suddha dhanyasi)
and the NCV song in Saveri.
https://sites.google.com/site/ncvasanth ... manya-iyer
(picosong)
I am not sure. I need your help. I will take your help for a few more songs , magically unearthed and given by varsha_ji. ( one Todi song from a concert? and a few more ) Best Regards.

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