Meaning-caliyE kunjan

apsara · Post by **apsara** » 22 Aug 2007, 14:55

Dear rasikas, I need very detailed (word by word) translation of this song, help, please.
Thanks in advance.

caliyE kunjan
raagam: brindaavan saarang
taaLam: dEshaadi
Composer: Swaati TirunaaL
Language: Hindi

pallavi
caliyE kunjan mO tum ham mil shyAm hari
antara 1
dEkhO jamunA rE bahi sundar ati nIrbhari
(caliyE)
antara 2
chODiyE kaisE mOkun mai to tErO hAth dhari
(caliyE)
antara 3
suniyE kOyal kE bOl piyA kyA kahrI
(caliyE)

rshankar · Post by **rshankar** » 22 Aug 2007, 23:34

Apsara,
I know that vAkyArtha would suffice for kuchipuDi choreography, but here are both the padArtha and vAkyArtha.

caliyE = let us go
kunjan mE = into (mE) the garden (kunjan)
tum = you
hum = me/us
mil = together/after meeting
shyAm harI = Oh! krishNA

A young gOpI approaches the lord of vrindAvan, and says, Oh krishNA, let us go to the garden together.

dEkhO = see
jamunA = the river yamunA
rE = addressing krishNA (with an extreme degree of familiarity)
bahi = is flowing
sundar = pretty/beautiful
ati = excessively
nIr = water
bharI = filled will

Oh krishNA! see the beautiful river yamuna as it flows filled with/brimming with water! yamunA (per mythology) is the daughter of the sun god, sUrya and chAyA (the shadow of sUryA's first wife, sanjnA). She is the brother of yamA the lord of death and saNi (Saturn) the planet - as a river and a goddess she is described as being fickle - changing course at the drop of a hat, or, a plough (hala hati bhIti)....

chODiyE = please let go
kaisE = how
mOkun = NO CLUE need to check this word (could be mOhan)
mai tO = I
tErO = your
hAth = hand
dharI = hold

The ever mischevious krishNa tries to hold the gOpI's hands, making her aghast at this familiarity. She says, how can I hold hands with you in public and walk around this garden? People will misunderstand me, and my reputation will be in tatters. So, please, unhand me, mOhan! (The gOpI's are an interesting bunch - they couldn't live without krishNA on the one hand, and OTOH, they felt annoyed when he got too familiar with them - a concept that comes alive in Priyadarshini Govind's choreography of P. Tooran's 'toTTu toTTu pESa varAn, kaNNan').

suniyE = please listen
kOyal kE = cuckoo's
bOl = song/words
piyA = loved one
kyA = what
kehrahI = is saying

The gOpI diverts krishNa's attention to that of a cuckoo who is singing the eternal song of love - and says, listen! do you hear what that cuckoo is saying?

apsara · Post by **apsara** » 23 Aug 2007, 00:10

plenty of thanks!!!

arasi · Post by **arasi** » 23 Aug 2007, 02:35

ravi,
mOknA=abandon, relinquish (KaisE ChodUn?)
Could that rE be like arE? She uses bahu vacan later--suniyE. Normally, one comes across singular 'tum' while addressing krishNA. Just wondering...

rshankar · Post by **rshankar** » 23 Aug 2007, 05:20

Arasi,
mOk could mean that, but mOknA - the grammar doesn't make sense...but you could be correct...if that is the case, then, instead of complaining about the world objecting to seeing them hand in hand, the gOpI actually wants her hand to stay in the lord's (cei paTTi viDuvaka......)

arasi · Post by **arasi** » 23 Aug 2007, 08:43

Ravi,
You know that my hindi isn't as good as yours! So I looked it up and mOknA is also there as a verb in Bhargava's dictionary.
And arE? I would think it is just a filler word since the rest of the addresses are in bahu vacan (plural). chODiyE, suniyE. Or, it is just arE! (as in arE bAbA!). An expression directed at no one in particular. ..

ram · Post by **ram** » 23 Aug 2007, 09:48

mOkUn could mean "me" (mujhE/ mujhkO). choDiyE kaisE mOkUn = how can you leave me = mujhE (mujhkO) kaisE choD saktE hO

My guess is that the line "chODiyE kaisE mOkUn mai to tErO hAth dhari" conveys a different meaning, i.e., How can you leave me when I have held your hand?

Rajani · Post by **Rajani** » 23 Aug 2007, 18:01

Ravi : Nice translation.

The "koyal" ( also called "papiha") is said to call out asking "piyu kahan" ( where is my beloved?) . Interestingly in Sanskrit the cuckoo is called "pikaH", sounding similar to "piyu kahan".

I learnt a version from Sri MO Srinivasan which goes
"suniyE kOyal kE bOl piyA piyA piyA kahrI"

rshankar · Post by **rshankar** » 23 Aug 2007, 19:41

Rajani,
Thanks!
Nice explanation of papiha...(or should I say, bol(E) rE papIhara?)
I was planning on asking your opinion on mOkun. I think Ram's meaning is a colloquial usage, but both Ram and Arasi's translations can lead to interesting interpretations for choreography!
Arasi,
I am by no means an expert in Hindi - it just happens to be one of the Indian languages that I love and have studied in school and am familiar with the script, some rules of grammar, and have a half-way decent vocabulary. These experiences are educational exercises for me.

arasi · Post by **arasi** » 23 Aug 2007, 19:51

The same here but you are in upper grade! Nice to see Ram chipping in. Rajani as always is very good at this...

kmrasika · Post by **kmrasika** » 24 Aug 2007, 17:11

Please also listen to a nice rendition by DR B Arundhati, disciple of Dr K Omanakutti @: http://www.swathithirunal.in/htmlfile/48.htm.
The composition is in bhOjpuri, probably a derivative of Hindi.

Rajani · Post by **Rajani** » 25 Aug 2007, 09:45

I think the meaning of "chOdiye.." is "please leave my hand, for how can I relinquish it myself" ie she wants to Krishna to release her hand as she cannot bring herself to do it.

vgvindan · Post by **vgvindan** » 25 Aug 2007, 11:43

IMHO 'mOkun' would mean mujhE - me - kabIr uses this word in one of his dOhas.
chODiyE kaisE mOkun - How could You Leave me?
main tO tErE hAth dhari - I have held (caught hold of) Your hand.

jO tum tODO piyA main tO nahin tODUn - mIra sings.

vgvindan · Post by **vgvindan** » 25 Aug 2007, 15:50

H मो mo [Ap. Prk. महु, gen.=S. मम, gen. of asmad; but also used for S. मां and मत्, the acc. and abl. of asmad], pron. obl. (Braj, or dialec.) Me (i.q. mujh);--of me, my (i.q. merā):--mo-pai or mo-paiṅ, On or upon me (i.q. mujh-par);--by me, in my possession (i.q. mere-pās):--mo-ten, or mo-toṅ, From me (i.q. mujh-se):--mo-rā, moro, morau, morauṅ, Of me, my, mine (i.q. merā):--mo-so, mo-soṅ, mo-sau, mo-sauṅ, From me, by me (i.q. mujh-se);--like me (i.q. mujh-sā):--mo-sam, Like me (i.q. mujh-sā, or mere samān):--mo-kar, Of me, my, mine (i.q. merā; see kar):--mo-kauṅ, mo-kau, mo-koṅ, mo-ko, mo-kāṅ, mo-kā, To me; me (i.q. mujh-ko; mujhe):--mo-hi, To me; me (i.q. mujhe);--mo-hi, or mo-hī, Me indeed; to me truly, &c. (i.q. mujh-hī).

H धरना dharnā [dhar˚ = Prk. धर(इ)=S. धर(ते) 'place,' and धर(ति), 'seize,ʼrt. धृ], v.t. To place, put, put down, deposit, lay, lay down; to pledge, stake; to put on, apply; to put (to), apply (the mind, or ear, &c.), to keep (at);--to have (in the hand), to hold, lay hold of, clutch, grasp, gripe, seize, to hold fast or pertinaciously; to take; to assume; to keep, retain; to catch, seize, apprehend, give in charge; to take (a side), espouse (a cause), entertain or hold (an opinion); to have, possess, hold, own, occupy, take possession of; to acquire, receive, obtain:--dhar-denā, v.t. (intens.), To put down, set or lay down; to pledge, stake, &c. (=dharnā):--dhar-rakhnā, v.t. To put aside, put by, lay by; to keep, retain, take care of:--dhar-lenā, v.t. (intens.) To lay hold of, take hold of, grasp, seize (=dharnā):--dhar-ghasīṭnā, v.t. To drag off or away by main force; to pull or haul away.

ram · Post by **ram** » 25 Aug 2007, 16:33

I think the meaning of "chOdiye.." is "please leave my hand, for how can I relinquish it myself"

IMHO, chOdiyE doesn't have such an elaborate meaning. As rshankar says, it just means "let go" or "leave". All the additional words that have been added in English above will come only if such Hindi words come along with chODiyE or if the context leads to such a meaning.

I might be wrong here but what has been done in some translations attempted here is simply collecting all the word by word translations together but the way the words are stitched together in Hindi has been left out. The sentence in (old?) Hindi is constructed differently and I agree with what Shri vgvindan says.

"mai tO tErO hAth dhari" means "I have held your hand", not "you have held my hand". So whoever is addressing Krishna is telling him that (s)he has held Krishna's hand. If Krishna had held the person's hand, it would have been "tum tO mErO hAth dhari".

So the person seems to be saying "How can you leave me when I have held your hand?"